Gold and Its Supposed "Store of Value"

In a complete breakdown of society gold & silver won't be worth anything, since there won't be an exchange where people can agree on a price and there won't be any practical use for precious metals. Likewise, farm land ownership will be worthless, since nobody will respect documents in a defunct recorder's office. If you see some land you like then occupy it, and be prepared to defend it.

But people with enough bullets & beans to trade will be wealthy, if they don't get killed for their wealth first.

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There are so many possible scenarios it's impossible to prepare for all of them, but it's pretty safe to say government of some kind will always be with us. Like in other countries, in troubled times government sets exchange rates, but also like other countries those rates hardly ever reflect day to day commerce. For instance, in Venezuela Maduro set the exchange rate at 6.4 Bolivars to the dollar, but in reality the black market exchange rate is 163, nearly 25 times that of the official rate. There, precious metals are the only store of wealth possible.

If, on the other hand, government completely loses control of the economy PMs will find their level of value through individual commerce, just as they did prior to paper money. One reason I like junk silver is its recognizable denominations, whereas bullion may be difficult to use unless whoever you're trading with has a way to make change.

County governments sets property taxes. Any County government that raised taxes to match an inflation rate would be hanging from lamp posts before the sun went down. In an era with 500% inflation, no employment, with nearly everyone broke, it would be seen as a land grab. They could very well pass local legislation allowing property taxes to be paid in precious metals, or gemstones for that matter.

As others have said, precious metals are only useful after other needs are met, being a reasonably safe storage of wealth no matter the condition of paper dollars.

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One thing I notice through out these types of discussions is the assumption, by some, the world will go completely Mad Max, and the only valuable things will be food, water and ammo.

While that certainly COULD happen, and one should assume/prepare for the worst case if they can, the more likely case is this:

A continuation of the long, slow slide we have experienced for our lifetimes. Personally, I though there was NO WAY the government could survive Ronald Regan. He came into office with a national debt around 900 billion, and left 8 years later having tripled it to 2.7 trillion. WOW.....nobody before, or after, has managed that as a percentage. I though we were DOOMED.....ahahahaaaaa.....now it's 18 trillion.

I know, as a mathematical certainty, that at some point the interest on the debt will consume every single penny of income, and surely then, it will be over.....surely.....

But that day could well be a long way off. They have managed to put it off much longer than I thought the world would accept. One explanation is "everybody is doing it".

SO, lets assume they keep on destroying the value of the currency at some pre-planned rate, AND it doesn't get away from them AND enough of our trading partners keep allowing it. Gold and silver are going to shine in this situation. Don't think so ? Stick a one ounce coin and 1200 paper dollars in a cookie jar, and come back in 20 years to see the results.

If it comes down to food is everything, that makes sense. I don't see it ever getting to that point. I'd rather sell a few ounces of gold than a few hundred bushels of beans...merchandising is a lot of work.

The end of the world is in sight. I agree with Nevada on most of this post. Owning land is not worthless. You can prepare for the coming meltdown by building fortifications, planting orchards, enhancing the ground for growing food, and as a place to store your beans and bullets.

If you want to wait until the meltdown and then seize some land, you will have to quickly build a shelter from the winter and store food to survive. You will have to go through the learning curve to figure out how to grow your own food and hunt. Good luck with that.

During a previous partial meltdown, the great depression, most of the folks that owned their own small farms debt free were able to sell some of what the produced, or had on hand, to pay the property tax. They may have been poor but they had a warm place to sleep and food to eat.

A current partial meltdown will probably result in hyper inflation and the complete devaluation of the dollar (see the Wiemar Republic). Most people will go bankrupt because they have so much debt they won't be able to pay it off. The value of PM will follow because few will want to trade food for something you cannot eat.

Those who are debt free, have an excess of useful goods, and a place to live are the ones that will be OK. They will be good even if the entire world economy reverts back to the dark ages. They do need to defend what they have from the feudal gangs that will arise.

In 1878 a silver dollar was worth a dollar, probably 2 hours pay at best, today its worth $12.85, ten years ago it was worth about $3, not much for stored value. Oldhat, the DOW changes with the times but doesn't cherry pick to make it look better. In 1915 it had two steel stocks, a rubber, a leather, copper and a smelter and it started the year around 55, or two oz of gold. If you put that two oz in your pocket, you would still have it 100 years later, if you invested it, it would be worth a new car and worked to create wealth and jobs for the last 100 years. When silver hits $35, I think a lot of stackers will be turning silver into paper, and whistling all the way to the bank. All that said, I love the way it sounds, looks and feels.

You are assuming a complete break down scenario. Then yeah, sure, there may not be gold brokers. But just because we enter a depression and an economic collapse, doesnt mean everything disappears. Like others have said, government isnt going anywhere, and there were gold brokers during the deepest depths of the great depression.

Safe to say that if there are taxes, if there is a government, if there is "legal tender", then there are probably still financial markets and prices are set there, there must also be brokers to facilitate buying and selling.

If everything collapses, total civilization, no markets, no government, no taxes. Then you dont have to worry about paying your property tax. But in every other scenario all of your beans will be worthless as they rip you violently from your home. How many beans can you carry around with you as they shuttle you from FEMA camp to FEMA camp?

Absolutely. And lets suppose even that the debt does over take income and the dollar collapses. Who says that's the end of government? Maybe the government defaults, the value of the dollar plummets and they reset to another currency, possibly a world currency like the SDR. In that scenario all of your savings, in dollars, are worthless or will be traded in for the new currencies at a fraction of its previous value.

During the collapse and shift, alot of people will fall through the cracks. having some gold could help people keep their heads above water.

after reading this thread and doing a lot of thinking,if shtf bigtime?your better off buying less precious metals and buy more lead.this world is nuts and getting worse every day.whether u invest in gold/silver/land-u better have enough lead to defend it.rant over.

Yup bigjon, anything you are hoarding for your B-B gun is now considered, by our friendly dic-tator, to be "precious metals". . . . . . .

Just when will the confiscation attempt of all "precious metals" begin.......????????

Not even close. Cowboys, for example, earned a "dollar a day, and found"....found being lousy food and a bunkhouse cot.

The average 60hr weekly 1880 wages for:

Blacksmith: $15.54 (26 cents/hr)
Carpenter: $16.56
Machinist: $13.62
Laborer: $8.10

http://outrunchange.com/2012/06/14/t...-through-1890/

Yep no older than I am I remember $5.00 per day being a top wage .

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Sure, my grandfather bought a 5 acre waterfront cottage in 1950 for 5k, and felt he overpaid ( probably did ).

Well - I'm loading up on guns and bullets - so when things really get bad and they run out of food they will be coming over to your place and get it - they will take your food and your gold and anything else they think they want - if you live in the country you have a much better chance to survive - if you live in town you are up s---- creek - unless you are counted among the theys -

In long run I say - don't worry about it - I had a cousin who was buying gold to head off any disaster in the furture - he accumulated a lot of gold - wasn't married and had no kids - he's been dead for about 10 years now -

I'm not sure what the message about your cousin might be. Guns & bullets aren't going to do you any more good than gold if you die before your time. You can't invest for the future with the attitude that you might not live long enough to see your investments appreciate.

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And if you cant pay your taxes they'll take your farm, and there goes your food and bullets. Round and round we go with this discussion.


Can't eat gold but can't grow or store food with no land. Its a chicken and egg type scenario.

In a complete breakdown of society land ownership will be by occupation and show of force, not by legal document. Your deed isn't going to impress anyone when there's no law and no county recorder's office.

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Excellent point that is usually overlooked. I see a dollar collapse almost certainly leading to more government, not less.

Going off the grid is a big investment. But One I am glad we made. We took most of our money out of the stock Market. To Buy land and build off the grid.
It cost a bunch. What price does one put on freedom?
30,000$ buys a lot of solar these days. A few more years left for the 30% tax credit, which helps a whole lot. I love not paying taxes to the feds.
In our area I figure that 30,000$ investment in off grid systems is now equal to about a 300$ a month electric bill. I do not think there are a lot of similar investments (low risk) in wall street that will pay a 300$ mo dividend.
The best part, when the market crashes my electric company is mine I own it and it is not going down in value and neither are your electric bills.

Junk silver is the metal I prefer. When ( I quit using if) shtf everyone will reckognize dimes quarters and silver dollars.
I think gold will attract to much attention