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01/18/13, 08:25 PM
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"Slick"
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Moving from NM to TX, & back to NM.
Posts: 2,341
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Here is a nice write up on irradiation
http://www.physics.isu.edu/radinf/food.htm
Just another side of the issue.
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We will meet in the golden city, called the New Jerusalem,
All our pain and all our tears will be no more.....
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01/18/13, 08:30 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Eastern North Carolina
Posts: 34,198
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Quote:
So what is there to protect you from the germ covered hands and feces tainted rat feet that came in contact with that produce after it was irradiated???????
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I would imagine most products are done AFTER they are packaged
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ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
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01/18/13, 08:42 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 19,346
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GCM, thanks for the link.
Check out the thiamin levels in the irradiated vs the canned meats.
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01/18/13, 08:52 PM
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de oppresso liber
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,948
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Quote:
Originally Posted by highlands
Bad analogy. Your dissing is unnecessary.
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The point is most people don't take the time to edcuate themselves. They take what someone has told them, especilly if its something bad, and run with it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by highlands
Back in the first part of the last century people were taking quack irradiation pills and treatments for all sorts of things and that as causing cancer.
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And back then people were doing some stupid things with electricity, you point is?
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Originally Posted by highlands
Radiation has some very serious real dangers.
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So does electricity, IT CAN KILL YOU instantly. To me that's a very serious real danger but are we going to stop using it because of that?
Quote:
Originally Posted by highlands
Radiation of food is a concern because it can change otherwise safe molecules into carcinogens.
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Can you point to any peer reviewed study which supports your statement "Radiation of food is a concern because it can change otherwise safe molecules into carcinogens." or are you just parroting something you heard from someone else? I don't know of any but if you do I'd love to read them. The dose level needed to kill 'bugs' on food is so low and delivered for such a short period of time I really doing think you will find such a study.
Quote:
Originally Posted by highlands
Most of all, the government shouldn't force things. They should guide gently. There is a little thing called freedom.
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The gov sets regs based on what people want and for the most part people are either ignorant or stupid or both. Look at how the gov is currently looking to 'adjust' regs on firearms. Are any of these things based on studies or are they all based on political leanings?
Radiation is not the evil monster people seem to think. Over 20 years ago I held fuel pellets soon to be put in a fuel rod for a reactor in my hand with nothing more than a latex glove on and I have yet to get cancer nor grow a 6th finger.
__________________
Remember, when seconds count. . .
the police are just MINUTES away!
Congress has no power to appropriate this money as an act of charity. Every member upon this floor knows it. . .Davy Crockett
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01/18/13, 08:53 PM
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de oppresso liber
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,948
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bja105
A lot of Americans WERE introduced to electricity via the electric chair. Thomas Edison built one of the first electric chairs, using rival Westinghouse's Alternating Current instead of his own Direct Current, as a marketing ploy. Edison used the word Westinghouse as a verb, to execute via Alternating Current. The market still chose AC for power transmission.
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Not quite. Read your own post. He built it to show DC was safer than AC. That means people already knew about the good things electricity could do.
__________________
Remember, when seconds count. . .
the police are just MINUTES away!
Congress has no power to appropriate this money as an act of charity. Every member upon this floor knows it. . .Davy Crockett
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01/18/13, 09:24 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 19,346
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01/19/13, 07:28 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: NY - Finger Lakes Region
Posts: 1,047
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danaus29
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From the first link -
Quote:
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The radiolytic products formed by food irradiation are all found naturally in non-irradiated food, and the additional amount of these compounds formed is basically insignificant.[108]...Macronutrients (proteins, fats and carbohydrates) and minerals (e.g., iron, phosporous and calcium) are substantially unaffected by radiation doses at approved levels.[113] Some vitamins, particularly thiamine, undergo an appreciable reduction when exposed to radiation.[114] In approving irradiation of meat, FDA acknowledged that maximal use of food irradiation on meat would result in a decline in the amount of B vitamins consumed in the average person's diet.[115] In the totality of the diet, however, FDA determined that the average person's intake of these vitamins would be well above the RDA even in the "extreme case" in which all meats approved for irradiation were irradiated under approved conditions that would be most destructive to vitamins.[116]...Irradiation also has the potential to reduce the amount of vitamins in the target food, but in the context of an overall diet, an average consumer would still receive well in excess of the RDA for all nutrients no matter how much food is irradiated.
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From the second link -
Quote:
According to the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services’ Center for Disease Control and Prevention
(CDC), studies clearly show that, when done correctly, food irradiation provides a number of benefits:
• reduces or eliminates disease-causing germs;
• does not make food radioactive
• does not change the nutritional value of the food.
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From the third link -
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So my simple, straightforward answer remains the same: I know of no legitimate health complaints about irradiated foods.
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01/19/13, 08:44 AM
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Miniature Horse lover
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: West Central WI.
Posts: 21,249
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Yes, most people just read the headlines and never bother to read the entire articles or articles. Like I said it is not bad, and has been used for many years now, and other countries as well.
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01/19/13, 08:50 AM
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Central WI
Posts: 5,399
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Another "scary" thing that gets dredged up every year or so.
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Deja Moo; The feeling I've heard this bull before.
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01/19/13, 11:02 AM
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de oppresso liber
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,948
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danaus29
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Everything done to food changes its nutritional value. You have to balance that change what you get in result. Canning green beans changes their nutritional value but the fact it allows you to preserve them counter balances that change.
__________________
Remember, when seconds count. . .
the police are just MINUTES away!
Congress has no power to appropriate this money as an act of charity. Every member upon this floor knows it. . .Davy Crockett
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01/19/13, 12:42 PM
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Moderator
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Ontario
Posts: 12,685
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollowdweller
I don't fear irradiation.
However I do think that part of the reason is it allows big producers to be able to be dirtier in production yet not sicken anyone.
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This.
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Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and good with ketchup........
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01/19/13, 12:45 PM
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Moderator
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Ontario
Posts: 12,685
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If I can just remind everyone to make an effort to not offend, (or be easily offended) be judgemental, or rude when discussing topics, it would be much appreciated. Thanks! 
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Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and good with ketchup........
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01/19/13, 01:34 PM
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Miniature Horse lover
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: West Central WI.
Posts: 21,249
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollowdweller
I don't fear irradiation.
However I do think that part of the reason is it allows big producers to be able to be dirtier in production yet not sicken anyone.
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Yes that is the truth.
Anybody ever watch the show called "How They Do It? That is on Discovery and Science Channels.
And another new one just started up on Discover America called "Food Nation"
And you see just how fast those lines operate. Some a blinding speed. So fast that the camera can't even pick up the movements.
They either have to slow down the line or have cameras that will do slow motion.
The fact being with as fast as lines move in the producing of food products they have to do something like this irradiating because of things that "might" sneak through.
Even magnets trying to catch small particles of machinery that is running so fast.
Sometimes some small pieces of metal Does Make it through then a recall is issued.
The point being as fast as food is canned, as fast as meat is cut, as fast as meat is packaged it really is a miracle that we have food as save as it is today with as much as being canned, packaged and handled.
So this and other things are being done to make sure the food is healthy and safe to eat.
Watch some of those shows once in awhile it may just open some eyes as to how things are handled and trying their best to make sure everything is safe for human consumption.
You may not agree with it thats fine, that is why a lot on here grow their own food. But the masses over 300 million to feed in the USA alone and more around the world want their food Fast, want food easy to prepare, want food that is and looks nice.
And as cheap as possible
"Presentation is everything".
That is the way it is in todays fast paced world.
Last edited by arabian knight; 01/19/13 at 01:46 PM.
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01/19/13, 02:55 PM
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Moderator
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Ontario
Posts: 12,685
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Its true fast food is king these days and thats the downfall of people trapped in that dominion. If anything upsets the modern food chain people will starve or poison themselves because they can't cook! It's sad really! but Canada went through the Maple Leaf and XL foods meat issues and scary as it is most meat goes through these plants to our tables. I'd rather have irradiated manure than steaming fresh but seriously I'll grow my own and use a local butcher who I know personally as long as I can! Then once the govt. has run my local butcher outa business, as a dottering old fool, I will butcher my own. And hopefully, god willing I will die old, and my kids will know how to do the same! I'd think it hopeless except my son gets it!
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Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for you are crunchy and good with ketchup........
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01/19/13, 04:38 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Ohio
Posts: 19,346
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Steve L. you actually provided the quotes that prove my point. Regardless of the fact that Americans consume more than enough thiamin daily, irradiation still depletes thiamin levels in treated food.
watcher, of course processing changes food nutritional levels. Even dehydration depletes vit C levels in fruits and vegetables. But dehydrator companies are not going around saying that dehydration does not change the nutritional value of the treated food. Just setting around depletes some nutritional value of foods. Should that give the EPA license to LIE about said depletion?????
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01/19/13, 07:21 PM
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Missin Sweet Home Alabama
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Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 879
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I don't trust anything that has anything to do with radiation. But then again I don't trust big ag either. I grow for my family because that's the only way to be sure it's 100% safe.
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01/19/13, 07:47 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 4,724
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Of course an irradiated chive isn't going to kill you.
But when everything you buy at the grocery store is drained of nutrients, you're gonna end up with a lot of sick people. Clearly, that is where we are as a nation.
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01/19/13, 08:05 PM
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de oppresso liber
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,948
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arabian knight
Yes that is the truth.
Anybody ever watch the show called "How They Do It? That is on Discovery and Science Channels.
And another new one just started up on Discover America called "Food Nation"
And you see just how fast those lines operate. Some a blinding speed. So fast that the camera can't even pick up the movements.
They either have to slow down the line or have cameras that will do slow motion.
The fact being with as fast as lines move in the producing of food products they have to do something like this irradiating because of things that "might" sneak through.
Even magnets trying to catch small particles of machinery that is running so fast.
Sometimes some small pieces of metal Does Make it through then a recall is issued.
The point being as fast as food is canned, as fast as meat is cut, as fast as meat is packaged it really is a miracle that we have food as save as it is today with as much as being canned, packaged and handled.
So this and other things are being done to make sure the food is healthy and safe to eat.
Watch some of those shows once in awhile it may just open some eyes as to how things are handled and trying their best to make sure everything is safe for human consumption.
You may not agree with it thats fine, that is why a lot on here grow their own food. But the masses over 300 million to feed in the USA alone and more around the world want their food Fast, want food easy to prepare, want food that is and looks nice.
And as cheap as possible
"Presentation is everything".
That is the way it is in todays fast paced world.
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I've never found a bug in a bag of greens I bought at the store but I have picked them out of my plate, after being cooked, when mom washed home grown ones in the kitchen sink. Which one sounds 'cleaner' to you?
__________________
Remember, when seconds count. . .
the police are just MINUTES away!
Congress has no power to appropriate this money as an act of charity. Every member upon this floor knows it. . .Davy Crockett
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01/19/13, 08:09 PM
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de oppresso liber
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,948
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gunsmithgirl
I don't trust anything that has anything to do with radiation.
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Why not? I'm really curious why you are so afraid of it.
You are exposed to it every day. Do you refuse to have a microwave in your house? A cell phone?
__________________
Remember, when seconds count. . .
the police are just MINUTES away!
Congress has no power to appropriate this money as an act of charity. Every member upon this floor knows it. . .Davy Crockett
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01/19/13, 08:16 PM
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Miniature Horse lover
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: West Central WI.
Posts: 21,249
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Quote:
Originally Posted by watcher
Why not? I'm really curious why you are so afraid of it.
You are exposed to it every day. Do you refuse to have a microwave in your house? A cell phone?
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How about those folks that have inferred heaters? That is a form of radiation plain and simple. Just that some keep thinking that ALL radiation is bad from the atomic age and scary bombs and stuff. And it is not, when used as directed to cleanse or disinfect things.
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