Do any Realtors have ethics?

Make sure a buyer's agent is paid by YOU and only YOU, and not based on price of the house. Otherwise, they are a SELLER's agent, regardless of what papers you sign with them. Just because you go looking at a property with an agent other than the listing agent, doesn't make them your agent.

That said, unless you really know the person well, don't waste time with anyone except the top producing agents. There's a reason they have their act together and that is because they know what they're doing and they have a good team. Establish a good relationship with them and they will be honest about what a good deal or a bad deal is. If they think you're just a looker, or working with several agents at once they won't take you seriously. Also, like anyone else, they want people who don't have credit issues (just like you do if you're in business). If you know someone who is a real estate investor (buys more than one property a year), ask who they work with, and get a referral. Part of the problem when people say that "all" agents are bad is that most people move on average every five years, and not necessarily in the same area, so it's not like going to different stores--you don't use enough agents to know who's bad or good.

As to the house described here, I would have figured from the description alone, manufactured or homebuilt where (obviously) there were not even minimum codes (come on, 9 bedrooms and only 3 bathrooms????). Price also was a big tip-off that something was not quite right. Would have put me right off.

I have had several very good realtor experiences. The one who sold me my homestead and sold my existing house so that I could buy this one remains a good friend and visits with his granddaughter to see the farm.

I have bought and sold many houses - the most success I have had is to do my searching over the web, find about 6 possibilities and then give that list to the realtor. Now a days the multi list is updated several times a day on the web. I lived in Denver and bought a place in Washington this way with one trip out to do shopping.


I have also had brief dealings with very bad realtors - mainly some that represented people buying my property or others that I have discarded as not fit to work with. Don't take the first realtor that comes along. Having a good working relationship with the realtor is really important. If all you get is "I dunno" when you ask about boundaries, features, etc. find someone else. They can't guarantee that they know everything but if they won't even make an effort they are not worth working with.

One thing to keep in mind is that the realtor needs a very clear picture of what it is you are looking for. I was very up front with mine and he was able to check things out for me. He says he gets frustrated with people who do not want to tell him "everything" just tell him what they don't like about the places he shows them and he has to guess at what to show them next. Most realtors are not computer literate in my experience, but for long distances, some should be able to take some digital pictures in addition to the multi list before you make a long trip.

As a woman it is exceptionally hard for me to find the correct realtor - so many want to put me in a nice townhouse and be done with it. I usually can tell right away if it's someone I want to work with because they will work with what my wishes are.

If that realtor was worth their salt they would have lined up several other similar properties, after sending you the information on them ahead of time to see if they were possiblilities so that your trip was not a waste if that one place did not work out. They would also have been up front about what the condition of the place was like before you made the trip.

Good luck on your search!

Debbie

__________________
Visit my new blog: deberosahomestead.wordpress.com

When we bought our land the agent lied to us twice. Never believe anything said orally. Of course, without the lies in writing there is not much you can do later. We still love our place but the items she lied about still bug me.

When we sold our old house another agent handled the transaction. When she brought the first offer to me it was substantially lower than what we had listed the house for. We had the home in spotless freshly painted and carpeted with a new central heat/ac unit. They also expected us to pay all closing costs. My agent said you HAD to make a counter offer. I told her no I didn't in a nice but firm way. She said I was crazy. My thinking was that if we were so far apart on price it would be better to not even bother with these people. Well my agent sure had to bite her tongue when the people made a new offer which was only a few hundred dollars less than what we asked. They were begging for the house ASAP. I was real close to complaining to the agency about her attitude but again it was all verbal. Anyway it was kind of funny at the closing. She was still a little miffed.

I sure hope I never have to use an agent again! This is supposed to be our final home.

"...it was kind of funny at the closing. She was still a little miffed."

She made more on the commssion and still didn't like it?

Ken S. in WC TN

No, they do not.

Kenneth in NC

I've read this and other post and it seems you and your family are moving to get over your dad passing away sometime last year. Have you really thought this through? I looked at the pic's of your place and it looks like you have already developed your mini homestead. Has the relationship with your relatives improved any with the passing of time?

I know this is kind of off topic but I just got to wondering. As to Realtors there are some good ones and some not so nice ones. My daughter used a great one when she moved to Georgia. He answered her questions and even sent out a video of the house she was interested in. It's all a matter of slowing down and making the Realtor work on your timetable. If they think your a live one then like any good fisherman they'll reel you in.

I think your fighting a loosing battle trying to recoup your trip costs, maybe you could just forgive and (well forgeting is harder) mark it up as a learning experience.

WOW It looks like were not the only ones to have had a bad experience with real estate agents / brokers.

My DW contacted the realtor and like many here have said she flat out refused to reimburse any on the trip. She said that she hadn't been out to the property in a while and that TN has been experiencing some terrific thunderstorms with damaging winds. SO DW said maybe TN is just to violent (weatherwise) for us to live in. She also informed her that I intend to talk with someone from The Tennessee Real Estate Commission and with a representative at the United Country home office. Probably won't do any good but it might give a heads up to the next prospective buyer.

I've copied this thread for my DW to read. I'm sure she will be pleased with your comments and suggestions.

It's to bad the Realtor didn't work with us I found a property on the net this morning that we would have most likely put a offer on. Oh well time to start looking in another state might go visit Rockpile up in MO.

I doubt there is any area of the U.S. which doesn't experience some degree of extreme weather. I heard it hit 98 degrees in Orlando on Sunday. Internet headlines this AM on AOL say ten people died over the long weekend from storms. Moderate to heavy damage in IN, WV, TN and MO.

Here in TN we received about 4" of rain in about an hour with heavy winds. I have some limbs down and my neighbor's driveway washed down again. I'll clean up the limbs and grade my neighbor's driveway and we'll be back to normal.

So yes, winds could have blown those shingles off of the house without the realtor knowning about it. Doesn't sound like she outright lied about anything and may not even have grossly overexaggerated. Like spouses, there likely aren't any 'perfect' properties out there. Properly defects are what is used to knock down the asking price to what you are willing to pay.

The Internet listing includes another photograph of the back of the house. The front part has a wrap-around porch and it appears the back section has full decks on both levels. For a fixer-upper, the property would seem to have very good sweat equity value.

Where you are at now may come to look better and better.

Ken S. in WC TN

Kenneth,

Did you see the Tennessee property on the barter board. Not sure if that's what you're looking for, but it sounds like more honesty is involved, with a cheap price tag to go with it.

good luck

What you need is a 'buyers agent.' Some states have them, others do not. Here in Virginia, we do have that designation under which many realtors work. The idea is that he or she is your representative, legally liable as a professional with an obligation to represent your interests. Conversely, you agree to pay them if you buy a property within that area during the next X months.

I used a buyers agent to purchase my house last Summer and it was great. I didn't have to waste my time with any of the usual BS. I told her what would and would not be dealbreakers. We sat in her office for an hour, looking at listings while she gave me the 'real deal' on them. Then we found one that fit the bill, drove out to look at it and I made an offer the very next day.

She was paid out of the 6% standard commission already built into the price. State law requires listing agents to spilt evenly with a buyers agent just as they would with any other agent who brought the customer to the table.

I have no regrets and I am using her as a buyers agent again to buy homestead land this year.

-Cville_Jack

Have to add my thoughts to this:
I've dealt with many realtors in my land search and out of maybe twenty of them, I can name two, both independent, both sellers agents exclusively, I would recommend...with the usual caveats of course. The others have demonstrated such abysmal ethics, efficiency, professionalism, etc. that it is truly amazing that they manage to sell anything to anyone.
The two realtors I'd recommend consider it their duty as moral human beings to inform potential buyers immediately (first query) of any major drawbacks to a property. Despite this, or more probably because of this, they sell property like hotcakes. A major drawback to one person is often a major advantage to another. They both sell very rural property, often inaccessible by car...yet they've got maps on hand and information from the seller, and they'll tell you if they haven't personally seen it so you're forewarned it may be anything.
Anyway, I too have driven for hours and hours to look at stupid rubble piles, bogs, burned over wasteland ("it will be fully recovered in four years"...ten years have passed and it's still charcoal), etc. I've never made a trip without extensive phone and email discussion with the realtor, making sure I have survey maps in hand...but it doesn't matter. They will lie through their teeth. Just flat out lie.
Of course after you've driven for ten hours, then half an hour over a horrible dirt road, you're going to see the truth that they've been hiding. What do they think you're going to think of them then? Do they have any concept of what that does to their business? To the reputations of realtors in general? Do they think you're going to just chalk it up to a misunderstanding and ask them about their other listings?
Then on top of this is all the time and effort you went to beforehand to get them to return phone calls and/or answer their email. All the time you spent thinking about the place, wondering if it would work, planning your finances, etc. All down the tubes because the lying skunks are allowed to do just about anything to sell a property- essentially the realtor has stolen your time, your money, and your energy.
It just blows my mind that so many "professional" people can get away with behavior like this. In my experience with the state realty board, only a flagrant, public violation of federal law will make any impression. However, if the realtor is an associate of a larger firm, like ReMax, you can find the person's department head on the company website and call him or her to complain. Be specific, name names, and don't disguise your annoyance. That does get results...you'll probably get a phone call and an apology from the reprimanded realtor. Heartwarming but not much practical value.
Certainly 100% of realtors aren't bad, but I would say that the vast majority of them have simply cauterized their own consciences to the point of being amoral. Add to this severe laziness, greed, and the double-edged sword of incompetence, and there you have it.
If a realtor is going to show a house, it is logical for him or her to go there before the appointment and make sure it's up to snuff, looking as good as possible...after all, it is his or her job to sell it and most people of normal intelligence realize that no matter what has previously been said or unsaid about the house, the appearance is what makes or breaks a potential sale right off.
So for anyone to say that a realtor has too many listings to keep track of, or can't be expected to know all the properties they're selling is just a feeble and silly excuse for inherent incompetence. If they can't handle the demands of the job, they need to get into a different line of work. Besides, most of us learn at a young age that if you don't know the answer to a question, you simply admit ignorance...you don't make up lies.
As far as "professional lookers", they are easily discerned by any experienced salesperson. They exist everywhere, for every commodity, and their presence is no justification whatsoever for a realtor to be less than professional, efficient, courteous, and ethical when dealing with potential buyers. It's just another excuse for incompetence and laziness.
As professionals, realtors of all people should have an excellent grasp of what defines "ready to move in to". Subjectivity is inexcusable and even impossible when making a statement like that as a professional. The fact that words may mean one thing to one person and another thing to somebody else is called ambiguity. Ambiguity is merely one form of language use, and it certainly does not cancel out reality or the concrete meaning of words in an objective statement. Again, if a person truly can't grasp the difference between creative ambiguity and lying they shouldn't be allowed to sell anything professionally.
It's true that every home will have things that need or could use fixing, but there's a point when due to their severity or number it crosses the line to the shady land of "handyman special", or better yet, "currently unfit for human habitation". There's a bit of a difference in the normal expectation of a few fixable flaws and the actual need for major renovations. Casting buyers who reject a dwelling on the basis of its poor condition as unsophisticated or excessively picky is arrogant and ignorant.
If there's one thing more frustrating and unpleasant than being lied to, it's being blamed for not going to mighty effort to prevent a deception in the first place. Sort of the same argument as the infamous "she was asking for it".
My advice, in addition to complaining to this person's boss if she has one, would be to tell your friends, relatives, neighbors, anyone you run into that this particular realtor is a total snake. Since state boards don't do much, word of mouth and the resulting loss of business are our only means of cleaning up the stinking cesspool of real estate practice. Maybe someday we can drive all the bad apples out of business and realtors will be redefined as truly competent, ethical professionals who care about matching properties with buyers.
Meanwhile I wish you the best with finding that rare good apple and a wonderful place to live.

I got a EX that is a realtor and insurance agent. I don't know what was scarier. Seeing her slither through the grass looking for a her prey or hearing the squeek of the coffin lid when she woke up when the sun went down.
Shadowwalker

I beg to differ, Unregistered. It is not the realtors' job to go to a house/property prior to an appointment and make sure it "looks" good. That is the Seller's responsibility. The Realtor has been contracted by the Sellers to bring qualified buyers to see the property and advertise the property, make sure the sellers are, indeed, the legal owners, and that the required sellers documentation is available to potential buyers period. He/She may make suggestons to the sellers as to how to make the property look better, but only suggestions.

Reading all these bad posts about realtors made me think. Then I remembered I had a good realtor story. When I was very young and divorced with a 4 year old child I decided that the only way a poor person could make any money was to buy a house. I went to a realtor with my puny savings, and told her my price range. Since I made just a hair over minimum wage, it was pretty low. I had no credit good or bad. I paid all my bills on time though and I had a years worth of pay stubs showing how much OT I worked. Somehow this nice woman liked my guts and went to bat for me. I know she was on my side and I was successful at getting a loan on a cute little starter home. I ended up living there happily for 22 years. My son was raised in that home, with his own backyard to play in. I still think of that nice lady who sure didn't make much of a commission on that cheap little house I bought.

I agree, I had a realtor threaten a bank with cutting off all new business if they didn't get finished processing my loan. It was a tiny house - my first house since giving two to ex-husbands and they weren't in a rush to process it. I was living in the driveway of the place in the back of my pickup waiting - for over a month! The bank closed the deal two days later.

I think there is a confusion about the representation. I always get a buyer agent to work with when buying. The seller's agent has no obligation to look out for your interests, but the buyer's agent does when you are buying. Here in Washington there is not contract necessarily associated with that but in Denver I would sign a commitment with my buyer's agent that if I bought a house in the next 90 days I would use her as the agent. Plus you have a choice of who you want to work with when you work with a buyers agent, because if you take pot luck working with seller's agent not only are they obligated to serve the seller, but the average common denominator of this profession is a bit low. (Not lower than lawyers, but getting there :haha: .)

__________________
Visit my new blog: deberosahomestead.wordpress.com

Just a general question about the reality business. A $1M property is listed by Agent A in Agency #1. It is sold (closed) by Agent B in Agency #2. Can four claims now be made to that $1M?

- Listing agency
- Listing agent
- Selling agency
- Selling agent

If so, and you want the top 'selling' agent in the firm, how do you phrase the request so you get sales (closings) and not listing actions? If you just look at all of the listings for that agency it may look like one particular agent is named a lot. However, it may be they are very good at getting new listings and aren't particularly interested in the actual selling end of it.

Ken S. in WC TN

Well, actually it is only two claims, not four (listing office, selling office). The split between agent and broker varies due to how much business the agent brings in, and that is an internal thing. 50-50, 60-40 agent more, 60-40 broker more, etc. Some agents don't want to deal with buyers, and just list, others like dealing with buyers most of the time and don't list, unless it was a house they helped someone buy. It's probably cheaper business-wise just listing (less running around wasting gas), but more risky liability-wise (you can be held responsible for property defects that the seller didn't point out and you should have notified them of this).

The right property, priced correctly will sell itself without an agent, especially in a hot market, and you really have no way to check on that. Also, people have closing "issues" that you really can't blame on the agent--financial for the buyer, the seller refusing to fix this or that in a timely fashion, etc. This too, you can't check on.

I've seen lots of so-called "buyer's agent" advertising, and most if not all of them are still commission-based, so there is a conflict of interest built in right there--NO incentive to negotiate the lowest possible price for you, because it lowers their paycheck. All it is doing is giving the buyer a false sense of security as to who is looking out for them.

As to the agent knowing the condition of the property, if he is the listing agent, he does have an obligation to go check on things at least once a week to see who's visited the lockbox, make sure doors are secured, etc. Nothing like going to visit a vacant house with an agent, only to find someone's been squatting in the garage for months (detached garage, only 3 steps from the back porch). That is inexcusable.

I kind of answered around that question, sorry.

I guess it depends on what you mean by "really interested in selling". If you mean open houses, most agents will tell you that they are a waste of time (mostly neighbors checking out the decor) except that they can hand out a business card. Not everyone wants them either--do you really want potential burglars checking out your house and stuff?

If you mean ads in the color books, they will tell you that mostly people buy the houses not listed in them. Not to say they won't put your house in, but it is still the MLS that does the majority of the work. Someone asking for "ranch, x bedrooms, x baths, no pool, such and such area". The color books can't really do that as well, and there is the time lag.

A selling agent could (or their assistant) call/blanket mail the neighborhood about your house, and perhaps get a buyer that way, but you could do the same thing and save 1/2 the commission if you bring in the buyer, provided you write your agency contract to exclude those people specifically.

Well, never trust politicians, lawyers, mechanics, or real estate sellers...:-)

Seriously, it sounds like a dangerous place. I'd be running away as fast as possible. You might end up on that altar or something. No joke. There are strange people out there in the world today.

Unfortunately, any money you lost on this trip is lost for good. It does no good to spend more money on lawyers than you could ever get in return, so count it a lesson learned.

The advice I saw posted about getting an agent to represent your interests in buying is far better than trusting someone's agent for selling.

Ken S. In my area the listing Agency and the Selling Agency split the commission. All monies must go through the Owner/Broker's Trust Account./ The respective Owner/Brokers then dole out checks to the listing Agent and selling Agent according to their office's commission policies i.e. 20/80, 10/90 or in the case of national franchise companies the agents get 100% of the commission BUT they are also paying a monthly fee to the Agency for their desk, phone, etc.