Stray range cattle and little range wars

Thank you for the diagnosis........having progressed well into my 7th decade without having committed a crime against a person, I'd say it was somewhat flawed, but it is your own, and I encourage you to stick with it, because your indignation obviously pleases you to no end.....Enjoy!..............Joe

Your idea of "moving them around" sounds a lot like livestock harassment, which we do have a law against in my state. All my cattle are on owned and leased property but occasionally cattle get out even with good fences. If somebody penned them up on their property and ran them in circles I'm quite certain that somebody would end up regretting that decision. You're lucky you didn't pull that stunt here.

You need to get everyone in town to plant larkspur in their gardens.

"escaped" cattle get treated with respect. Hauling them into private subdivisions and dumping them is another story. Cattle harassment laws certainly apply on government leased lands and privately owned ranch lands, as well they should. If you haul them onto your neighbor's property, dump them, then refuse to pick them up until the are fat, what would you suggest your neighbor do, providing the local law and the BLM thinks the whole thing is a joke?

Certainly, nobody called the law on me, because they were in violation, themselves. And well they knew it.....Joe

that or pyrocantha might have been the next step, and they knew that, too. In short, they knew when to quit....Joe

I would strongly suggest that no person follow joebill's advice of running/harrassing livestock, no matter how frustrated they may become or how angry they are at a stock owner.

I'm not overly familiar with open range laws, I am very aware that the US has some very strong laws regarding harming or harrassing livestock and running cattle to the point of exhaustion or extreme weight loss could result in animal abuse charges if the owner were to press charges.

I would also think that it would be illegal to lease/rent someone else's livestock for recreational purposes so it would also be a bad idea to lease unowned cattle for penning.

It seems to me the land the cattle are pastured on is overgrazed and that's the primary cause of the problem. I think I would would start with conversation and follow up photos with someone in range management with the government and if you worked with them on appropriate stocking ratios, you might have the herd thinned down enough that there is no need for the cattle to wander.

Looks like if the community is not in a No Fence district, and it's open range, the only thing they can do is to fence the cattle out. (document below)
I've never heard of a semi-open range area, Cygnet. Is this a new designation?
When I lived in northern AZ, we had to completely fence out our 40 acres to keep a local rancher's cattle out of out place. Our nearest neighbor complained and kicked up a fuss but there was nothing to do but fence them out.
There used to be a law in AZ too that harassing livestock was illegal. Same in Idaho, at least that is what I've heard. (Not that Cygnet would do that...just responding to the other poster)

Attached Files

az1533(2).pdf (279.3 KB, 0 views)

I realize it's a different situation than what I described but I still have doubts that you didn't break any laws. To answer your question, fence out if you're in a fence out area. If you're not in a fence out area, then it's another story...but still doesn't justify livestock harassment as far as I'm concerned.

That is exactly the way to handle a mean cow...not run it in circles (which is pretty nasty ) and not taking a risk of injury..give it one chance and then good bye. I am so glad I don't have to deal with neighbors like the op...my neighbor is one of the best I have ever had. The other is a big city transplant with more money than brains and I am sure her pasture pet horses will be out again soon. They are mean as all get out and the 2 year old is not altered yet so is a stud, who has never been handled and bites kicks and screams if you get close. I'd rather have cows loose.

What is the exact way?

Cygnet, you might contact your county board of supervisors and request that they make your area a No Fence district.

It is not illegal to rent someone else's livestock. its done everyday. and these cattle are not ''unowned' just un supervised. Do you think the PBR owns those bulls they use? no, there rented for a use,from the owners. That is why I said to rent them,,tell what for and what you could pay. their owners would take them home ASAP.
I have been involved with renting many head of young stock for penning events. Four tractor trailer loads for one event..They were sent to a feed lot the next day. As part of the stock crew for many years,,and many events, to date I know of no insurance claim for lost or abused stock ,by there owners. Sorry to say,,penning,sorting,,and renting stock,go hand in hand.

Sorry, I missed your reasoning the first time around....Joe

Ok, its just some people have fantasy of what should happen in life. they could never believe other people would walk all over you if you let them..they want to blow there own horn,,and that's ok, but blow it toward the problem..in this case the stock owners.
If you posted a add in the local paper,,and kept it up to date..it would keep you out of trouble with the judge. as long as you state what,when ,where ,and how clearly.
Then if someone wanted to claim you were running stock,you would have it covered.

Interesting comments in this thread. Interesting differences in Western and Eastern attitudes on the subject.

From the op's comments and the pictures, it is obvious the range is overstocked. The rancher is not making any money from his operation and certainly can't pay a "foreman" from his cow operation. The rancher sounds like he meets the western definition of a man with "big hat, no cattle."

Fence laws in the East have a somewhat interesting history. The 5 foot high fence rule is first found in Colonial Virginia laws. I've never found 5 feet to be needed for regular fences, 4-4 1/2 works fine. 6 1/2 works for catch pens and loading chutes.

There was a condition of "open range" in colonial days and later. Va had discussions about ending the practice around 1830. In SC open range was ended about 1880. Arguments were: Fence laws favored the large landowner over the small. The large land owner was growing commercial crops, chiefly cotton, and it would cost a lot to build fences, using split rail technology, to fence in large acreages of crops. There wasn't that much livestock and they could be fenced in a relatively small area. The small landowner, or renter, preferred to let some of his livestock run loose and get feed where they could. From early times people wanted especially to let hogs run loose and fatten on chestnuts. They would round them up and sell or butcher them in the fall. One reason we now have a large number of wild hogs, some escaped. Anyway, the rule now is that you are responsible for you escaped livestock, period. With all the local car traffic, no one wants their livestock running around in traffic.

The fence as specified in the quoted AZ law above would be inadequate for cows here. 4 strands five feet high leaves too much gap between the strands. 30 feet between posts is totally insufficient. There is usually something tempting on the other side of fences here, unless the fence is built through woods, and cows will push through it. I usually have 12 feet between posts. It helps that I can cut red cedar trees for posts, and I don't have to dig through the rocks pictured. Yes, I noticed the fence pictured has spacers between the strands. Appearantly they are not working out too well. An adequate fence 5 feet high would need 6 strands, IME, and closer posts

COWS

Great balls of fire - reading this post educated me about what's going on out in the West - free ranging cattle - I thought that was something you only encountered in the cowboy pictures - it seems any place you live has some unpleasant thing going on - here where I live its too many people -

Our property borders national Forest. That means cows and sheep. Fence em out and no running them. The cows hit us several times a year. We mozy them on with the dogs but we are required to fence them out.

You drive on the free ways. And once out of the city and in Open Range you will see many signs along the hiway telling you this. And when you use the off ramp there is a "Cattle Guard in the road same thing with On Ramps to the free ways. LOL

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Open range usually isn't unpleasant because it's usually in the middle of nowhere...and people have fences to keep the cattle out of where they don't want them.

What small town is it in AZ that has not free ranging cattle coming into town but Wild Burros? Up and down the street wild burros are roaming around.

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