Real Estate Question again

Oh, I hear ya! There ain't no place left where the government won't regulate the crud out of you. I learned this lesson when I moved back to Texas, thinking it was "more free" than Illinois.

Fought with the commissioner over the darn $25 building permit. I called it a "fee" and he called it a "permit". I didn't mind paying the $25 but I would be darned before I gave them the moral high ground of thinking they could give me PERMISSION to build a house on my own land. If you let them think they have the authority to give you permission over building then they think they can revoke that permission any time they please.

In the end I paid the $25 and made my statement and didn't sign anything, so it's not a very official permit and I'm still calling it a fee.

People whine and cry all the time about how the government is spying on their email, listening to their phone calls, and sticking their fingers in everyone's bank accounts. Well, folks, what do you expect? When you gave the government the authority to control whether or not you could crap in a bucket then what WOULDN'T they assume they could do to you?

Love that song!

We ain't free...not anymore. As much a I hate regulations, I would hate to live next to someone who had no septic system and their effluent flowed on my property. That's why we have laws, codes and permits.

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You believe in gun control? Revoking everyone's second amendment rights because someone might shoot up a school?

No?

Why would you believe in poop control then?

If I run my effluent on to my neighbor's property, he's already got legal recourse to come after me, and probably the moral high ground to come punch me in the face if he wants.

But why does the possibility that someone MIGHT do it justify the creation of a draconian system of laws, codes, and permits to prevent me from doing it preemptively?

Gun control and poop control. Same thing.

Because without laws they will do it. Shooting someone comes down to morals. You cannot regulate morals.

I certainly see your point, but I stand my ground. I surely don't want to drive across a bridge that was not planned, permitted and inspected and I don't want to go to the top floor of the Empire State Building knowing it has not been inspected for safety.

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So does running your poop off onto your neighbor's land!

Unless you think all of rural America is just a bunch of ignorant hillbillies who need laws to control their behavior.

What do you do if your neighbor decides to burn his pasture on a windy day and its blowing towards your house/property threatening your home, barn and animals?

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If it causes me harm, then I sue him and live in his house.

If he burned me out on purpose, I come back in the middle of the night sometime and pay him a visit.

Do you understand the difference between common law and maritime law?

With common law, you were held accountable if your actions caused harm to others. It was the basis for the Old English law and what we originally had in the United States.

But that wasn't enough for some folks and they then adopted maritime law, like what you had in maritime shipping. Under that, the authorities had the authority to punish you for actions that MIGHT cause harm, whether or not any actual harm had been done.

What you're advocating is the pre-crime punishment of millions of homeowners on the off-chance that they might do something illegal. That's what regulations and building codes are primarily used for. Well that, and to line the pockets of people in the regulated business.

Its a good thing you werent the truck driver who crossed this bridge then, we would never have gotten our boat launch built! Without benefit of inspections, permits or fees I might add. This bridge was built by my broker, a friend with a trackhoe and myself about 8 years ago. This was the "test load", as in the first gravel truck across it. 23 tons of rock, plus the truck, later we had several loads of concrete hauled in over it, 5 yard loads.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

I dunno about you, but I have been in that situation and know what I did..... I helped him put the fire out. Mighta been the wrong, but it seemed like the right thing to do at the time.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

I'm going to reiterate my point from earlier that you so deliberately sidestepped.

You have "MOLON LABE" in your signature, indicating that you believe free men should possess guns.

Should free men lose their guns because some will act irresponsibly with them?

No?

Well then why are you wanting to deprive millions of free men the right to build and plan their own homes? Because some might act irresponsibly with them?

I'm not trying to pick on you friend, because I think you would be a good ally to have since you so clearly believe in individual freedom in the specific area of gun control.

I'm just trying to point out the illogic of your desire to curtail freedom in other area of men's lives.

We're either completely free, or we're not free at all. What good is the right to own guns if you can't build your own house, grow your own food, or raise your own children?

Don't think that's a public bridge, and now you would require a permit from EPD to build that bridge...legally.

I'm betting, since I used to do NPDES inspections 8 years ago that even then that bridge would be illegal.

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You and I obey laws and think we should be free to live how we please, however that's not the case now is it? I didn't make the laws, and I don't agree with them, but I have to live by them.

And if someone is doing something that could harm my property I do like the option to call police to interfere without resulting to violence. I however don't care much for the police and I don't like them interfering in my freedom, but if I'm doing something that could harm others than I should be stopped.

And you are free to build your own house, you just can't let your poop on my property. You can talk about freedom all you want, bottom line is you pay taxes on your property whether you like it or not so you will abide by the laws of the land.

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I have no idea about the latest rules and laws, as I have no intention of building another bridge. I am pretty much disabled at this time. All I can tell you is that yes, it was a bridge open to the public at the time we built it, and if memory serves it was completed sometime in the spring of 05, might have been 06. There have been no legal issues to my knowledge in regards to the construction or use of this bridge. I can tell you that a retired state bridge inspector lived in the neighborhood and watched it being built, his only comment to us was "why did you feel the need to overbuild it by double what was needed?"

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

Full of logical fallacies. I pay taxes so freedom is a lie? I pay taxes for the same reason I'd hand over my wallet to a man who stuck a gun in my face. You call the police instead of doing violence, so you effectively outsource your violence to the government?

I guess there's no convincing you to be a completely free man, not a partial one.

Good luck in your pursuit of gun freedom. Don't expect a whole lot of help and sympathy from the rest of us since you've advocated to take away our freedoms on other matters.

By the way, those founding fathers who wrote the second amendment also managed to find a way to crap without the government telling them how to do it.

How do feel about bird poo, or bear poo, or deer poo on yer property?

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

Some folks don't have the common sense to govern themselves...I'd be willing to bet it's more than some.

Just like hubby's bridge, I could care less what you build on your property, but if your bridge building contaminates the stream that feeds into my trout pond that I sell trout from to feed my family and it kills all my fish we have a problem. That why we have regulations.

You may think your bridge building caused no harm, maybe it didn't...but maybe it did? So we have rules we follow to make sure you don't effect others downstream.

You may have a field of tomatoes, I assume you would be pretty upset if I was upwind from you spraying my hayfield with 24d in 100 degree temps vaporizing all the tomato plants you sell to feed your family. So we have application rules, (the label is the law), and licenses.

We cannot live in a lawless society.

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I agree, we need laws to protect me from thee, but laws that attempt to protect me from me are just plain ol meddlin. My poop is not going to be on your property, so no worries there, and my house certainly isnt going to cause anyone any harm, hence there is no need to have some meddler poking around telling me how I should build it or what color I can paint it. (which I aint about to do and would be mighty upset if anyone else ever did) When I get ready to pee off my porch, rest assured there aint enough pressure to get it off the porch, much less onto your property so I just dont see the need in you being so worried about threats that dont exist.

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"Nothing so needs reforming as other peoples habits." Mark Twain

For someone who Molon Labe's you sure are frothing at the mouth about following rules and regulations and being "legal" and your assumption that us rural folks are too stupid and/or ignorant to know the proper way to build and dispose of our wastes, and live a nonpolluting, nonintrusive lifestyle is the height of arrogance. I do NOT have to follow rules and regulations as long as I am WILLING to pay whatever price comes from being free of those rules and regulation and as long as my ignoring the rules and regulations do not interfere with anyone else's rights. My free choice.

Well, this post has gone to hail

Is it legal is it illegal? Guys its legal to rip babies out their mommas and toss em in a trash can. Do you really want to concern yourself with whats legal? I concern myself whith what is right.