A little rant.

There is nothing in the rule book that says our parents or grandparents owe us the family farm. If your grandmother is inclined to ensure that the farm is saved for future generations, there are ways to do that legally but if she owns the land and has given your father permission to run it as he sees fit, there isn't a lot you can do.

If you are truly interested in keeping the family farm in the family, you might have to do it the old fashioned way, go see the banker and buy it.

If he's there 2 days a week and you're there full time, does that mean you're expected to do the work of running the operation? If so, I think that would give you a vote.

In general there seem to be lots of definitions of "farm", so what is the current setup of the farm? Crops? Livestock? How many acres? We know your fathers proposal what to do with it, but you didn't say what yours were. Not that it matters because you did say you just needed to vent a little......

The first task of starting a business is determining if there's a market for your product. In 2007 there were 8 deer farms withing 30 miles of me. None now. Some went bankrupt. The main market - Trophy Hunting - went away in '08. Those farms that still have a market have relationships with the buyers, and newcomers will have a hard time cracking in.

Also, there's more to it than just putting up 10' fences. You need another fence away from the deer fence to keep dogs, etc., away. I know a guy who lost a $13,000 buck when some dogs spooked him, and he broke his neck running into a fence.

He may know someone who's making money in the business, but you can bet they've been in it long enough to have the contacts necessary to survive in a very diminished market.

Overall, I can't think of a worse way to spend money.

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http://www.ozarktubs.com
"The Big Load Washtub"

If you father isn't asking for your advice, don't give it. If you want a say so in the decisions ,buy the place. Never ,never assume anything when it comes to your familys property after their death. I am in the process of buying my parents log cabin-because it's the only thing I care about in their estate, and it's just a tiny % of the overall estate, and I'm the one that has to handle the entire estate upon death, but will not take a chance of the mess involved in family fights. I had to help out in the death of my Grandfather and that taught me a big lesson.
As far as a Deer "farm" , a neighbor raises Elk(for the meat), seems to do quite well. ?

I agree with wr.

My dad is the oldest of three boys. He went to college to avoid a little drama happening in SE Asia at the time, but when he graduated Grandpa told him he's educated now. He doesn't need to be 'just a farmer.'
My middle uncle also went to college, to avoid the same drama, but the US pulled out about the time he was finishing his undergrad and he just stuck around for a PhD. Grandpa asked him home, as he needed help on the farm. They helped him build a new house on the opposite side of the section.

My youngest uncle never left home. He just changed bedrooms when he got married and Grandma and Grandpa moved to town.

So then Dad put himself through law school in hopes of making his fortune and buying his own farm. Instead, he's now a 66 year old retired lawyer who has enough of a nest egg to spend a couple months every year on his motorcycle with Mom, touring the western half of the US.

Dad's story is just one of dozens I've known over the years like this. I've seen families completely destroyed while they fight over the home place.
Grandpa died about 10 years ago and while he came to terms with it, I'm not sure Dad entirely forgave him for shutting him out of the family farm. However, he has forgiven his brothers (yes, they were complicit).
Ironically, because of work he'd done as a lawyer, he knew he had to let it go or he would lose those valuable family connections. Worse, because of squabbles between his two younger brothers, he had to act as family leader and peace maker.

The brothers are all retired now and grandfathers themselves. They're even good friends and we cousins are more like siblings.


But it could easily have gone a completely different direction.
I pray you remember that while deciding which battles you'll fight, Hill Runner.

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~*~Erin~*~
SAHM, ranch wife, sub and quilt shop proprietress
the Back Gate Country Quilt Shop

Since your grandmother still owns the farm - talk to her if you think your dad has a bad idea - but in the end - you really only can give your opinion and let the chips fall - unless of course you can buy the farm - which at your age you probably can't - try to talk to your dad in a nice way - and tell him why his idea may not be a good one -

Family is most often so very much fun. Said sarcastically. the generations have different goals, different experiences. They are not trying to do the same things, and the other view looks just dumb.

And sometimes both sides are right, they are just in that different time frame......

Often times criticism isn't received well. But if one can plot out a different path, a better one, then that line of thinking is received much better.

We have a friend, she is Miss Negative, man any idea anyone has on anything, just no, bad, blah, negative, phffft., won't work for 20 different reasons.....

After a few decades we all just learn to let her ramble, not pay any mind to all the negative stuff. It is just a given.

We have a more positive friend, that person might tell us the same exact thing on a project, we are much more likely to listen to that person. They often can tell us something is a bad idea, but are able to offer some options in conversation that meets in the middle and offers a better plan, instead of just no, dumb, silly, never gonna work.....

In the end its his investment, you might be totally right but it is his game, not yours.

Hope you can find a way to get closer together on goals and plans if you are living very close together.

Sounds like your grandma has a handful with the 2 of you there on different plans, keep in mind you don't want to make her uncomfortable or needing to choose between you and your dad, that does not make for a fun life for her....

Good luck.

Paul

Yea, I feel sorry for granny. What does she want done with the farm. After all, she is still alive and still lives on it. If she goes in a nursing home, you may all lose it anyway!

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Living Large Down on the Farm.

She's in agreement with me just that she doesn't like to speak up and "stir" trouble.

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“As the farmer who won the lottery said when asked what he was going to do with his winnings "Keep farming until it's all gone”

I would rather be a sole proprietor of a lemonade stand than a family partner in the biggest farm on the continent......Joe

I'm just curious as to who is investing in the farm now as is? Is Grandma footing all the bills now. Even if the farm is paid off, there is still land taxes, insurance etc etc. Are you or your Dad paying any expenses to keep the farm operating. Is the farm producing income now?

Farms been in the family for 4-5 generations. Grandma pays taxes, Dad takes care of the cattle end. He goes through stockyards selling them. I do my thing from my yard(2 acres) selling eggs, rabbits live and pet food, ducks, chickens and my smaller market garden. I think he could make more profit selling direct to customers instead of going through two middle men then sale price at the stockyard.

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“As the farmer who won the lottery said when asked what he was going to do with his winnings "Keep farming until it's all gone”

Maybe or maybe not. I have sold both ways and the each have advantages and disadvantages but selling direct to customers can be quite labor intensive and like it or no, time is money too.

If you're running a cow/calf operation, the most logical place for your calves to go is into a feedlot and feedlots want to buy even sized pens so you pretty much need to be able to sell a group of calves at a specific weight but they don't prefer to take a herd of calves at various weights because it tends to be labor intensive at their end.

If you're planning on selling to locals for meat, that's even more labor intensive because I've found that most people seem to think they want a half or a quarter carcass so you're always trying to sell the other have and they seem to expect you to run each one into the abattoir. Some want grass finished and others want grain finished and in the end, they all want it cheap and you can expect at least 10% will decide they don't like what they bought and will expect a refund, even if they have eaten the steaks and roast and left you with the hamburger.

I'm not saying it can't work but I am saying it's not quite as easy as you may think it is.

it isn't a good idea to squash the dreams of other people, esp when it is on their own land..at least that is what I feel..

Better to get your own little place to do your thing and let the parents do their own, they have a right to their own mistakes..as you do yours..

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Brenda Groth
http://restfultrailsfoodforestgarden.blogspot.com/

OP, I don't know where your income comes from, and it's not my business. I can tell you from personal experience, you'll be a much happier person if you let it go. If you outright own the acres your home is on, great. Keep doing what you do where you are, and stay away from the rest of it. If you don't own the ground under your house, see if you can either make that happen, or make other arrangements.

You can't make grandma assert herself, and you can't make dad see things your way. Walk away and let them both do whatever it is they're going to do. If the farm comes down to you some day, great. You'll have a farm and the memory of good relations with your grandma and your dad. If it doesn't, well, it was never yours to begin with, so you lose nothing, but maintain a civil relationship with the two generations that came before you.

Grandma sounds wise.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

Very wise raised me sense I was 11 when my mom and dad split from each other.

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“As the farmer who won the lottery said when asked what he was going to do with his winnings "Keep farming until it's all gone”

It's up to her what happens with that farm - it *is* her property. If she has agreed with your dad to 'run the farm' - how things happen pretty much depend on that agreement. If she won't rock the boat, so to speak, you might need to rethink your living there..... Especially if your dad is adamant about not listening to your ideas....

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Be a fountain, not a drain!

^()^
http://tubbsfarmstead.com/

Talk to your Grandma about buying the farm, or buying the house and a few acres. You could buy it on a land contract, or any way you and Grandma agree to. Raise a few head of beef cattle on pasture and sell it to a few families. This way, you can sell whole, half, and half quarters. There will be lots of excess liver and other organs because people don't want them. This type of purchase is paid by hanging weight, you then ask if they want the organ meat. The organ meat you then sell to people who feed their dogs raw (BARF) Now, you have extra income from the organ meat instead of garbage. The beef will sustain you financially when eggs won't. When your dad sees you doing well with your pastured beef, he may begin to respect your business sense. In the meantime, don't tell him how to run his end of the farm.

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Nothing is as strong as gentleness, nothing so gentle as real strength - St. Francis de Sales