how can you live without access to water

This year living without water would be easy...its rained almost everyday of July.

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We used to haul water in a huge plastic container in the back of our pu. You can buy one of these containers from Tractor supply.

Tip on hauling water: As others said, water is heavy. Transport a fully filled tank. A partly filled tank will have the load shift when turning. A local fire truck was returning from a fire with a partly empty tank, he went around a curve too fast, the water shifted, the truck turned over. Truck not going at a high speed either.

COWS

whats the water table like?
Would it be possible to put a point well in?
Would not be too cost prohibitive but you would not want to have to drive it down too far.
Here most of the year I can hit water 3 feet down.
so 12 foot would be more then enough but there like I said not sure.
Deep wells are nice because they seldom go dry.
but can be expensive.
if a point well will work for you the other thing I would do would be to construct a cistern so when water is available you can take advantage.
use the well for regular use and to fill cistern, if it goes dry then you can fall back to the cistern.
if it doesn't produce before your cistern runs dry you could then go the truck route.

I google up this http://waterdata.usgs.gov/id/nwis/gw

little confusing but may help you, looking at the current conditions of 4 sites, one it appears to have water 36 foot down, so a point well would be possible, the other 3 appear to be 350-400 foot down so a point well would not work.

Hi,
Lots of ways to harvest rain water off your roof:
http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/Water/Water.htm

Basically, a 1000 sqft of roof area will give you about 500 gallons of water in the tank for a 1 inch rain. The large rotomolded poly tanks are not to expensive.

Some homes in Taos, NM with 8 inches of rain are year are able to supply all their water from a roof harvest system (but no livestock).

Gary

IF you do not have easily accessible water, your homestead is always going to be (imho) an ephemeral one. You'll have it just for as long as you can haul water. The day you can't, your homestead won't either.

Surface running water is best, but rare. Surface water in a pond is next best... as long as it has capacity to last a few years through a drought. Next would be a cistern, catching rain water... great, as long as one can manage their usage....cannot use more than you have. A deep well is ok, as long as you have a guaranteed SHTF proof power source to extract it. Trouble is, wells go dry, pumps fail, power for pumps can die. One 'can' use pipe buckets to pull water from a deep well, but you'd end up spending all your time reeling that bucket up and down all day.

Areas of the country without much agriculture are that way for a reason.... life is tenuous without water.

Iffen I did pack my bags and move to the desert, I'd build a cistern as big as a house, have all rainfall on the roof channeled to it (yes, I'm well aware of western water laws), drill a well and pump till the cistern was full, or possibly even get a water tanker truck to come out and fill it..... this would be the worst option, as it'd let at least one person know you are prepared for hard times...at least concerning water. Locals might 'wonder' about you, but getting that prepped would let em 'know'.

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Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity. Seneca
Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival. W. Edwards Deming

Ok, let's do the math ...

1 inch of rain on a 1,000 square foot of roof is 561 gallons of water in a collection tank.

Our household, with no running water, toilets, etc. consumes 200 gallons per week ... and that doesn't include the livestock or the gardens.

That's 10,400 gallons of water we need to use for just our basic survival over the course of an entire year.

If you only get 8 inches of rain per year, you're going to collect only 4,488 gallons of water for your household use, which is well below what you need to get by (assuming our 200 gallon per week usage would be the norm).

If I were in that situation, I would build a minimum of 3,000 feet of roofline to capture water from. That's a big covered sitting area, maybe a carport, and of course your house. A barn would be a nice place to catch water too.

I would assume there is a good reason why water isn't already supplied to the property (unless we're talking about vacant land) and keep looking.

If I didn't have livestock, our family of four could easily use a mere 5-600 gallons a month.
Seriously.

Now that means doing laundry at the laundromat, a composting toilet, and a 3 gallon daily shower (which is surprisingly sufficient).
Your usage has to be as frugal as your supply...

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~*~Erin~*~
SAHM, ranch wife, sub and quilt shop proprietress
the Back Gate Country Quilt Shop

We were using a little less than 200 gallons per week. At the time I was hauling water to our homestead because of the lack of rain. 200 gallons a week in a drop tank in the back of my pickup cost me $6 and an hour of my time.

But it was ridiculously hard to cut down our usage any lower than that. We were drinking water, but also hands needs to be washed, food needs to be washed, there's water you need when cooking, etc. Forget daily showers. We were on a biweekly shower schedule, and even then we'd just hit the dirtiest parts.

When the pond was dug and filled up, that bumped our storage capability up to 1.8 million gallons of water. After hauling it 200 gallons at a time and trying to conserve, I felt like a poor man who had won the lottery.

We gave up hauling drinking water and now we just pump water up from the pond and filter it with the Berkey. We use the pond water for all of our purposes now. Our entire homestead is reliant upon that pond.

Now that it's full again, I have been spotted once or twice frivolously splashing drops of water at the children.

Haul it and set up a catchment system. We did it for several years with 20 sheep, 12 goats, 3 hogs, and lots of chickens. Worked fine but was work.

Also, we had a catchment system on our lean-to at the garden. We ran a drip hose throughout the garden and turned it on when it was dry. It did great and we had the driest summer in a long time last year.

Hi,
I should have mentioned that part of the reason (a big part) is that these homes in Taos that work only on roof harvested water and a large cistern is that the home designs make very efficient use of the water. This is the one we stayed in for a couple days: http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects...hShipVisit.htm
Some more examples: http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects.../Earthship.htm

There is a good book that describes their whole water system called "Water from the sky" by Reynolds. Lots of good detail. They drop water usage from an average of about 60 gallons a day for 2 people down to 19 gallons a day. This involves a lot of water reuse, but they still have regular flush toilets and washing machines -- no real lifestyle change.

But, most places get a lot more than 8 inches of rain, and would not have to be so careful with water use or have a huge roof area. I suppose that providing water for livestock may be the difficult part.

Gary

True, but I've found a lot of those folks aren't homesteaders. They aren't cutting their water usage, they're outsourcing their water usage.

If you go to a Laundromat to wash your clothes then you haven't cut your water usage, you've outsourced it to someone else. What you've actually done is bought someone else's water with cash.

Every drop of water here gets used at least twice. If we drink it, then it comes out as urine to help feed the humanure compost pile. If we wash our hands in it, then it's captured in a bucket under the sink to be taken out and poured onto the fruit trees.

There is a value in these desert homesteads. I hate to see people saying, "I would never buy that sort of homestead" because it puts people off. Land in fertile areas with plenty of water may cost $3,000 an acre. Land in these arid and desert areas may cost $800 or less. If you DESIRE to be a homesteader and have limited resources, then you may find a desert homestead to be more financially in your reach. You can dream of being a homesteader in the lush Wilamette Valley, perhaps when you retire, or you can go be a homesteader now with the cash you have in West Texas.

Creative solutions are called for if you're a homesteader (or wannabe homesteader) and don't have a lot of cash. Taking a piece of property that "nobody in their right mind" would want and turning it into a fruitful and prosperous homestead is a challenge indeed, but it has its own rewards.

As for hauling water, EVERYBODY hauls water. Those of you who are hooked up on city water are hauling water. Only you get to pay for someone else to maintain the tanks, treatment, filtering, and infrastructure. And worse, you're completely at their mercy.

Hmmm....We both work office jobs and showered (quickly) every evening. Animals always had plenty of water and we had plenty to drink. We used a composting toilet so no toilet water. It is all about learning to be careful with what you have. I wouldn't say ANYONE wasn't a homesteader if I don't know them. Homesteader can be many different things. We lived off grid for 2 years when we got to MO.
Due to my DH job we had to relocate and were able to get another piece of land, however it has a water well and elec. Can't say I like it better....I love off-grid, however we think we are doing pretty good as our last elec bill was only $21.00. We learned a lot about conserving when we were off grid.

It just sorta sets me on edge when someone says folks aren't "homesteaders." One thing doesn't work for everyone and that is what is so cool about homesteading....experiment.

Water, is definitely something to think about but it can be done and done well.

Another idea we used was catchment right into the stock tanks.

I also have to add that where you are makes a huge difference. I would be worried to try it in the desert.

For the OP: Be sure to check local, county, state regulations. Some states don't allow you to catch water, have a pond, etc. Water rights are better than piles of gold?

We lived for seven years with only a cistern. We never hauled water, but we did not waste it either. Folks are terrible wasteful from what I have observed. We never let water running if it was not used, like when brushing teeth or dear hubby shaving.
Right now I really do not need to be so saving, but I still am. I like taking navy showers outside. I got a frontloader washer, we have a compost toilet, I give rinse water to the plants around the house. We catch water off the barn for the animals.

Interesting thread, with many good points.

Like in everything else, you pay your money and you make your choice/compromise.

I love visiting the desert, but bought sub-$1k/acre land in the Ozarks with 45 inches of rain!


Tim

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Then prepare to be set on edge.

There's a lady in our area who is known for having a big garden and chickens. I hear all the time, "Do you know Miss so and so? You should do things like she does!"

Well, Miss so-and-so is collecting disability, social security, and a pension from her previous job as a county employee. She's 70 years old and lives alone, in town, hooked up to city water (paid for by the city) on a quarter acre. She's known as a "homesteader" because the city paper ran a local interest story on her as being "self-sufficient".

Yes, she's "self-sufficient" alright, with a thousand bucks a week or so rolling in on government funds, unlimited water, and minimal calorie requirements. She even got a $23,000 grant from the federal government to "mentor" local children on how to start a community garden. A community garden has yet to surface after a year and a half.

So I'm a bit suspicious when I see stuff in Mother Earth magazine or some other source where it shows how someone is doing something. Often, quite often, the ideas are good and can be adapted, but also there's a lot of nonsense floating around out there. ("Build a house out of banana peels!")

Be willing to experiment, but also be skeptical. I've been burned a few times by seeing an idea and running with it, without investigating how much maintenance it requires, how long it lasts, or how much actual support it requires.

You see, for me, homesteading is a very serious matter. It's not a game. It's not a hobby. Failure means either having to throw ourselves on the mercy of the state (not a valid option), or having to try and reenter the corporate world as a middle-aged white male with technical skills about 6 years out of date.

Ideas that do not work have to be discarded quickly, and anything that costs money ABSOLUTELY has to work before we ever spend a dime.

For the OP:
A 3/4 ton pickup and all those thirsty mouths?

I have a hard time seeing how this could work.

I was in a situation where we hauled water, there were just the two of us, a cat, some ducks, and about 50 square feet of raised bed garden.

We had a very heavy duty 1-ton pickup (nicknamed behemoth), a 350-gallon saddle tank, a pump to fill the saddle tank from the water source, and two plastic 1300-gallon storage tanks plumbed together and another pump for pressurizing the system - we didn't have enough elevation on the property for gravity feed.

We hauled water about every 10 days. (No, we didn't use all that water in 10 days, but when we started on the second tank, we'd refill the empty one.) It would take half a day and three trips to do it. We lived on a steep road and when we first started hauling water, we went down the road to get the water, then hauled the water back up the road. This was *very* hard on the truck. When we made arrangements with an uphill neighbor, we were hauling water down, which was a good deal easier on the truck.

The pickup cost 3000 used, the tanks and pumps and plumbing probably ran nearly that much again.

And, please note, we did much of our laundry and all our full showers off-site.

Find a piece of land with some water on it, or off-load the animals. Otherwise, you are setting yourself up for at least purgatory on earth. You don't need it, and neither do your loved ones.