Factory Chicken About to get Even Worse?

Originally Posted by Home Harvest

Corporations exist to create profits, but profits require customers. If the food is unsafe, they lose.

We have seen many recalls over the past several years. Aren't these recalls coming from government inspected plants? We've seen hamburger, peanut butter, salads, eggs...

Originally Posted by catknit

USDA at a kill plant is different from USDA at a cook plant. Big Rockpile - is your wife's plant a cook plant? Maybe where they make breaded tenders or nuggets? Also, certain departments are very rarely visited by USDA people because those areas are lower risk [for example, the office supply stock room -stored ball point pens probably won't cause foodborne illness].

In a kill plant there are 3 levels on inspectors: line inspectors who are to check EVERY chicken for wholesomeness [at the plant where I worked - there were 12 inspectors working 3 lines in the evis department and every, single bird went through their station, the line was color coded with color coded viscera trays - you'd need to be legally blind not to see the bird in front of you], floor inspectors who may walk ANYWHERE in the plant and can tag and shut down anything, and the vets who may also walk anywhere, request any written reports and can shut down the whole plant. The vet may not re-open the whole plant, they can only request the next level up [which is typically a regional level management person] to reopen a plant. The vet may re-open parts of the plant that the floor inspector shut down.

Additionally, many producers have state graders through, I think, AMS, who come in and check grading at least daily. You may not use the USDA grade sheild on packaging with out having paid for this service.

I met about 5 different vets in the year I was there. The two vets assigned to that plant were right out of vet school and one went into FSIS because it helped pay down her student debt faster or gave her a better interest rate or something...it wasn't her first choice per say, but financially she knew she would have a big leg up. Also, all the major producers have R&D facilities that would pay very, very nicely for a former USDA vet. Not everyone wants to be a pet or farm vet. Some do want a 40 hour work week with a big corporation.

The USDA pulls random birds every day for salmonella testing and I think the current standard is only one in 52 birds can test positive after entering 2nd processing. 1st processing is hang/stun/kill/dress - 2nd processing is post-chiller [which is a cold chlorine-spiked bath]. In second processing a variety of things can happen, whole birds are packaged, some are sent to "deli" where they are injected with marinades and are packaged for grocery stores to be cooked on site, some birds are cut up into parts.

USDA floor inspectors check packaging, check in-process meat temps, check belts and machinery for stuck product, check the live bird conditions, and general housekeeping.

A general rule was that in no individual department could more than 10 pieces of meat be on the floor at a time. That may seem pretty reasonable and simple however when you have a line that has 800 chicken wings a minute passing by and the line workers are supposed to pack out 40 wings a minute - and there are only 14 people working that line. Well, math proves to be the devil in the detail. The wings didn't "circulate" on that line and return back, they literally hit a stopper, piled up, and on occasion fell on the floor. Think I Love Lucy and the candy conveyer. So, in my case, the vet LOVED to visit my department and see the wing situation. My department sucessfully shut down the lines anywhere from 10 minutes to 45 minutes a night [just in 2nd processing - 1st processing always ran 2 hours ahead because the chiller took 2 hours to complete its process].

For me, in my former position, I was always being hounded by USDA - and rightfully so. Time and temperature abused food can kill. Simple as that.

The management above me wanted to scam anything and everything they could to keep their numbers up. My boss would change labels on bulk work-in-progress product - so it would still be sellable - to not loose yield. Quality and safety didn't matter to him. Meeting trucks and high yields were paramount. And, I do get it, it's a business, they need to make money. But, at what cost? A couple of grandmothers? Maybe a toddler? Higher up management found out what was going on and showed him the door - but he was able to reak havoc for 6 months before they felt they had enough solid information to fire him.

In a 50,000+ sqft building with 1000 employees/shift and only 15-16 USDA people on site, stuff can EASILY be missed - and idiots like the guy I used to work for know this and try to exploit this to seem like a much more "successful" manager.

Which sort of hints on one of the things that I noticed with respect to the poultry industry here [and there are many producers where I live]. They are SO afraid of wrongful termination lawsuits and getting back onto the Department of Labor's radar screen that human resource departments will allow a LOT to happen prior to a termination. Doesn't matter if the person is general labor/line worker or salaried manager - the benefit of doubt was granted time and again. Personel files would be bursting with issues and maybe someone would be terminated - it was maddening for me.

Originally Posted by catknit

USDA at a kill plant is different from USDA at a cook plant. Big Rockpile - is your wife's plant a cook plant? Maybe where they make breaded tenders or nuggets? Also, certain departments are very rarely visited by USDA people because those areas are lower risk [for example, the office supply stock room -stored ball point pens probably won't cause foodborne illness].

In a kill plant there are 3 levels on inspectors: line inspectors who are to check EVERY chicken for wholesomeness [at the plant where I worked - there were 12 inspectors working 3 lines in the evis department and every, single bird went through their station, the line was color coded with color coded viscera trays - you'd need to be legally blind not to see the bird in front of you], floor inspectors who may walk ANYWHERE in the plant and can tag and shut down anything, and the vets who may also walk anywhere, request any written reports and can shut down the whole plant. The vet may not re-open the whole plant, they can only request the next level up [which is typically a regional level management person] to reopen a plant. The vet may re-open parts of the plant that the floor inspector shut down.

Additionally, many producers have state graders through, I think, AMS, who come in and check grading at least daily. You may not use the USDA grade sheild on packaging with out having paid for this service.

I met about 5 different vets in the year I was there. The two vets assigned to that plant were right out of vet school and one went into FSIS because it helped pay down her student debt faster or gave her a better interest rate or something...it wasn't her first choice per say, but financially she knew she would have a big leg up. Also, all the major producers have R&D facilities that would pay very, very nicely for a former USDA vet. Not everyone wants to be a pet or farm vet. Some do want a 40 hour work week with a big corporation.

The USDA pulls random birds every day for salmonella testing and I think the current standard is only one in 52 birds can test positive after entering 2nd processing. 1st processing is hang/stun/kill/dress - 2nd processing is post-chiller [which is a cold chlorine-spiked bath]. In second processing a variety of things can happen, whole birds are packaged, some are sent to "deli" where they are injected with marinades and are packaged for grocery stores to be cooked on site, some birds are cut up into parts.

USDA floor inspectors check packaging, check in-process meat temps, check belts and machinery for stuck product, check the live bird conditions, and general housekeeping.

A general rule was that in no individual department could more than 10 pieces of meat be on the floor at a time. That may seem pretty reasonable and simple however when you have a line that has 800 chicken wings a minute passing by and the line workers are supposed to pack out 40 wings a minute - and there are only 14 people working that line. Well, math proves to be the devil in the detail. The wings didn't "circulate" on that line and return back, they literally hit a stopper, piled up, and on occasion fell on the floor. Think I Love Lucy and the candy conveyer. So, in my case, the vet LOVED to visit my department and see the wing situation. My department sucessfully shut down the lines anywhere from 10 minutes to 45 minutes a night [just in 2nd processing - 1st processing always ran 2 hours ahead because the chiller took 2 hours to complete its process].

For me, in my former position, I was always being hounded by USDA - and rightfully so. Time and temperature abused food can kill. Simple as that.

The management above me wanted to scam anything and everything they could to keep their numbers up. My boss would change labels on bulk work-in-progress product - so it would still be sellable - to not loose yield. Quality and safety didn't matter to him. Meeting trucks and high yields were paramount. And, I do get it, it's a business, they need to make money. But, at what cost? A couple of grandmothers? Maybe a toddler? Higher up management found out what was going on and showed him the door - but he was able to reak havoc for 6 months before they felt they had enough solid information to fire him.

In a 50,000+ sqft building with 1000 employees/shift and only 15-16 USDA people on site, stuff can EASILY be missed - and idiots like the guy I used to work for know this and try to exploit this to seem like a much more "successful" manager.

Which sort of hints on one of the things that I noticed with respect to the poultry industry here [and there are many producers where I live]. They are SO afraid of wrongful termination lawsuits and getting back onto the Department of Labor's radar screen that human resource departments will allow a LOT to happen prior to a termination. Doesn't matter if the person is general labor/line worker or salaried manager - the benefit of doubt was granted time and again. Personel files would be bursting with issues and maybe someone would be terminated - it was maddening for me.

Originally Posted by Harry Chickpea

meh. If people would properly prep their store-bought birds at home this wouldn't be much of a problem. I always re-clean the cavity, and most times I'll then cut the bird into parts, inspect and wash them. The sanitary issues generally aren't in what you eat anyway, if it is cooked properly. The issues are in people not cleaning down counters, knives and hands after processing.

Originally Posted by patty12

I worked and my family has worked for years in the largest company chicken plant in our country and I will tell you this company has been working for years to get rid of USDA so they can put everything in production and every things goes. Rock pile said so you had s--t , it can be washed off. The plant where I worked runs 3 lines eash line running 250 birds a minute now all the birds are droped into this hugh tank called a spin chill filled with cold water. How much muck can be washed off before the water is full of muck?
Listen to the fellow named Steph who was a boss in a plant. If USDA goes there will be no protection for you the consumer. USDA can not do much now but they do try and if they are gone the company will get even worse. All kill plants have USDA on the lines as well as a USDA person on the floor trying to see that you the consumer get chicken fit to eat. The supervisors are only interested in getting the job done as fast as they can with as much profit as they can get in their bonus and going home as soon as they can.
So no matter what you think of goverment , the company for profit is worse.

Originally Posted by Harry Chickpea

meh. If people would properly prep their store-bought birds at home this wouldn't be much of a problem. I always re-clean the cavity, and most times I'll then cut the bird into parts, inspect and wash them. The sanitary issues generally aren't in what you eat anyway, if it is cooked properly. The issues are in people not cleaning down counters, knives and hands after processing.

I'd like to continue the govt inspection, but I've seen enough damaged birds to know it isn't perfect either.