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CIW 01/14/14 10:38 PM

Max, Nebraska. The government free town
 
This little town in southwest Nebraska is touting itself as government free. That sounds like a homesteader's paradise.

JillyG 01/15/14 05:26 AM

that's because it only has 55 people.

Gravytrain 01/15/14 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillyG (Post 6909690)
that's because it only has 55 people.

Not for long methinks...

Cornhusker 01/15/14 08:41 AM

We have lots of unincorporated towns out this way
We'd like to keep em that way

ErinP 01/15/14 08:53 AM

OMG! It's gone viral!! :smack:
That video was a color piece that ran on the "local" news (80 miles away). It was a joke. Kind of a News from Lake Woebegone thing.


I doubt Max even has 55 anymore. I know they've had at least a dozen deaths since the last census...
I live just a few miles down the road from Max and literally know 3/4 of the town. Two of my kids' 4H instructors lives there, both of their Scout leaders, etc, etc. But everything happens in the next town to the west, though it's less than 700. The entire county has less than 2000 people.


Max is a town of about four streets, none of which are paved except the two-lane highway that blows through the south end. It doesn't slow down.
There are NO businesses now that a friend of mine's fiance died and with him his auto shop. There is no post office or school. The remaining church (Methodist) is going to close within the next 10 years as the old people die off.

There's no local services (police, sanitation, etc) because there are NO PEOPLE. It's not some thumb-your-nose at the government thing, it's just that the town is dying. It's unincorporated. There are thousands of towns, just like it, all across the high plains. They've all been steadily losing population since the 30s.

They do have government though, just like the rest of us.
The community is run by a village board. The town is patrolled by the local sheriff, just like he patrols the other three towns in the county because NONE of the towns, even the county seat, has a local police department. The road department is county, again, just like the other towns.
When my 12 year old was watching that video, they got to the part about no troubles with drug pushers and she said, "Who would they sell too??? The old ladies??" lol





All of that said, I've been telling this board for years that the rural areas of the high plains are pretty much a homesteader's paradise. There is little to no regulation for the same reason Max can make that joke--There just aren't very many people. :shrug:
Land isn't quite as cheap as it had been though. They're hitting oil left and right around there.

ksfarmer 01/15/14 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillyG (Post 6909690)
that's because it only has 55 people.

Been thru there. Looks like the 55 may be on the decrease. Not much prospect of a future there. Even the grain elevator looks like it's on its last legs. Highway 34 and the railroad just breeze on thru. I doubt people are eager to move into that area.
To me "no government" means probably not much else either, roads, utilities, etc.

edit: Just saw ErinP 's post. She's got the lowdown on Max. Yes, there are lots of "towns " like max. In my own area of Kansas we have Kimeo, Rice, Green, Ames, Brantford, Strawberry , and many more. As the farms get bigger, there is less and less reason for people to live there, the young folks leave and the old timers die off.

ErinP 01/15/14 09:21 AM

Here's the original video:
http://youtu.be/7-v1Ta_il94

ET1 SS 01/15/14 05:15 PM

My town has a sheriff deputy to drive through it once every week.

What other 'services' do you want?

Ravenlost 01/15/14 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CIW (Post 6909578)
This little town in southwest Nebraska is touting itself as government free. That sounds like a homesteader's paradise.

...or an anarchist paradise! :cool:

simi-steading 01/15/14 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ET1 SS (Post 6910688)
My town has a sheriff deputy to drive through it once every week.

What other 'services' do you want?

Bet I never see one unless I call them... and I really don't see that happening.. :croc:

Having a local government void in our area other than taxes collected was a huge reason we liked our property..

ET1 SS 01/15/14 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simi-steading (Post 6910942)
Bet I never see one unless I call them... and I really don't see that happening.. :croc:

Having a local government void in our area other than taxes collected was a huge reason we liked our property..

In this state, 52% of the townships have no local government.

40 townships here have decided to burn their town charters, simply to lower their taxes. I settled in our of those townships.

No local clerk on payroll, no dog catcher, no building inspector. We pay taxes directly to the state. Most of this state's towns are like this.

:)

simi-steading 01/15/14 07:52 PM

Sounds a lot like what we got.. Just not state wide. Taxes are real cheap comparative to most the country. No codes, no cops for miles, but thankfully the FD is a mile up the dirt road..

ErinP 01/16/14 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ET1 SS (Post 6910982)
In this state, 52% of the townships have no local government.

40 townships here have decided to burn their town charters, simply to lower their taxes. I settled in our of those townships.

No local clerk on payroll, no dog catcher, no building inspector. We pay taxes directly to the state. Most of this state's towns are like this.

:)

Nebraska (and the other prairie states) are similar. Most of the towns are too small to require a civic government beyond a voluntary board. It's not a burning of the charter thing, just a lack of people. For many towns, the county is the government. County road department, county sheriff, county commissioners, etc.

But the term "township" confuses me. More importantly, the idea of a township having a government.
Where I'm from a township is a measurement of 36 sections of land. There's obviously no governing body over this, because a township might only have one or two families on it. Even a crowded one would have no more than a dozen. Why would you want to govern this?

ET1 SS 01/16/14 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErinP (Post 6911463)
... Why would you want to govern this?

First, I am not in favor of greater government.



Second, I have debated this topic with people who are in favor of it. Their opinion seems to be that with greater government [planning, zoning, PD/FD, tax-assessors and tax collectors] you must raise taxes to pay for their salaries. Then if you keep raising taxes, then you can offer more municipal services, which allows for higher taxes. Somewhere in the process is 'progressiveness'; prosperity, diversity and growth.

They want 'progressiveness'; prosperity, diversity and growth. To do these things, you must start with planning, zoning, PD/FD, tax-assessors and tax collectors. Greater government allows you to raise taxes to offer municipal services.

ErinP 01/16/14 09:18 AM

Well I'm not really debating the pluses and minuses.

I just don't understand how you could possibly govern a dozen or fewer people. :shrug:
And "municipal services?" For what? For that handful of people? Are we paving roads or something for a handful of people? :confused:

farmerted 01/16/14 09:38 AM

I live in St Louis county with another million people, but I live in an unincorporated section. No councilpersons, no mayor, no other idiots willing to give TIF breaks to giant corporations who don't need them. My taxes are about half of all my friends who live in the county, I have 3 acres, none of them has even a half acre. I still get all the services they do, except sewer, on septic.

Patchouli 01/16/14 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gravytrain (Post 6909719)
Not for long methinks...

Bet you have never been to Nebraska. ;) They could add free land and I still wouldn't live there!

CIW 01/16/14 10:07 PM

People from Nebraska are a breed of their own. They are independent and interdependent. They know when to bring out each quality.
My papa always said that folks in the sandhills know how close to get and how far to stay away.
McCook's Mr. Bill has a simple flare of common sense, resourcefulness and adaptability. It doesn't mean that his comments are correct for everyone but he does make one think.
By the way not everyone has the grit to live in a place like Nebraska. My great grand parents went to the bank on that free land that our government gave away in Nebraska. They developed and sold 5 different homesteads in and around highway 20. Under the Kinkade Homestead Act they were successful where others failed. They grew a legacy that still runs strong today and likely will for many more generations.
Nebraska is not an easy place to get to know. She can be dry, cold, hot and definitely windy. Her secret lies under the ground in the form of the Ogalalla Aquafir. And it has served her well. As well as all those around the world who benefit from the cattle, hogs, oil, natural gas and grain that she produces. And her wind resource is just beginning to be tapped.
She's kind of like a snappin turtle. Her shell is hard and she bites. But the meat is tender and sweet if you know the right way to separate her shell.
I find that I still have a little bit of that Sandhills grit between my teeth.

lonelytree 01/17/14 01:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patchouli (Post 6912254)
Bet you have never been to Nebraska. ;) They could add free land and I still wouldn't live there!

I think you are ignorant. It may be fly over country, but unless you live there you have no idea about the area.

Gravytrain 01/17/14 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patchouli (Post 6912254)
Bet you have never been to Nebraska. ;) They could add free land and I still wouldn't live there!

I've spent quite a bit of time in Nebraska. Most of where I've been in Nebraska is flatter and drier than what I'm accustomed to, but I liked it and the people I've met there.

Gravytrain 01/17/14 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErinP (Post 6911463)

But the term "township" confuses me. More importantly, the idea of a township having a government.
Where I'm from a township is a measurement of 36 sections of land. There's obviously no governing body over this, because a township might only have one or two families on it. Even a crowded one would have no more than a dozen. Why would you want to govern this?

Here in PA, as well as many other states, a county is divided up into civil townships. A township may have tens of thousands of residents. In some places townships rely on the county for ordinances. In PA, a township has the same standing as a borough or city.

I believe what you are referring to is called a survey township.

ErinP 01/17/14 07:38 AM

Quote:

a county is divided up into civil townships.
Ah. This is a population thing...

We just don't have enough people out here to divide a county smaller than "county" level and never have. There's state, county, and if you have enough people, "city." That's it. But rural people never go below "county."

ksfarmer 01/17/14 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErinP (Post 6912986)
Ah. This is a population thing...

We just don't have enough people out here to divide a county smaller than "county" level and never have. There's state, county, and if you have enough people, "city." That's it. But rural people never go below "county."

Here in my part of Kansas the county is divided into townships which are 36 mile x 36 mile squares. There are 25 townships in this county. Population doesn't enter into it, one might have 200 people and another might have 20. I think the county's population is around 6,000 total, which includes the town residents. Each township has a 3 person board elected by the township residents. This board oversees things like road maintenance, snow removal, and such. Due to the sparse population some townships are combining their efforts, because it is cost prohibitive to own a road grader and hire a operator. Certain roads are the county's responsibility but the majority are the townships. The township receives some tax monies back from the county. I know of a couple of local townships where they don't own any road equipment, the maintenance is done by a couple of local farmers with tractors.

ErinP 01/17/14 08:58 AM

Do you have roads around every section or something?
I just can't fathom a reason to have yet another layer of bureaucracy, I guess... Unless it's a state highway, all roads are county roads out here. But, at the same time, we don't have very many of those, either.

Even when we lived in Cherry county, Nebraska (a county larger than Connecticut and RI put together), we didn't have township governments.
...It was still just state, county or town.

Quote:

Here in my part of Kansas the county is divided into townships which are 36 mile x 36 mile squares.
this surprises me, though. 36 X 36? Are you sure it's not 36 square?
36 X 36 would mean 1296 square miles... And someone lives in the "1011th section of Township 3"?

ksfarmer 01/17/14 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErinP (Post 6913091)
Do you have roads around every section or something?
Basically we do have a road on each mile section although some have been abandoned or never exisited due to the need for a bridge.
I just can't fathom a reason to have yet another layer of bureaucracy, I guess... Unless it's a state highway, all roads are county roads out here. But, at the same time, we don't have very many of those, either.
My feeling is that our township system is outdated and needs to be put into a simple county system. There is a lot of inequality in townships because some get more tax money due to more population or a feedlot or hog operation.
Even when we lived in Cherry county, Nebraska (a county larger than Connecticut and RI put together), we didn't have township governments.
...It was still just state, county or town.


this surprises me, though. 36 X 36? Are you sure it's not 36 square?
36 X 36 would mean 1296 square miles... And someone lives in the "1011th section of Township 3"?

I really goofed on that. LOL. A township is 6 X 6, thus giving 36 sections. For example: I live in sec.12 , Greenleaf township. Our county is divided into 25 Townships. Hope this makes more sense.

ksfarmer 01/17/14 11:11 AM

Just to clarify: our TownshipBoard is comprised of three individuals who live in the township. Mostly volunteer. They do get a minimum pay if they have to meet to take care of filing a budget with the county and similar business. Their main benefit of having this job is having people call them to complain about the roads. LOL

dudeatlarge 01/17/14 11:13 AM

Ames,Ks . No government.About 30 or so people. Nothing but peace and quiet.

ksfarmer 01/17/14 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dudeatlarge (Post 6913323)
Ames,Ks . No government.About 30 or so people. Nothing but peace and quiet.

The Aurora coop and a bunch of grain bins. But its a city compared to Rice. Don't think I even have to slow down on the way to Concordia.:goodjob:

ErinP 01/17/14 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ksfarmer (Post 6913310)
I really goofed on that. LOL. A township is 6 X 6, thus giving 36 sections. For example: I live in sec.12 , Greenleaf township. Our county is divided into 25 Townships. Hope this makes more sense.

That makes a lot more sense.
That's the only size-definition of "township" I've ever known; that of 6x6. :)

Patchouli 01/17/14 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lonelytree (Post 6912839)
I think you are ignorant. It may be fly over country, but unless you live there you have no idea about the area.

Actually I lived in Omaha so I do know exactly what Nebraska is like. I would not want to live there. No need for you to be insulting just because I shared an opinion. I prefer trees and mountains and a different climate.

lonelytree 01/17/14 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patchouli (Post 6913423)
Actually I lived in Omaha so I do know exactly what Nebraska is like. I would not want to live there. No need for you to be insulting just because I shared an opinion. I prefer trees and mountains and a different climate.

I was not trying to be insulting. Every state has its faults. Just gotta find one that you can live with.

unregistered353870 01/17/14 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErinP (Post 6911463)
But the term "township" confuses me. More importantly, the idea of a township having a government.
Where I'm from a township is a measurement of 36 sections of land. There's obviously no governing body over this, because a township might only have one or two families on it. Even a crowded one would have no more than a dozen. Why would you want to govern this?

Same here in my area of Montana, but where I grew up most of the townships had a lot more people. They're still 6x6 miles, but within that township there might be 10,000 or more people. Often there will be a city or a village inside the township, so sometimes it does get redundant to have a government for each, but many of the people live in the township but outside the city/village limits. A lot of the time the township government consists of nothing other than a fire department, which covers the village inside the township too. Yes, it's confusing...try pulling a building permit there...who has jurisdiction sometimes depends on the weather.

Pony 01/17/14 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ravenlost (Post 6910928)
...or an anarchist paradise! :cool:

You don't have anything against anarchists, do you?

ErinP 01/17/14 06:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patchouli (Post 6913423)
Actually I lived in Omaha so I do know exactly what Nebraska is like.


:rolleyes:

One, albeit quite large, city has very little in common with the other 98% of the state...

ksfarmer 01/17/14 10:06 PM

Omaha is about as far from Max as you can get. In more ways than one. LOL

Patchouli 01/17/14 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErinP (Post 6913928)
:rolleyes:

One, albeit quite large, city has very little in common with the other 98% of the state...

Unlike most of Omaha's citizens I did actually leave the city limits and visit other places. ;) Lincoln was nicer, sort of. It took about 3 months to see everything of interest in the state. Mostly Nebraska, Iowa and Kansas all kind of run together in one big flat field. If you like the Plains and absolutely nothing whatsoever to do for entertainment then you may like Nebraska. But like I said most Americans won't like it. There is a reason there has never been much of a population boom in the Plains states.

lonelytree 01/18/14 01:06 AM

I have family all along the Republican River including Benkleman.

Explorer 01/18/14 05:24 AM

During the "free" land homesteading phase there was a huge population boom in all the planes states.

lonelytree 01/18/14 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patchouli (Post 6914393)
Unlike most of Omaha's citizens I did actually leave the city limits and visit other places. ;) Lincoln was nicer, sort of. It took about 3 months to see everything of interest in the state. Mostly Nebraska, Iowa and Kansas all kind of run together in one big flat field. If you like the Plains and absolutely nothing whatsoever to do for entertainment then you may like Nebraska. But like I said most Americans won't like it. There is a reason there has never been much of a population boom in the Plains states.

Again you show your ignorance.

dudeatlarge 01/18/14 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ksfarmer (Post 6913358)
The Aurora coop and a bunch of grain bins.

Don't forget the one room school house complete with outhouse. The roof did blow off the outhouse a few years back. Maybe I'll go put it back on this weekend.


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