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I just read your original post again, and it seems as if the food security part of it is your biggest issue. If so, WIC and SNAP will round out your budget for those items.
But what bears examination is that you sacrifice $60ish that could be in your food budget to have Sunday Night Football. At some point, you may want to examine those priorities. I am not being judgmental. When my kids were small, I stayed home while my (not college educated) DH worked (still does) a very hard, physical job for not much more income than you are taking in. I know it is very difficult to feel like always being "the mean one" that says "Oh yeah, you work hard but the Dish has to go, we can't afford it." I understand wanting a spouse to have a luxury from their hard work. Now that my kids are older, I work at a retail store part time and the only thing it pays for is the internet and my DHs precious Dish TV :) But that is how our marriage is set up and we are both satisfied. So far as the housing goes, if you have to move to town for more affordable housing, etc, then do so and do not beat yourself up as if it were some type of failure. We all learn from our experiences. Just because something doesn't work out or our circumstances change doesn't make it a mistake. You said your DH is new to country life - make sure also that you are not hanging on to the drafty country rental just to prove you weren't wrong, etc. I don't mean that to sound negative. My DH occasionally comes out with an "I told you so" about some issue and I hate it and I have made mistakes in the past or wasted $, etc just to try to avoid that. I'm older now and have more grains of salt to take it with now :) Anyway if food security is your issue, it is easily fixed, but also try to sit down, and get a bit of a life plan on paper. Plans for the future. It makes your dreams very achievable. |
Cutting, reducing and making changes to your expenditures will all help and this is always the first step to figuring out a budget that works but eventually you reach a point where you have cut to the bone and there is nothing to cut that will not adversely affect your health and future. This is when you have to seriously increase your income. You have to really look at the math. It does not lie. Sometimes you have to put your dream on hold until your are better prepared for it.
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I would not sell the car you are making payments on. You have already taken the deprecation hit on it so in the long run you really would not be saving money. |
Another thought I had is to see if you could lease out the property (the hunting rights only) to a hunter or group of hunters. Of course you would need to check with your land lord. In my area you could probably get around $2000 for 40 acres.
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I agree with everyone on the TV. I am not the final decision maker in the house so we can leave that one alone. It is not changing. DH is a great guy, we all have things that we are stubborn about.
As far as gov't programs. I have no pride about that. I have know people who abuse the system and I am not one of them. I would rather not but, life is what it is. We are responsible people who are doing the best we can. That being said. I don't think that we would qualify until the baby is born and even then, seems we are really close to the line. Something to think about though. I think that we will try a little longer. DH had a rough childhood with severe financial difficulties and moving a lot. This stresses him out more than me. I am going to do as you all have advised and just keep looking for ways to make cuts. Food is the biggest concern right now so as we hit spring and summer and I can get or grow cheap produce and preserve, along with the chickens, maybe we will see a big difference. I agree about the house being a $$ drain, but the trade-off is no water bill so, I guess we are really breaking even there. I handle the $$ so that is why I sought advice. Sometimes it can be hard to be the "bad guy". But it makes my dh really stressed and he admits that he is not frugal so we work better this way. I will make changes. Thanks for the advice and encouragement. It's not so bad, just requires effort and patience. |
I can tell you for a fact that with your DHs income and 3 kids and with you being pregnant, you will qualify at least for food assistance. I applaud your efforts, but do not go without food.
Congratulations on your pregnancy and good wishes for a peaceful term, in any case. |
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I see lots of beans and rice in your future. I as a single can eat beans for a week straight which saves lots of money. You can make flour tortias instead of buying bread. The difference is dollars. Read the sticky tighwad tips adn frugal things in countryside families found here: http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/6355163-post1.html |
What do you mean you are not the final decision maker? That is ridiculous. You are responsible for making the too little money work so as not to stress out your husband and you are worried about being able to feed your children but you bow to a satelitte dish because of an immature and selfish husband?
We have been dirt poor and never gone on charity or social services because we made the necessary choices and changes. We really did without. Before I would go on food stamps I would get a better or another job, cut everything and sell everything of value. If that satelitte is costing you $50 or $80 or $100 a month that is food for your children. If you don't need to use it today it can stay in the bank and build up so that you have a little in reserve. |
I agree, ditch the satellite.
We have 7 kids. 1 is out of the home now. My husband rarely makes $30,000 a year. My oldest son helps out, but he has only been working the past 9 months, so we have lived off a low amount all of our married life. We started out renting this place, but the rent was only $50 a month, so we weren't throwing much money away. We used our own money to put insulation in the attic. That made a big difference. We were finally able to buy the house & 3.5 acres from our landlord in 2003. We have since remodeled & made the house much better. You would be surprised how much a little insulation & caulk will save on your heating bill. Ours is an old farmhouse too. It was built in 1930. We put out a big garden, always have. Have chickens for meat & eggs & rabbits. Goats for milk & have gotten some Dexter cattle a few years ago. This was a slow process to get built up to where we are now. I put in fruit trees, grapes, & berries also. Yard sales, rummage sales, & Goodwill are your friends for clothes for the kids. Let others know you will happily accept hand-me-downs. I had a lot of people give me clothes for the kids. Glean whatever free food you can from whoever will give it to you. I get apples all the time for free. I have also gotten cherries, & a lot of different garden produce. Once you have the set up, canning your own is cheaper. It's also better for you. Buy beef & pork in bulk if you can. We get a beef every year & also a pig. I raise chickens to butcher also. More money up front, but way cheaper in the long run. If you get a nice tax refund look into stocking up on meat & non perishables. |
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Your opinion does not offend me and I hope that I have not offended you. But I already spoke to the issue and said that it was not something that is changing right now. |
[QUOTE=vanet;.
P.S. What really ticks me off is all the bystanders that tell us how "Lucky we are." Luck had nothing to do with it.[/QUOTE] It's funny, Vanet, the harder you worked, the luckier you got! |
You say your DH is the one who makes the decisions.... So sit your DH down and show him a line-by-line budget. Explain that you need something to give and ask his help in figuring out what can be done. Hopefully seeing it all in black and white will help your DH see that the satellite is something that is not necessary and that is draining your bank account :yes:.
If your DH refuses to allow you to cut off the satellite, then you'll have to start making more vegetarian dishes - lots of beans and rice - so you can have the wiggle room you need in your budget. If DH complains, you :shrug: and say "On our current budget, this is the best we can do. But I'm open to reviewing the budget with you again to see if we can figure out a better way to allocate our funds." Put that ball right back into his court where it belongs. I'm sorry that your DH had a financially unstable upbringing, but that's not an excuse for him burying his head in the sand and forcing HIS KIDS to have a financially unstable upbringing as well. Plus he's clearly stressing you, his wife, out with the financial situation, which is equally unfair to you. FWIW, check out your local health dept - many of them offer free or low-cost birth control. Or (to be blunt) go to the drug store and buy condoms - and make sure to include that cost into your new budget as well. They may seem $$ but if they save you the cost of another baby, they'll be worth it. |
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Let me say this. I do not feel like anyone owes us anything. Do I believe that all humans deserve to have housing, water, food and adequate clothing? Yes. Do I feel that hard work is required? Yes. If there are special circumstances, illness, lack of employment, etc, that there should be suppport for those individuals? Yes. I never mentioned gov't assistance, or asked how to apply for it. It was brought up by other posters who heard what I was saying and were offering warm, well-intentioned advice.
Is every choice my husband and I make the right choice? NO! We obviously made stupid choices in our younger years and did not envision that the floor would drop out on a shaky economy. We were unprepared just like so many others. I regret not thinking longer, planning smarter. Lesson learned. That being said, I respect the opinions posted here and have digested them all day. Still, personal assumptions about who we are, who my husband is are not, for lack of a better word, fair. I am far from perfect and need to work harder to maintain the goals that I originally set out to accomplish. This pregnancy has slowed me down, but still, I need to push a little more. Lazy never got anything done. Could dh give up the TV, sure. But if he doesn't, he is not the worst person in the world. I will keep working on him about it, but in the meantime, I will try to do the best I can. And since he never complains, I will work with him because to this day he has never suggested I get a job or placed any blame on me for anything and I don't want to start placing blame on him. |
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Do you meal plan? I find it much easier to control the grocery budget with strict meal planning.
I have about a 30-day rotation of meals. If times are tight, rice n beans does come up in the jukebox more often, but planning well ahead with what I have on hand and what's coming in seasonal, or stored (I can tell you my household is already tired of squash prepared in all its wonderful variations) is a HUGE step toward controlling those costs. When we were flat broke (still are not far from there LOL), I made a list of everything I HATED and RESENTED spending money on, and looked for ways to eliminate those expenses. I am a FREAK about the water bill. The kids have a shower timer, and I redirected our washing machine drain to the garden, etc. Not ideas specifically for you, just in the spirit of really looking at what you spend your $ on and where you can save. Most people when they make more, spend more. It is often easier to cut costs and save on what you are already making. |
Your the one whom asked for advice...we gave you advice for you to pretty much make excuses for why xyz wont work for you..I wish you the best!
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Am I more stressed, maybe, but marriage is like that sometimes. When I evict my temporary tenant, then I will feel more in control and able to do more so I am sure that will make a difference. As far as the other issue, that is high on the priority list so no worries there! |
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That and I am sure that we could be a little better about planning. Things have been a bit out of sorts lately and I think that when I am tired, everything falls apart so I need to get back on the good foot!! |
quote: "I am trying to cut every corner I can and still the floor keeps dropping out.
I rarely have gas in the family car for more than a week because I have to schedule Dr's appointments and whatever shopping, town runs, etc the week he gets paid and I can fill up. DH is a HARD worker. He has been with his employer for 15+ years. They value paper over experience so he has seen younger workers come in and take jobs that he has to train them for that are higher than his own...in pay and rank." You asked for opinions and advice so you are getting them and unfortunately even with sugar they aren't palatable. The reality is that you are very poor and getting poorer and there does not appear to be a change in income and employment standards any time soon. Fifteen years? and no advancement? and no possibility because he lacks the credentials. You have no safety net for you kids. What happens if the sole bread winner cannot go to work because of layoff or illness? I guess he can watch TV. I understand why you defend your husband to any criticism from people on line with excuses (loyalty) but they are just that - excuses. The very least that he should be doing is cancelling the satelitte payment to use that money to advance his career - get the paper he supposedly needs. You say you have to have the internet for his 2 work days at home so you are already part way to paying for an on line diploma or degree. Instead of watching TV on his days off he can study. I saw your situation all the time in my business and there comes a time when you have to face the fact that you are not earning enough to meet your responsibilites to your children. You may think that punishing your husband for his stubbornness about the satelitte with more beans and rice is a clever way to handle your situation but you are punishing your kids as well and not improving anyone's life. |
I would be careful about chickens. They eat a lot and feed is expensive. You don't make much money when you have to buy feed, in fact it usually costs. The real advantage is knowing what you are eating. I don't know that right now you can afford that or any animals. They can't be counted on for food until its in the freezer.
I would not only take the tax ductions you are allowed, but if yiou haven't been getting the earned income credit I would file amended returns for the last 3 years. Paying more in taxes than required is not wise. I would also apply for WIC and food stamps. If you don't qualify you reall y need to change the amount you are paying in taxes- or figure out why the taxes are so much. I would personally rather live in town or a smaller house for several years and then be able to buy a place of my own. If you don't listen to Dave Ramsey you should. He will give you some good ideas. Read the tightwad tips here, get the Tightwad gazette from the library, look at long term plans rather than what you want today. Good luck. |
It sounds to me like they are two different kinds of people. One who wants to sacrifice and become more self sufficent, and one who doesnt. That is a hard thing to combat. I have seen it sink many people. Good luck
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Back to chickens. Keep your eyes peeled for OSB in trash piles on the side of the road. I often see slightly less than whole sheets being discarded. Troll craigslist as well, for all sorts of stuff, amazing what you can find cheap/free. When you buy your chickens, I wouldn't buy more than 5 or so hens. You can probably make up a lot of their feed with kitchen scraps and keep purchased feed to a minimum. Use leaves off the property for bedding, when you get a nice deep layer of compost in the coop, rake it out and put it in the garden. Chicken expenses have to be tightly managed to achieve a net gain compared to store bought (disregarding quality). Keep detailed records and if it doesn't net out in the black, I'd hang it up for a while until cash flow improves.
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If you haven't covered the windows with plastic "storm" windows I would do it now. The ones you use a hair dryer on are quite clear and they shoul really help with heating and cooling an old house. If the ductwork runs in the attic or crawl space it may not cost such to wrap the ducts n insulation and save money. Be sure the ducts are not pulled apart anywhere. This can happen and you are heating the out doors. Keep the furnace filters clean as well this will also help lower the bill. Use draft stoppers inside the doors to keep the heat in. Close off part of the house if you can and turn off the heat in any unused room.
I would sit down and go over the budgets with your DH and ask him to help you find ways to cut corners and/or raise you income. |
okay. I am going to take all the wonderful advice - everything that everyone has said - and use it to make better choices. I appreciate everyone taking time out of their day to write and offer guidance, tough love, and encouragement! I think being brought to reality regarding the house and changes needed there, along with rethinking the van if possible or making other changes, small and large, is what I needed and I can assure you, your words have not fallen on deaf ears.
I am a strong person, thank goodness for my momma and her genetics! I am however, working hard on being a good wife and mother and since those are hard jobs at times, I don't know how to reply when certain comments are made. I get it, life is hard sometimes. Nobody signs up for the struggle. But I am sure that it will make me stronger. He has not left me and I am sure when I felt weakest, He carried me. So I am going to cut out and offer my sincerest apology if you feel I am flaking. I mean it when I say you ALL have been great and given me a lot to think about. All I can do is change me. And I intend to. Lots of thanks and best wishes!! |
BTA: I'm out of work and now with one infant (and one on the way) it is no longer cost-effective for me to get a job outside the home. My DH is a hard worker and he makes decent $$, but 33% of his take-home pay goes to his Ex to pay "child support" (i.e. it finances her pedicures, days at the spa, and trips out of state when we have their kids so she can visit her felon boyfriend :rolleyes:).
I had to sit my DH down when it became clear that I wasn't going to be able to get a job out here and go over the budget with him. He is a meat addict and insists on meat at every meal, and he eats a LOT of it too. DH works 2nd shift and when he comes home it's not at all unusual for him to pull 2 steaks out of the freezer and cook them for his dinner :eek:. It was driving our grocery bill up to the point that money was VERY tight...no wiggle room at all. I sat him down and showed him the budget and explained to him that his meat habit was wrecking our budget. He refused to budge, and told me to "make it work." I looked the budget over and really the only way to make it work is to keep the house at 77 degrees in the summer (instead of 68, which is where DH would like it to be) and to keep it at 68 degrees in the winter (instead of 72, where DH would like it). When he complains about it being too hot/too cold I :shrug: and tell him "this is what 'making it work' looks like, but if you want to revisit the budget I'm always glad to do that :thumb: !" So if you're already serving a lot of beans and rice and that still isn't helping you make ends meet, you have to look over the budget AGAIN and figure out where you can cut back. It's not going to kill your kids to have to wear a few layers of clothes in the winter, so cut your heat back by a few degrees. In the summer the babies can wear onesies or t-shirts and they'll adjust to having the AC cut down by a few degrees. Lots of people all over the world live without any heat or AC. It just takes adjusting to :shrug: And IMHO your DH should approach his boss/HR at work and have a talk with them about his career. He should sit them down and say "I love working here and I want to be the best employee that I can for this company. What do I need to do in order to be promoted?" and then he should make every effort to do what they say. He can take online community college classes - you'll qualify for Pell Grants, just fill out the FAFSA as soon as you get your 2012 tax info and it will tell you what he qualifies for. Check out the local churches and see if they have community dinner nights where anyone from the community can come and eat for free. If you don't have to pay for dinner once or twice a month, that will add up. Check out the local food banks. Check out WIC. Apply for food stamps. Call the Health Dept - they take insurance and also work on a sliding scale, so it may be cheaper for you to get health care for you and your children if you go there (you'll have to go there for your WIC anyway). If you don't do swagbucks, I highly suggest it. It won't make you rich but you can get Amazon gift cards (they have free shipping for orders of $25 or more) and that will allow you to get all kinds of stuff. You can get dehydrated fruit from them, clothing, diapers (disposable or cloth), and pretty much anything else you can think of. All you have to do is use their search engine when you search, fill out surveys, etc. Easy to do while the babies are napping and it's a good way to get a little bit more breathing room in your budget. |
I have a question for you that I didn't see you address, sorry if you did and I missed it. :) How attached is your husband to his current career? Does he see himself staying in it another 10 years or more? If so he definitely needs to make the investment in a degree so he can move up the ladder. My recommendation would be to find a smaller, cheaper place to rent for the next 2 years and put the money towards him getting that magic piece of paper that will increase his paychecks. Optimally his workplace will reimburse him for it.
If he isn't that tied to what he is doing now then maybe you should look at finding a different career in another cheaper state. There are plenty of states where you could rent a place in the country for $600 a month. At this point you are just treading water and hoping something big doesn't hit you and sink your boat. You have to do something. Like someone else mentioned there comes a point where you can't cut anymore. I know it's easier to hunker down and keep trying to eke along but you aren't helping yourself in the long run. Kudos to you for trying so hard to make this work and to give your kids a place in the country to enjoy. I think you are doing a good job with what you have. I just think stepping back and looking at the long term picture you would be better off sacrificing it for a couple of years in order to have that country home securely for the rest of your life. :) |
LOT of advise. Finacial situations are rough to get out of. Good fortune to you. We aways pay our tith and our selves first. know that is no comfort now but it is what we do.
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One car suggestion, if you can get by with not using your car for a while,you can pay only theft insurance on it, keeps the policy active and is very very cheap. Husband did that on a truck he rarely used. Call your ins. company. See what it would be like before you go and sell it to live without it.
Can you drive your husband to work and use his car a few days a week, or schedule your appointments etc on his days off. Can you barter with your landlord, for painting & fix up around the house for a discount in rent? Have you thought about a part time job or babysitting/pet sitting to bring in extra income? Just suggestions, good luck! |
Cut the lady some slack, folks. She asked for advice, but doesn't need the moral lectures. Personally, if I were she, I would quit responding. She already has all the ideas she needs. And in my opinion, the determination. Is this turning into another GMO thread??????
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I had forgotten about WIC and heating assistance, which you also qualify for right now. Dealing with a little bit of paperwork and bureaucracy could put you in a much better situation. God bless. |
holliehmstd, first let me give you a cyber hug....:grin: second....I can understand the satellite thing with DH. My DH loves his football games, in fact all sports games! So I can relate, especially knowing my DH is a good man and worked very hard before he retired. He worked 7 days a week working at the firehall and running his own fence business on his days off. If I were in your shoes that would have been the last thing I would have asked him to give up, although he would if need be....but I understand your dilemma. I don't know what your internet, nor satellite consist of but is there some way to bundle it or is there a way to watch the games on the internet? I also know that Sunday games are sometimes on regular local channels at least here they are. Hang in there, you two, will get it worked out...
Do you have an Aldi's that you can shop at......their food for the most part is cheaper than Krogers or Publix. There food is just as good as brand name food and they double your money back if you are not satisfied. I can't give any more advice than what has been said previously..just remember on forums you take what you can use and leave the rest...:thumb: Wishing ya'll the best... |
With your income and the number of children you have, you would qualify for the Earned Income Credit, which you can take in your paycheck. You got dinged because you had 2 incomes, now you only one.
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With the new child on the way you can also sign up for Amazon Mom, which is basically an Amazon Prime account for free for the 1st year. My wife did the math with our 1st child and the price per diaper was cheaper than generics at the big box stores. After the 1st year was up and you didn't get the free shipping it was not a good deal to pay for it.
P.S. As my info is a couple of years old you would want to double check on this, as things may have changed. |
You also need to start networking through church or local civic clubs etc. When I worked for the Sheriffs dept (I quit last May so this is recent) we knew of folks like you who were food insecure and when we had a deer hit we would call them to see if they wanted to go harvest it. We also have several food bank stores in this area that help people in situations like yours. Lots of things you can do to make your house more energy efficient and some have already been mentioned but I would also go back to your landlord and ask him if he would be willing to buy the materials and you do the labor. I used to own 3 rental properties and did this all the time with willing tenants.
Livestock of any kind, including chickens, are expensive to maintain and I would advise putting that off until your more financially able. Maybe having 4 or 5 layers for your own eggs would be useful but if you think your going to make money on selling eggs its a pipe dream. Sounds like you only need one vehicle since you dont work so get rid of your husbands vehicle and let him drive the van to work. You have it stuck in your head about taxes but with your income your one of the 47% in this country that pays zero net federal income tax. Its already your money sitting there that could help you out. Start learning how to forage and gather, in Virginia there are lots of berries, nuts, wild onions, ramps, mushrooms, etc. But the bottom line that people are trying to tell you is that if your husband has been working at a place for 15 years and he makes $12.50 an hour it time for him to re-examine his career. If he wants to keep the job for medical benefits or for the security then he needs to get a second job. A lot of us work or worked 2 or 3 jobs when our own times were tough and its just the sacrifice you have to make sometimes. I pay a young man $10.00 an hour to do farm labor for me, mostly pounding T-posts and digging and it takes zero skill. I use him on weekends or his other off time and the couple hundred a month he earns from me makes a big difference in his ability to support his wife and baby. Me paying $10 an hour is considered a high wage here but until I found this guy I couldnt find anyone willing to work or stick with it. Lots of farmers in my area struggle to find laborers and you might be surprised to find employment opportunities abound for unskilled part time farm work. But it gets back to the networking I mentioned earlier, you typically get referred for these kind of jobs through a local and if a church or other community group knows your looking for part time work, they will often steer you in the right direction. Good luck. |
Hollie, I just want to add that I admire you and your husband for what you have accomplished to date. I wish the world had more two parent households that were striving to live what was once the American Dream. I remember well our young years with small children and how hard it was. Keep doing what you are doing and I think you will do well in the end!! God bless!
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One other thought I had this afternoon, you should be getting most of what you pay in federal taxes back with 3 children and such a low income. Your husband should get some deductions for his home office too since he works from home part of the week. You may want to have someone look at your taxes, H&R Block does a free check. :)
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Hi Hollie,
Thought and prayed for your family on and off throughout the day. I wanted to add a couple of more thoughts to my original reply. First, I've known of people that have been loyal to their companies to a fault. I know it is never easy to switch jobs or consider moving, but I'm sure your husband must have good professional references that he can contact about other employment opportunities. After working for 15 years at one company and still only bringing home $24K a year doesn't show much loyalty from the company toward him. If he could find a job in a less expensive state for $35K take home a year, would that make it worth it for you to move? Only you can answer that question, but for me the answer would be yes. Secondly, you may have answered this and I missed it, but your take home income is actually higher than $2000 a month if you count the health insurance amount your husbands employer takes out. If that amount is higher than $300-400 per month, I would shop around for some relatively inexpensive major medical coverage. For a family in good health, and a $5000-$10,000 deductible, you might have a monthly premium of less than $250. Or, you could try a Christian Healthcare Sharing Ministry like Samaritan's Purse or Medishare. This is often times less than even major medical, though it does have some limitations on coverage amounts and Medishare will not share on preexisting conditions, though it does share on pregnancy and adoption costs. If your insurance premiums are sky high, I'd really look into just insuring yourself personally. I'm rooting for your family. I think you can live the dream, but I think if you and your husband sit down and carefully review your budget and explore options for each budget item, I think you can come up with a solution that will work for your family and still live your dream. QuietInTheLand |
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