Inheritance Land/Home

Yes and maybe ask around to make sure you have a lawyer that is very good at real estate law. The one I used here was equal to the best on that was retiring so he really was the number one best. Years later that served me well because the farmers that own the property next to me tried to claim some of my land.
I built this house when they had sunflowers planted in the field. Then they planted cherry trees and they planted too close to my line. My survey showed me I owned 15 feet out into that field so that is where I put my fence and we tore out the old cedar posts and barbed wire fence. A year later they planted too close to my fence to be able to get a shaker in to that row of trees. It wasn't any problem for several years until it came time to shake the trees. For the next two years they had people hand picking that row of trees then that next year they pulled my fence and tried to claim that 15 feet. It don't work that way. I sicked the law on them for pulling my fence posts and the next day put them back up perfectly 2" inside my line and strung wire on them.
Then I got a letter from their lawyer saying they had a claim to that and demanding I take the fence down. I took it to my lawyer who laughed and set them a letter. When I had the survey done and put my fence out there if they had pulled it right then and went after claiming that 15 feet of my property they would have got it with no problem. Six years later there was no question who owned that 15 feet. They had to pay me for putting my fence back up.

The property was passed to the grandson upon the grandmother's death 25 years ago, WITH the stipulation that his mother could stay there as long as she lived. When his mother dies, NOTHING needs to be probated because the property is ALREADY his.

And all THAT is assuming his grandmother had a will, and it went through probate. If neither occurred, anything goes!

Get a lawyer, preferably the one his grandmother used.

Mon

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As I thought, but wanted to make sure.

The property should be in your friends name, and he ultimately responsible for property taxes, etc, back when grandmas estate was settled.

Mom has an easement on the land, more or less, as long as she is alive. But the nursing home, etc can't come take the property as it should belong to your friend on the deed.

There will be very little tax or paperwork when mom passes, as the property should already be in your friends name.

I would check that this was done proper back when grandma passed, because if your friend has questions now, it sounds like maybe something didn't happen right back then? Your friend should know that the stuff is already his, in his name, if he is on top of this.... Would be much easier to straighten out now if there is any small chance something isn't right, with mom alive and agreeable, then after her passing. A couple $100 with a property lawyer would go a whole long way to avoid problems later, since there is any question at all now? Now mom can sign stuff and get paperwork right; after her passing if there are any questions the govt steps in does what it thinks is right, not what previous generations whispered they wanted.

Likely everything is fine and on track and there is nothing to do or worry about, if an 'irrevocable living trust' was set up. Sounds like that is what he is dealing with, and it was designed exactly to avoid tax and claw-back issues for multiple generations.

Paul

The more I think about this the more I wonder if the paperwork done back then is not what is being described at all. What if 25 years ago Grandma really put the farm into her daughter's name and expressed her wishes that it would be passed to your friend. Just what we are all saying. Tell him to read the paperwork and go see a lawyer with his Mom.
This is the only sensible action for him.

We straddle the fine line of offering advice that is on topic, and going off on a tangent, and assuming stuff that wasn't said.

Like Rustiholic, I wonder what was done 25 years ago, and so would be wise to check it out with someone familiar with the local and state laws.

You are describing an "irrevocable trust" but if the youngest generation has no clue and doesn't realize they already own the property and the middle generation says it should get cleared up; that does raise a lot of questions as to what was really -done- vs what was just said in passing years ago.

Paul

If Grandma willed the land to him 25 years ago - its a done deal.
Mom just had the right to live there, nothing else.
He should have taken possession 25 years ago.

I would certainly read the paper work from 25 years ago and if necessary have a lawyer read it.

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Easy enough to figure out just go to the court house look up the paper work that is on record and make copies . Here they charge very little for copies and anyone can do it . If it shows the deed in his name and mom with life rights leave it be don't muddy the waters

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He already owns it, if this is accurate. It's actually a really good idea - I'll have to use this in a few decades.

Unfortunately it's not a done deal until after probate. Willing real property almost always requires a lawyer and estate administration of some sort. That going to cost money and take time. It's just an unnecessary hassle.

A better solution to accomplish the same thing is to execute a quit claim deed naming herself as owner for her life, then leave it to the son. Assuming that the mother's name is Mary Jane Doe and the son's name a John Q. Doe, she would word the grantee like this:

Mary Jane Doe for the life of her, then a vested remainder to John Q. Doe

Doing that won't require probate or any other kind of court intervention. It's possible that the deed already says something similar, in which case the grandmother's will is now irrelevant.

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He has a copy of the deed/papers---its willed to him with his Mother a Life-time-right. Its his mother that was thinking she would like to get her life time right off it--Personally I don't see where that is needed, but she wants everything done while she is living.

This was a fair size eatate where there was several family menbers in the will---Most all The Grandmothers kids were alcholics so she willed almost everything to her grandkids----giving her kids a life-time-right. She felt her Kids would throw it away and one of her sons did---he talked his son into signing his ownership on some of the property and he signed his life-time away----they both walked out the lawyers office with their own land to do what they wanted---That son of the "Grandma" sold his part and was broke in a few months. The Grandma knew he would throw it away if he could get his hands on it----guess she did not know they could each sign and he could get some free and clear.

Grandmothers will was very relevant, and should have been followed 25 years ago.

A poorly worded quit claim document could make things worse and very drawn out. Don't do that on your own. You do not want to mess with an irrevocable trust or similar structure, nor create a paper trail suggesting mom has any extra claim on the property this is very bad advice. Just the act of mom giving up rights she really doesn't have can open up a mess of problems here, until all that would get settled out.....


1. Look in courthouse for records of what was done with the estate 25 years ago, who -owns- the property. Be sure the will was followed and all the paperwork was done back then. Be sure what is said now is actually how it happened 25 years ago. The grandchild needs to be named on the deed, either as owner currently, or as the beneficiary of a trust the property is in.

2. Get advice from a local estate attorney if it doesn't add up, or things were left hanging. Sounds like this was a complicated family deal, and it is very easy for the property transfer to never happen, the property might well still be owned by "grandmas estate" and if mom kept paying the property taxes the State will not really care, no difference to them. This would be bad for the grandchild and should be straightened out. Sooner, not later.

3. Don't try to do something 'simple' and create a set of paperwork that makes it more confusing. If both sides understand the current arrangement correctly and wish to change it, do so with an estate attorney that will do it properly to keep the State out of it. The tiny details are -very- important to the state, you don't want to just start generating a new paper trail. That would be bad.

Again, voice of experience, I'm sure many others have stories we would rather not share in public........

Those 3 steps are very important to this grandchild.

Paul

If thats the case then there's nothing left to do. This has already been left to him and his name is on it and he pays taxes on it.
I also agree, her having a life time right to use the property shouldnt matter to him at this point.

Sounds like the mother wants to "clean things up" before she dies so everything is easy for her son. Commendable, but it probably would be better to let things ride as they are at this point.

If it were me, I'd go to the court house and get a copy of Grandmother's probated will, if they still don't have the original paperwork at home (we never throw things like that out in this house). I'd do it just to satisfy myself of what's going on. It might placate mother if she sees that something is being done to make the transfer easier when she goes.

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I'm still not clear about this. Is the property willed or is it deeded? If the grandmother's will for the property has been committed to deed then why does the will matter now?

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I have a feeling the feeling that no one is for sure, or if every thing was even properly completed.

At this point a few dollars spent on a lawyer just to know what has went on may well be worth the time and money if for nothing else but peace of mind.

I think at this point I would spend a few minutes at the county recorder's website to see how the property is currently deeded.

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Well, don't screw it up! LOL

There's a trust?

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"Lifetime right" means the mother could live on the property as long as she lives. It does not mean she can live off the property and rent it to others and keep the rent. That rent money should have gone to your friend, not his mother. I have a feeling your friend did not have the will executed (probated?) or whatever needed to be done 25 years ago. My suggestion is for him to get an attorney quick, so this potential mess can be cleaned up before his mother dies. If there were inheritance taxes to be paid 25 years ago, the penalties might be daunting and he might need some of the rent money that his mother has been keeping.

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I'm not sure what "lifetime right" means, but I think we're talking about a "life estate" in this thread. A life estate is a way of granting ownership right on real property for the life of a person, then having the property ownership revert to another person at death.

In a life estate she has full ownership rights. She can elect to live or not live on the property. She can also develop the property any way she likes, lease it out, or even sell it if she pleases.

During a life estate the person named to receive the property after death has no ownership rights during the life estate, and would have no claim to the property if the person with the life estate decides to sell before her death.

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As stated before----this went through a lawyer/probate because there were several people in the will, several with only Life time rights to the property---Its a Done deal. The Mother has a life-time right to do what ever she wants---she can even sell the timber on it if she wanted---she can not sell it though without the friend agreeing and they both sign papers.

Its not whether the friend owns it or not---he does and has papers to prove so----its her Life time right----she/he never payed any inheritance tax on it and she was wondering if when she dies or gives up her lifetime right----will he have to pay inheritance tax then??? She was thinking being there was none payed after the Will was done that maybe the tax is due when her life-time was over---either death or giving up her right. Thats the question?

The Will was probated years ago! Everyone got what was left in the Will to them---some have sold their part.