My grandson is lying....about useless stuff.....

thesedays · #21 08/09/12, 01:42 PM

Where's his mother?

cathleenc · #22 08/09/12, 01:42 PM

Wishing you all lots of love, patience, and the will to perservere.

What about holding a family meeting, the three of you? Ask what the young fellow's ambitions/goals are for the next 5 years and talk through what needs to be done to get there. Let him know that you believe in him, that you are looking out for him, and that to get 'there' he has to be the one driving the wheel - with you for support.

In our household we always try to separate the deed from the doer - my kids are never bad kids they just make bad choices.

Let him know that he's a good kid, that you believe in him, and ask him what comes next. Don't treat him like a young child - but do let him know that you have clear expectations with consequences. Let him be a part of setting both the expectations and the consequences.

Sonshine · #23 08/09/12, 01:48 PM

Sounds like he didn't become as he is over night and it'll take awhile to turn things around. A lot of love, patience and prayer. As others have said, he has to get to the point where he trusts you and respects you. He has to get to the point that he understands that telling the truth will help him more in life than lies, even thought telling the truth is not always the easiest route.

mekasmom · #24 08/09/12, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luvrulz

And I need some help in how to deal with this....

it's the lying that creates the problem.

How can I break him of this?

You won't like my answer, but here goes.....
It is a spirit. He needs delivered. If his dad has the same issues then chances are it is a familiar spirit that follows the family line. Some ancestor back in the family line allowed it access by playing with it (allowing it to take over their life). See John 9 for some scripture reference on familiar spirits (spirits that follow family lines)
It's not the kid's fault. Punishing him won't stop it. He needs delivered.

luvrulz · #25 08/09/12, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pancho

Every person lies, some just aren't as good at as others.
Might as well try to stop him from breathing.

I don't think this is true at all. Even though he's a male - he can be truthful, honest and fair. he's got a strong faithfulness to God and is a Christian..... Not everyone lies - it's a learned behavior!

luvrulz · #26 08/09/12, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thesedays

Where's his mother?

His birth mother took him into child services in Florida when he was 2 yrs old. Told the desk clerk that if they didn't take him, she was going to kill him. My ex SIL is his father. He was married to my step daughter. My step daughter wasn't in a position then to legally adopt him, so he's just been with his birth father and his mean step mother.....

The kid has had alot of things go wrong in his short life. He's going into 8th grade and has attended 14 different schools.... We're attempting to give him some stability and non abusive living. Continuity with neighbors and buddies, some history in a good fashion....

BTW, his birth mother's parental responsbilities were cancelled long ago.

jwal10 · #27 08/09/12, 06:11 PM

Sounds like he never learned to be responsible for his actions. I see it with parents that don't discipline their kids. They just keep saying "Next time...." or "When your father gets home...." and then get mad at the child without taking the time to explain the bad behavior and what is the proper behavior. He will learn this but you have to stay right on it/him. Each time he lies he needs corrected to learn the right behavior. He will learn what you expec and the concequences of bad behavior. Make sure he gets extra fun oppertunities when he does his chores right. Do things together. Kids want to do right but they need to know that they can trust you and that the consequences are the same/ steady/ equal all the time. He needs to know what trust is and that he can trust you....James

pancho · #28 08/09/12, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by luvrulz

I don't think this is true at all. Even though he's a male - he can be truthful, honest and fair. he's got a strong faithfulness to God and is a Christian..... Not everyone lies - it's a learned behavior!

If there is anyone that tries to tell you that all people do not lie they are telling a big one right there.
That should be proof enough.
Yes, it is a learned behavior. Every child around the age of 3 learns how to lie. There have been experiments done.
Since everyone lies a child can learn it very easily.

kimmom2five · #29 08/09/12, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bluemoonluck

Some good advice here. Start with this, and see if it helps. Chronic lying becomes almost a compulsion and its hard to break

In extreme cases of lying teens, I have recommend doing this:

Figure out what would be an awesome trip for him - day at the amusement park, for example. Tell him on a Monday that you're going to take him this weekend, and talk it up all week long.

Saturday morning, wake him up and have him get ready. Get into the car, start the car, and back a few feet down the driveway..... then put the car back into park and turn it off. Turn to him and say "Well, I lied. We're not going anywhere today." Give him a minute or two to process this, then say "You know the way you feel right now? That is EXACTLY the way I feel every time YOU lie to ME. It doesn't feel very good, does it? Now that you know how I feel, lets promise each other that we won't lie to each other EVER AGAIN."

This has to be reserved for EXTREME lying, not just for average kids who lie here and there.

If he lies to you after this, look at him square in the eye and say "Remember the amusement park incident? Think about it....Do you want to live your life wondering if I really mean what I say? Because I know I don't want to live my life constantly wondering if you really mean what you say."

That is completely horrible!!! She would never have a chance of overcoming his behavior if she did something like that!
Positive behaviors as a reward for telling the truth will work much better than punishments. Something that is neither but might help are things like the movie Peter and the Wolf and similar things might help teach him.

Shygal · #30 08/09/12, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mekasmom

You won't like my answer, but here goes.....
It is a spirit. He needs delivered. If his dad has the same issues then chances are it is a familiar spirit that follows the family line. Some ancestor back in the family line allowed it access by playing with it (allowing it to take over their life). See John 9 for some scripture reference on familiar spirits (spirits that follow family lines)
It's not the kid's fault. Punishing him won't stop it. He needs delivered.

wow..........

luvrulz · #31 08/09/12, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RamblinRoseRanc

I like the idea of a checklist. He may really be lying because he forgot to do something or forgot the steps involved and without prior support and help just gave up.

Maybe approach it with 'Hey, Grandson. I just thought of something today. With school starting and all the work here on the farm and in the bakery it may take us some time to get things back in a routine we are all comfortable with. Will you help me write up a list of the stuff we do here and what needs to happen when?'

Maybe having him help will give him the confidence he needs to see that lies aren't needed and open his eyes to what could suffer if he lies about doing things.

We all sat down and talked tonight and I just asked how he forgot, if it was the excitement of the first day at school and all that's been going on?! He says he just forgot..... I asked him how we could help him to remember that it was his responsibility to feed the chicks, the hens and collect the eggs? He said I needed to remind him every morning. So, then I asked him if that was fair to ask me to remember something that he couldn't remember?? Well, I told him that I couldn't be relied on to remember.... So what what was another idea he thought would work...

And I will not spank him - I physically can't...besides, that makes me no better than his dad.....

His teachers think he's the sweetest kid, he's a big help and I will keep all these ideas in mind. He doesn't lie too often, it happened alot more often when he first got here so...I think we're still all adjusting still and will continue that whole amazing process....

houndlover · #32 08/09/12, 09:17 PM

You better make time to follow him around, because tomato staking is what he needs.

Marshloft · #33 08/09/12, 10:14 PM

I read some of the responses ,, but not all,, I agree with some,, bit not all.
I was that little boy at one time,, I can't tell you what to do,, but I can tell you if you even as much as hint that you don't trust him,, forget it.
I had the opportunity to have to go to a boy's ranch at 14. I was told anything that happened prior to that date didn't matter. And none of the other boys would ever find out my past.

I was new kid,, I got to start all over and never had to lie again. Still,, to this day,, I just can't lie.
GH

Maura · #34 08/09/12, 10:31 PM

Go with him all the time. You can't go to school with him, but you can accompany him when he takes care of the chickens. You can each take a different chore, you can find something else to do, you can just stand there and talk about how lovely the chickens are. This is giving him positive attention. You won't have to check up on him. You will be showing him that he is important and his jobs are important. Grandpa should really be the one to accompany him because children model their same sex parent (grandparent). Do this with everything. Help him wash his laundry. Go with him to his room to put the clothes away and then you put your clothes away. Do things like this together so that you are not prison guard, just that you do stuff together.

Molly Mckee · #35 08/09/12, 11:20 PM

We were thinking about adopting a boy years ago but my husband traveled most of the week. A friend, an adolescent psychiatrist, told my DH if we wanted it to work he would have to change his schedule and be home at night, that it would take at least a year and probably longer for a child to adjust.

I would talk to him like another adult, explain to him why things are important, and expect it to take time. He has been punished plenty it sounds like.

luvrulz · #36 08/10/12, 04:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Molly Mckee

We were thinking about adopting a boy years ago but my husband traveled most of the week. A friend, an adolescent psychiatrist, told my DH if we wanted it to work he would have to change his schedule and be home at night, that it would take at least a year and probably longer for a child to adjust.

I would talk to him like another adult, explain to him why things are important, and expect it to take time. He has been punished plenty it sounds like.

Yes he has....and probably enough to last him to eternity. We don't have time to follow him around with the chickens and there has to be a time when we can just trust him to do what he needs to do.... We are always around when he's doing other chores and he's positively praised and talked to like he's the best thing since sliced bread. And we explain why not to do something and how to do it so that it's easier.... why somethings work and why others don't.....

He is courteous and respectful. Not rude and mean.... He is a wonderful young man in spite of his father and his upbringing... It is amazing how he's turned out after all that.... And we knew there would be some adjustments on both sides...

Thanks to y'all.....it's been a huge help to bring it here and talk about it!

MDKatie · #37 08/10/12, 08:07 AM

luvrulz, it sounds like he is a lucky kid to be where he is now!!

grandma12703 · #38 08/10/12, 08:17 AM

I am not anti punishment but I do think you have to be careful that you do not just create a more creative lier. Maybe rewarding not lying actually makes more sense in some cases than punishing the lie itself.

Txrider · #39 08/10/12, 09:19 AM

I would recommend a book called "don't shoot the dog" by Karen Pryor for a good read on learned behaviors and how to change them. Same principles apply to all living animals really and the author breaks down the 4 different ways to change a particular behavior.

Behaviors are learned through consequences to the behavior. Lying is just a behavior, if the consequences are positive meaning he either gains something or aviods a punishment for example it will continue or escalate because that's how we learn and we repeat behaviors that have a positive consequence.

You must remove that positive consequence but it's enough that he simply gains nothing or avoids nothing by lying, you can punish but it isn't absolutely necessary. Consistency is the key.

You also -must- reward telling the truth and/or behaving correctly. All the time, very consistently, reward proper behavior.

That is how behavior is learned and shaped in all living animals. The book is a good read, for dealing with everything from kids, to mothers in law, to dogs or even a goldfish. The science is called operant conditioning and we are all conditioned this way by the consequences to our behavior. Some people/critters though have a very hard time associating a consequence to a behavior and have a very hard time learning, but it doesn't sound like this kid has a serious problem with that.

suitcase_sally · #40 08/10/12, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wind in Her Hair

Children who lie are afraid of the ramifications - they do not trust their authority figure to "not hurt them worse than they can stand" and so, in fear, they lie.

That may be true for some, but not all. My step-son suffers from "factoid disorder"

. He lies about things that don't mean anything.

He once had a job at a gym and told his dad that he was the manager and was making $60,000/year. Truth was, he was the towel boy and made $16,000/year and got fired from that one.

As an adult, he joined the army and told us he spent a year overseas during Desert Storm. Truth was, he spent a year at a military base in Texas. (Maybe it was so hot he thought it was Desert Storm).

There are just piles and piles of lies. It affects (effects?) how I feel about him.