Portable and window AC questions

An 8000-10,000 btu window or portable unit is going to take an entire 15 amp outlet, nothing else can be on it.

They can somewhat help out 900 square feet.

So, if you have 2 electrical circuits available with nothing else on them, with outlets in useful places, you can get 2 of the units and sort of help your building.

The trouble is, they will be a bit noisy, and they will not really make your building feel good, only help some, and you will be very lucky if you can find 2 available unused electrical circuits! Only so much power can go down a wire, and these units will use the entire wire, don't try to share.....

So, you will spend some money, up your utility bill, and go from too hot, to still uncomfortable but noisier.....

Will that bring you more customers, will it make their experience better, or will it be a bandaid that really doesn't accomplish anything? If you were a family business working in the building, then even just one small window unit would make your family feel a tad better..... But for a general public customer experience, going from miserable to barely tolerable really does not make the customer feel better, if you know what I am saying? The customer is either pleased or annoyed by the heat and humidity, you don't gain much by getting somewhere in between........


A good well sized air conditioner, and an electrician, get some price estimates, and see if a comfortable, quiet, nice environment will pull in enough more business to pay for that relatively low investment?

I have no experience and no idea of what your lease deal is, but such an installation is a modification of the building, and would need a review of the lease, what you can do, or what you can work out. Perhaps the landlord would work with you, share the costs if you agree to leave the air conditioner when you leave, and they raise the rent a small amount for assuming a bigger chunk of the cost of the unit. This would help you afford it, while getting the benefits of a better customer experience. Your landlord would have a better asset as his building - your portion of it - would be worth more to you or the next tenant. That would be a win win cost share.

I understand some tenant landlord relationships do not work that way, but if there is a way to discuss this and present the benefits for both of you, that would be your best $$$ option.

The 110 units won't quite do it, and you can't do a major building improvement of a 220 big unit on your own in a rental situation as that is a major permanent improvement.

Not sure I offered you any help at all! but something's to think on?

Paul

Giant fans and a mister. Keep the door closed.
Do nights get cold? You can open all the windows at night, stick in fans to suck in that cold air. Then right before it starts to heat up outside, close all the windows. I do that with my house, stays 70 all day long unless it gets to 90 outside.

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I don't know what the size of your building is or how it is made which makes a great difference. The newer A/C units are vastly different from the ones 20 or 30 years ago.

Although we have central air, it is very expensive to operate as our utility raises its rates in the summer. We decided to try a 110 volt unit to keep the bedroom cool but didn't have much hope as the huge 220v volt window units we had been accustomed to back in the 70's and 80's would hardly cool even a large bedroom on a hot July day.

I installed it in the bedroom and it will freeze a person out if I leave it on high. In fact, it will cool half the house better than our central air will the whole house. For those who think my central air unit has a problem, it is only a few years old, and after I got the 110 unit, I thought maybe it was having a problem since it did not seem to be working as well considering the size. I had a tech come out and he said it was fine. Part of the problem is that the duct work loses a lot of cool air in the basement.

Still, I was amazed at how much better the window units are than the used to be. Oh yeah, it is a recognizable brand we bought at Walmart.

The real problem I think will be the loss of the cool air with people coming in and out the door often; and if it is not often, then you probably aren't doing enough business.

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Since funds are limited you cannot afford to do it wrong then have to do it again with different equipment. An electrician will not charge you a lot to run a 220 (assuming the service has the capacity left).

Please get advice from someone who can visit the building and knows heating and air. Call a company and see if you can get a free estimate. You will at least get the requirements as they see them.

Up until this year, we used a central evaporative (swamp) cooler for our 1800 sq ft house, but with vents to a couple smaller rooms kept closed off. It was miserable during the 2-3 high humidity monsoon months late summer, though. Our windows aren't set up at all right for window units, so eventually we went with a 10K btu portable Everstar (10+ amps approx not counting a starting surge?) to make our main bedroom, at least, comfortable even though we also kept the central cooler going mostly for circulation. The portable was fine for that limited application. A couple things to keep in mind: 1) A 10k btu portable will only have the net effect of perhaps a 6 btu window unit due to the heat lost back out into the room especially along the vent duct tubing, the lower the distance from a window or other vent, the more efficient the portable will be. We wrapped as much of the duct tube length as possible with blankets and sleeping bags to insulate it and reduce that leakage back into the room, which did seem to help a lot. 2) With a portable in a humid environment, it'll have some sort of water condensation collection rigging that you have to tend to. The Everstar has a maybe one gallon internal collection bucket with an automatic cutoff lever that cuts power when the bucket is close to being full; you can easily run the condensation tube to a larger external bucket, or even a drain line, but then there's no shut-off function. In the highest humidity periods, we seemed to generate some 12 gallons a day of condensation.

I liked the Everstar model enough *for this limited usage* that we eventually bought two more when we saw them at thrift shops for $50-$75 each used including some of the ducting. The first one's electronics died on us (internal circuit breaker keeps throwing) so we just plugged in "unit B" which along with "C" is in a storage shed in case our present central AC goes on the fritz.

I'd definitely suggest this at your entrance/exits, to keep the air cooler by sectioning the air conditioned area off... Even if you are cooling most of the 2,000 sq feet.

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Yes the window units have gotten a whole lot better then years ago. 15,000 BTU ones now that run on 110.
Of course all they are doing is running the compressor at a higher speed then years ago thats the difference. But 15K BTU is a pretty good sized 110 unit.

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Ooops - my mistake. Oh...I am sorry. Please don't anyone be too awful mad at me. But...I made a mistake about the square footage. It is not 2,000 feet. It is only 1,206 sq. ft. My husband told me it was 2,000 but that did not seem quite right so I measured and then looked at the lease too. Sorry.

I did find an electrician to come out tomorrow and "look see." Since I have the three big refrigerators in here, plus hot afternoon sun and no way to shade things, then I might still need to run the 220 line and get a quieter bigger AC.

Hello Paul (Rambler) - I always like to hear your advise. You are right about the customers. Good points and yes, it is important to consider how customers will feel shopping in the space. Although we are a "farmers market site" in the back, the front of the shop is a gathering spot and we even host dinners and birthday parties.....so it does need to be quiet and cool. Good points.

Thank you everyone. I still think a 110 in the back might work but a 220 line ...that does not cost too much would work better.

Thank you.

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If you've only got 1200 square feet, you might just be able to use a couple of those small window units. You still need to make sure you're not overloading circuits (ours can't be on at the same time as the microwave, for example), but you might luck out.

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~*~Erin~*~
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if you do get a portable or window unit i suggest putting a fan directly in front of them, often they get cold enough they just dont move the air enough to make full use of that temperature change.

also look to your insulation, is there anything at all you can do to up it? hard foam sheets against the walls? especially the wall you share with the bakery? i realize its a rental place so your options are limited but as a hvac tech myself i can safely say that the difference between needing a 10 ton (120,000 btu) light commercial unit and a little 8,000 btu window unit is almost always just insulation, also if you (or your landlord) do decide to get something done professionally, properly insulating the building should be a lot cheaper than putting in some huge unit. either way good luck

I just want to point out that the people who said the portable AC units work well live up north. I don't know how NC is, but it's very hot and humid here in Oklahoma in the summer. I tried to use one temporarily a few years back in mid summer when lightning took out my central heat/AC unit.

It was a 10,000 BTU Everstar, but it wouldn't even cool my 12x20' well insulated office which was closed off from the rest of the house and which my central AC could keep at 70 with no problem. It never got below 95 in there. The unit itself put off quite a bit of heat, was very noisy, and I had to empty the condensation container about every 45 minutes night and day, boy did that get old, lol.

If you don't go the 220 route, the 110 units would be a much better choice, although I agree that 220 is still your best option if you can afford it. I have a couple of little 8000 BTU units now, one in that same office and one in the living room, and together they keep the office, bathroom, hall, living room and kitchen very cool and are cheaper than running the central unit. But I have very good insulation, don't have people going in and out and I keep the curtains drawn during the daytime to keep out the heat. Good luck, I hope you find a good solution that you can afford!

what about sheet foam boards just straped overhead? I use them in my chicken coops and it seems to help.

Meanwhile,

There is a lot more to having an air conditioner than just the original purchase price.
In addition to the purchase price and the installation you have the cost of operation and future maintenance. For your application I suggest that you consider a Package Terminal Air Conditioner and Heat Pump. The initial cost to purchase is lower than any thing other that a window air conditioner. The installation is very affordable and can be done usually by having a home handy man cut a hole in the wall and an electrician run a simple 230 volt line and receptacle to the unit. The freon is factory sealed and being a heat pump are rather economical to operate. Should you need some heat in the future the unit can also deliver that. Should you have a major component fail after the warranty expires the whole unit can be switched out without a service call. Additionally, since these are the same units as used in hotels/motels often you can get a refurbished unit very cheap. here is a link to what I am referencing for your awareness. http://www.trane.com/download/equipm...acprc001en.pdf A google search will take you to a factory refurbished unit that can be bought for a few hundred dollars.
PS.....Here is the source I use http://ptac4less.com/

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Agmantoo
If they can do it,
you know you can!

YOu can't use foam boards overhead in a commercial space unless you want to see inspectors and the fire chief plotzing and closing the place in five seconds flat.

An all-in-one unit might be acceptable. Good point Agman. There are some larger ones that could fit the bill.