Frozen hose

I buried mine, I used Black plastic pipe and ran it with the conduit for the electric out to my shop, Took a couple hours no big deal, I went down about two foot. I don't have water or elec out to the chicken coop yet, I haul water in buckets up there, And I ran and extension cord for the winter to keep water from freezing.

pile hay over it, put heat tape on it, as said above bury or use insulation. Have it down grade so it drains naturally every time..otherwise I don't know

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Brenda Groth
http://restfultrailsfoodforestgarden.blogspot.com/

Living in the land of zone 4a, we've looked into those electric hoses. Check out the reviews, they seem to indicate that they work great for a season or two, and then poop out. Not something you want to put alot of effort into burying, plus, if you're burying it then you don't NEED the electric.

We've found gravity to be the best, since here we would have to bury the line 6 feet. We found a high spot in between our trough and our well pump. Ran 2" pvc down each way from the high point, supported by rafters, or even clamped to a 7' Tpost. Works great!

You can get a hose reel, vertical, not horizontal, and rewind it after each use...... Winding it back up causes a screw action that forces the water backwards and out with each turn. Two reels aughta do it. And you can then take them inside for extra insurance......

Should work for all but the coldest weather, and........you will need a freeze proof water faucet from your house---that's one that has the actual valve on a long, very long, shaft that reaches inside your house to prevent it from freezing up and splitting.

Yes, eventually the goal should be to bury plastic, permanent pipe to a freeze proof hydrant at the barn.

geo

Will be a headache til you bury it. I live in a relatively warm climate and a 350' foot hose wood be nightmare in winter. The insulation I'm aware of would be rather expensive and a pain to install on that much hose..
I have a shut off on my outdoor plumbing and use air to clear the lines as someone already mentioned. works great. Just check the weather and only worry with it when the temp drops below freezing..

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When something just doesn't make sense, beware!

I to have to keep garden hoses laying down for long distances from the house to the barns during winter months, I think I usually have 3 100 foot hoses ran and this Is what works for me, click on this link for the adapter I use which I hook up to a portable aircommpressor. Always disconnect the hose from your house while not in use and then when done just blow the water out REALLY good and your done until the next time. I live in Middle Tn and we do get cold: Here is the link. Waterline Blow-Out Adapter | Mobile Home Repair

Forgot to say one thing, I also made me a small 3 or 4 foot garden hose i just made it short so when I do need to hook up to the water I have a flexiable hose that I keep in the house nice and warm to make the connection too.

I would bury it a foot under the frost line, for those random freak freezes or where the ground composition changes and can cause it to freeze deeper.
I drain my 250ft of hose, but I only have to refill every 3-4 days.
So, get water troughs and use them.

The air compression is the best. (if you are not putting it in here think 9-10 feet underground for years like this one --no snow deep freeze.)

I have had to do the insolation so here goes

supplies

lots of sill plate foam. Lowes, and home depot have it googe it to see what it is

cheap ele tate

shink wrap plastic on a roll think of the stuff they use to wrap pallets

heat cord


Directions
wrap in a sprial with the foam many layers between every few layers spiral the ele in a direction and then use the shrink wrap.

if you want to use a heat tape cord well tape that to the hose first and follow the above.


or get a reel hose and use it rewind bring in.

it is hard to deal with ele heat tape/cord runs up the bill fast--note ele rates are going UP compressor is great.

Burying poly below the frost line is the best solution.

If you want to keep it simple and cheap, cover the hose with something that insulates it. For this to work, the entire length of the hose must be insulated, including any faucets that are outside. You have to leave it alone, don't disturb the insulation. No driving on it, no walking on it, no shoveling the snow off it. Snow is a great insulator so you want it buried under snow. The pipe wrap is expensive. Cover it in about 8 inches of hay and extend the hay a foot to either side of the hose. In NC that should do the trick. On really cold nights let the water run very slowly. The moving water won't freeze as easily.

The idea of blowing the hose out with compressed air after every use may work. The problem is that a little water setteling in a low spot and freezing will plug up the entire hose.

Don't try to move a frozen hose, whether it's got water in it or not. They are not made for the cold temps and will break. If you have to thaw a frozen hose try a hair dryer or a heat gun.

Barn Yarns, Your building inspector will know how deep the frost line is in your area. Here it is about 5 feet.

I agree with the black poly line. If your ground is rocky, go with the 160 psi stuff rather than the regular 100 psi, it will resist kinks from rocks etc better. It needs to be buried in sand or soft dirt before backfilling with rocky stuff if you have rocks. We add a foot of straw(not hay) over the lines when running them under driveways. Normal for here is 6' deep, where you are should be less. A hydrant would be best at the end, and be sure not to ever leave a hose on it or it will freeze the hydrant! The depth of the hydrant is related to your bury depth, here, it would be called a "6 foot bury" hydrant, that leaves enough above ground to be practical.

The 160 psi line can be hard to work with if its cold out, I gently play a propane torch over the end to get it soft enough to go on the fittings.

I use all brass fittings, I hate when plastic fittings break. You can buy the poly line in 300' rolls, that makes only one splice (brass!!) A 1" line should be way plenty. I double clamp them at all fittings also, unless I have long barbs, then triple clamp them.

The hydrant willl drain back into the ground when the handle is closed all the way, so they dont freeze. It's best to put a nice large gravel bed around the bottom end of the hydrant when burying it so the water has somewhere to go.

I've done hoses in winter, its a pain in the behind! I only had to run them every few days to my motor home when living in it. I walked the hoses out to drain them (just hold it at waist level and walk it to get the water to run out, both ends have to be open). If you didn't get them drained well, you didnt get any water through them! Was really happy to get the cabin done and not have to use hoses any more. Insulating a 350' line could be done, but would be a lot of work and may get expensive. Blowing it out or walking it out may be best for temporary.

If you have a farm pickup or atv and trailer, it may work to get a tank to fill up and run water to the animals.

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"..I don't want to get to the end of my life and find I have not lived.." - H.D. Thoreau-

I'm in MN so a lot colder it never thaws over winter, but....

Bury it now, the cheapest and easiest solution.

There are no cheap and easy solutions.

Heating it with electric tape or the like will add to your electric bill like crazy.

Blowing it out with air every day requires a good compressor, electricity, adapters, and time.

Insulating it means it will freeze in a cold snap and wont thaw out for you when it does warm up and you can't get to it to thaw it out easy.

Coiling it up every day in a warm area isn't easy.

There are no good solutions, if you are going to burry it eventually, buy a roll of black pipe and burry it now. You got it easy, don't have to go deep like we do up here, 5 feet or more to be safe here.

For the electric question someone had, start a new thread. That is a whole new topic. For sure have a pro do the connections, with your experience level it is difficult to understand the difference between the ground wire and the neutral wire, they need to be separate. And so on with details, best left for anew thread. You can dig the 18+ deep trench and so forth.

Paul

Not an attractive proposition but farmers used to pile manure over pipes to keep them from freezing. The decomposition warms the area.
Maybe you could do a combination of all the things mentioned.

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.

I LOVE our heated hose. It's so wonderful to not have to bucket water.

Paul-how long should it take me to dig 10 feet down, 350 feet long ? It will only be freezing for another 120 days here. Longer than that ?

You have to go 10 feet?!

I'd guess in your area 4 would probably do it. If the ground isnt super rocky and hard you could likely rent a trencher that would do it fairly simply, or hire soemone with a mini-excavator, or just rent one yourself.

You can bury your electric conduit in the same trench in many places, if theres enough dirt between them. The grey plastic conduit is easy to use and doesn't cost that much. You may want to do a volt drop calculation to see what size wire you need, depending on what all you want to run off of it eventually, and how many amps of service you need, and use a large enough conduit to pull that size wire through without too much drama. 16-18" deep is usually required for burying a wire.

If you dont size the wire for the load and volt drop, it can burn stuff out from running on too low of a voltage. It isnt hard to calculate, there are online calculators. Asking here should steer you in the right direction about what you want to run and how much volt drop those things will tolerate without a problem.

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"..I don't want to get to the end of my life and find I have not lived.." - H.D. Thoreau-

Insulation isn't going to change anything at all in your situation.
Rent a "Ditch Witch" and you can have it buried in a day or two

He's in MN.

Your "frost line" is only about 10 INCHES
You can get by easily with just going 12-18", but I'd go at least 24" myself to protect it from being driven over with heavy vehicles

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ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

Okay-I understand how and why I should do it "right". Sadly, I simply do not have the cash to rent a Ditch Witch, buy the right piping, hook up the right spigot and bury my electrical line 3 weeks before Christmas. Come January after we sell our other place-we can do it.

But for the next 4 weeks I've got to do something to keep the water from freezing.

Until then I will move my compost pile since pipe insulation seems to also be too pricey. I can fill a 55 gallon barrel down close by the barn but I wonder if that will freeze, too. If I must I will tote buckets of water - I can move my compost pile and spread it 350 ft across the yard-these are fabulous ideas and I thank you very much. And I do have an air compressor (nothing fancy I don't think-just one that we use for tires and such) but is 350 ft a little long to try to blow air out of it?

Blowing it out with a compressor will work IF you get all the water out,
It's unlikely a barrel would freeze other than possibly the top few inches., especially if it sits in the Sun

You COULD get by just burying the hose you're using 12 Inches, which could easily be dug by hand, and won't cost you anything extra

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ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

I know it doesn't look like we are helping you much, but you asked for the cheapest easiest.

Doing it right the first time will be the cheapest and easiest.

Any other option listed here will cost you more over the long haul.

And yes, like others, I've been there, done that.

All of the ideas here will work, and whatever you are doing now will work, aut none of them are the easiest and cheapest.

We really are trying to give you the best advice, and it hasd been hard-earned - it sounds like - by most of us.

What is the building code in your area, how deep do you need to go to be below the frost line? Does 3 feet cover your area?

This is where we build up a network of friends and business associates. I don't like the commune or home owners association ideas, but we live in communities and build up a network of folks to borrow or work with.

trenching in 350 feet of water pipe with a drain-back spigot on the end is going to be the easiest and cheapest in the long run.

Doing some of the other things mentioned will cost you a lot more over 10 years, I just don't see thaqt as a good idea?

And so you are left with the harder, more difficult to do options. No 'easy' in that.

And again, I got the tee shirt, I know where you are at.

Edit -0h heck, I was thinking you were in a slightly colder state got myself confused, you have it easy in such a moderate climate. Do you need to go much more than 1 foot down? A fella with a one shank sub soiler could pull your water line in in a forenoon, and that gives him a lot of time for beer breaks.

If you are getting trenching done and you want electric out there, sure is nice to get all the dirt work done at once. But this started out just needing water, donno if you really need electric also?

Before the 1950's, tile was put in the ground by hand here, they dug the trenches 3 to 4 feet deep, layed concrete tile, and filled it in again. Now, that was work! 350 feet would probably be 2 days work for a crew of 2, but I understand times have changed a little, and they had special shovels to work in their typically wet sticky dirt.

--->Paul

A thin layer will not be enough. It needs to be thick enough to heat up, although I suppose on marginal days anything will be a help. I'd start piling fresh manure and cover with the bedding to hold the heat in.
Could you run it under some trees and bushes to help with the cold air settling? Or put some cut brush over the line. A pile of leaves might insulate too.
This may sound weird, but do you have anyway to slope the hose towards the animals? Or slope the other way too. Like raise it to the top of a fence and gradually fix it so it slopes? Than draining would be easy. I have no idea of your physical situation.

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For we used to ask when we were little, thinking that the old men knew all things which are on earth: yet forsooth they did not know; but we do not contradict them, for neither do we know.