Barndominium

hiddensprings · #21 07/13/11, 09:52 AM

We've done it and love it. We had two pole barns built. One is the horse/animal barn and the other was to be my hubby's shop. That is the one that we build our apartment in. The building is 40 X 50 and 20 feet high (so basically two stories). We build the apartment so it is two stories. Downstairs is the laundry/mudroom and a huge bathroom and very large closet. Upstairs is a beautiful full eat-in kitchen, large living room, a bedroom, and an office. (its just the two of us so we don't need more bedrooms) We did 85% of the work ourselves and saved a ton of money. I am very lucky to have a hubby that is awesome with construction and a licensed electrician. We hired someone to do the dry wall and the septic system. Everything else we did. We did it within codes and with all of the permits we were required to get. Our plan was to use this temporarily until we were ready to build a house, but honestly, I am more then happy to say living in it. The pole barn was around 40K, concrete slab was 10k and we spent about 40k on doing the apartment. We do have tile and hard wood floors, lots of crown molding, stainless steel applicances, and a top notch central heat and air system. We could have used less expensive materials and saved more but we really love the way things turned out.
I say go for it! We have not regretted this at all. Private message me with your email address and I will be happy to send you come pics of our apartment.

SFM in KY · #22 07/13/11, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RamblinRoseRanc

I stayed in a horse breeder's apartment in the dead of winter in northern NJ once. It was built over the horse barn (barn was one of those metal affairs) and we were VERY comfortable. The apartment was accessed by a door in the barn aisleway and no smells/sounds made it up there. It was one bedroom with a small kitchen, great room and a bath. Her barns were parallel and had an indoor arena connecting them. The apartment had a balcony that overlooked the arena area. We loved both the idea and the execution of it.

I've known of several setups like this, all with horse people. In several cases, the owners had a separate home and they had hired help that lived in the barn/stable apartment but a friend of mine in VA has living quarters over one of her barns and the family is very comfortable there (4 kids).

My dream home, in fact, was to build living quarters over the old stone barn at the ranch in MT.

trbizwiz · #23 07/13/11, 11:35 AM

I wasnt going to talk about the price of the house I am selling because I dont want to be judged for something I am not. But Yes the sale of the home and the equity I have in it will be enough to buy the land and build the structure. i will just have to save for the dwelling portion in the structure. I have been very humbled over that last few years. i have realized what is truely important. I am in a position to actually be able to afford the old home now or will be shortly, but I am sort of ashamed for having done that in the first place. I believe pride and selfishness are sins. I havent always thought that way. I dont think living in a nice home is a sin , but if it consumes you it may be. getting debt free for me is more about spiritual, and emotional freedom than it is a financial thing. I havent been able to serve my family or my Lord that way I know I should. This move will enable that. I also hope to retire by the time my children are in Highschool. Because I want to be involved in all their activities. Getting debt free now and building up a farm slowly will enable that. Learning how to live on little will help a bunch too.

This is a very fun discussion. I did get word from my buyer that they definitely want to do the deal. they called last night. They will have 3/4ths of the money to me next week. I am insisting upon a lawyer to draw up the paperwork. Because they dont want to close until the end of August when they have the remainder. I am not comfortable taking that much money from a friend with some protection for everyone.

Anyway, I'll be calling the owner of the land I hope to buy today. He has mentioned he woudl take $2k per acre about 18 months ago. I am hoping that deal stands. If so i can pay cash next week. Or half now and half after january 1st if it helps with taxes. i dont want to boost him into a tax bracket and kill him on that end.

I should be getting a preliminary quote on the structure today too. Ill report back everythign I hear. THe quote will be for a 40 by 80- by 14 barn with a 12 ft overhang on the west end and 40 feet of the south end. It will sort of be like a wrap around porch. Ill be using an Acme outdoor boiler (they are made in missouri) to heat the floors and the water. Those run $4500 to $5600 depending on size.

Thanks again for your interest and comments. I truely respect the homestead lifestyle and all those who have done it. I appreciate your comments.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rambler

I think your construction prices are rather low; a pole shed (in my area, you are building a shed, not a barn - barn=animals, shed=shop & storage...) that size without much of a floor and no insulation will cost about what you budgeted.

Putting in the aprtment will cost much more than $25,000 with flooring, insulation, wiring, plumbing, etc. etc. etc.

Maybe you are a warm area & don't need the snow-load issue and can get by cheaper.

The whole money situation seems odd to me, you got a house you have a hard time affording; but when you get it sold you will have enough over the current mortgage to buy 28 acres (would be $50,000 here...) and put up a $50,000 building and add a $25,000 apt (which I think is going to cost you about double...) and will be all caught up. You must have some house there!

A few downsides of the combined building is insurance - many companies don't like wood & metal tools in with a dwelling. As well as the tax issue others mentioned. And then fumes & sawdust from the wood working, and fumes and sparks and dangers from the metal working - in with the dwelling might give some people pause. Not talking you out of it, just thinking about it.

Love the name you use for it, very neat.

And that's mostly what I wanted to say, the other stuff is just chit chat, 'barndominium' makes me smile.

--->Paul

trbizwiz · #24 07/13/11, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Witterbound

I'm skeptical like Rambler. I think you also need to think about being able to borrow against the property. My hunch is that a Bank might be willing to loan you a lot more if you build a modest sized home, than if you big a big barn with an apartment in it. You might think now that you won't need a loan, but at some point you probably will. It always costs more than you think to build anything. If you estimate it will cost $50,000 to build your barn and apartment, you can count on it costing $75,000. And where are you going to get the extra $25,000? You're going to need to get a loan from the bank to finish your building.

The barn exterior and concrete should be about $45K I think. Ill know today though. The interior apartment will hopefully be in the range of $25K. We are planning on shopping for deals on cabinets and everything. I may be off on the $25k. I havent put a pencile to it yet. But our plans are to get the structure up and use it for storage, and build the apartment for cash as we go. We will rent a place in the interim. It may take 2 months it may take 2 years. It is hard to say. BUt I dont intend to get a loan at this point. I suppose if a loan has a lower payment than rent we may do it any way. But the goal was debt freedom. So we will have make that descison. A friend bought a home in the range of $50K adn his payment is around $400. I doubt I can rent for that here. So it will be a consideration. With no other debt and modest living a $50 K mortgage could be paid off in 2 years.

I will probably use this thread to document the experience. So Ill keep a running tab of what it cost me. Maybe it will be a guide for others with a similar goal. I will try to keep tabs on my time invested too. I have done similar things with past projects on other forums and folks found it helpful. Though I am getting a head of my self a little. I havent even got a deal on the land as of yet. That could ruin the whole thing if he has had a change in heart. I have strict criteria for land. It needs to be farmable, it needs to be within 10 minutes of my off farm job, adn it needs to be affordable. THose 3 things dont really go together all that well.

rambler · #25 07/13/11, 01:38 PM

Thanks for the updates & continued conversation.

I don't mean anything by my comments on your existing house, and don't need to know anything about that.

I'd say if you can sell it and come out with any equity ahead at this time, never mind that much equity, you are doing very well for yourself and managing your lifestyle very well - you shouldn't be beating yourself up for you have not failed at all.

Guess that was where I meant to go, rather than the way I said things.

Your building costs for the raw shed sound pretty close.

I'd think the living quarters portion will be almost double by the time you get there. One can build minimully and piecemeal, but you need a floor, you need insulation, you need plumbing & wiring, you need some walls and some furnature - there are basic costs there that you can't really avoid, and gluing the basics together into a home will bring that up some. If you rent for 2 years to do the building, that cost really is part of your house cost, if you think about it - something to consider as you weigh the cost vs time options.

I can't remember if you have a well or septic available; those would be additional costs above yet in my mind. In my location that would be yet another $20,000 or so, but one can get by cheaper in other locations.

I see a few such combined buildings around, and seems like a fun project & nifty living if that is what one wants. Building 'different' than the cookie cutter options opens up a few cans of worms as some of us talk about, but not to put you off of your plans if that is what you like & want.

Good luck with the planning.

--->Paul

trbizwiz · #26 07/13/11, 01:53 PM

Thanks. I wasn't offended. Sorry if I came off that way. I enjoy the critical thinking process. And sharing that process with others can be more effective. I am starting to think $50 may be more in line. My last well was $4500 for 300 feet my septic was $3500.

goatlady · #27 07/13/11, 02:44 PM

Something to really keep in mind is the human body's natural aging process! Hauling groceries up stairs can eventually get to be "hurtful" even just getting yourself up stairs with old or arthritic knees can be nigh impossible, and trying to get out fast in case of fire or an illness requiring an ambulance/gurney needs to be considered. You will not always be as young as you are now and as physically fit. Hauling garbage bags down, not to mention firewood UP. Not for the likes of me at all. YMMV.

trbizwiz · #28 07/13/11, 03:58 PM

The main living area will be 30 by 40 of the 40 by 80 footprint. There will be a loft, but it will be a non essential area.

trbizwiz · #29 07/13/11, 05:15 PM

I just spoke with the assessor in my county. They asses the living square footage as a house and the barn footage as a barn. So I wont be assessed as a house with 3200 sq ft. If I were dishonest I could get ti assessed as a barn and then build the apartment. But My soul is worth more than a few hundered a year.

kan-green · #30 07/13/11, 05:40 PM

Go for it. I don't see why you couldn't build an apartment for $25,000. The roof, sides, and floor will be dine. All you will be doing is building partition walls as they will not have to be load bearing. You are doing in floor radiant heating, stamp and stain the concrete and you have your finished floor. Be reasonable with your finishings and don't go all out with cherry cabinets and granite everywhere. Keep in mind that you could always finish it out enough to be livable and keep the money you would have paid out in rent and then you can pay as you go to finish it. You also mentioned the land has to be within a certain distance from your job but you plan on being retired when the kids hit high school. If the land your wanting is no longer available I wouldn't restrict my search based on how far out it is. If it doesn't happen it wasn't meant to be. You may happen across something even better somewhere else.

You can do it.

Saffron · #31 07/13/11, 05:46 PM

Near my childhood home was something similar. It was basically a 2 story barn, very large. The woman who owned it had many horses, so the downstairs(main level) was a stable(but the only doors were to the inside of the level) and the upstairs was an "apartment" - but it was large! One of the neat things was the "tunnel" that went through the home(the breezeway on the bottom level.

She hasn't sold it and has lived there for 30+ years, but I know several who are interested.

Oh yeah, her whole property is pasture, but she fenced the driveway and a yard around the home. My only change would have been to bring the fence up to the breezeway so that the horses were able to go straight into the pasture from the stable and not have to walk across the graveled driveway.

trbizwiz · #32 07/13/11, 05:49 PM

I believe that about the wasnt ment to be potential. I need to be close because I come home for lunch with my family every day from noon to 1PM. I would not trade that time for anything. Somethings are worth more than money. If I live much farther than that I would lose that opportunity.

Farmerwilly2 · #33 07/13/11, 05:57 PM

I found that fellas screen name ET1 SS. He's posted pics of his place in the past, maybe he could shoot some more your way and see if it might be something you have in mind.

edcopp · #34 07/13/11, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Farmerwilly2

Speaking just for myself I detest being awoke in the morning by a fly doing a riverdance on the bridge of my nose or traveling from one drool pocket across my lip to the other side.

Some don't mind, would drive me nuts.

You might consider a large pole building if you weren't going to do the animal thing as room mates.

What's that boys name that lives up in Maine or New Hampshire, one of them up east yankee states ---retired navy. Posted pictures of his place and big old barrel stove he heats the place with. Can't think of his name now but he checks in semi regular if I recall correctly.

You must be talking about ET1SS, in Maine.

Farmerwilly2 · #35 07/13/11, 10:03 PM

Yep, took me a bit to remember. Him and his Mrs built a big building, enough room for their storage needs as I recall. I remember him showing pictures of his big barrel stove with the copper worm for heating water.

trbizwiz · #36 07/14/11, 10:11 AM

I spoke with the owner of the 28 acres I am hoping to buy. I was actaully hoping for 30 acres, but he said the 5 acres with a house that I was hoping to get 2 acres off the back to make an even 30 acres is incumbered by a loan and he would have trouble getting the 2 acres clear. He is very interested in selling the 28 though, and he appeared interested in my offer of $50K. He said he needs to check out all the numbers to make sure he is where he needs to be on it. So here's to hoping we make a deal in the next day or two.
I'll probably pull a sattellite pic today and see if I can get agmantoo to help me with a grazing layout. He is super nice about helping folks with that kind of stuff. I wont presume he will help, but it doesnt hurt to ask. I have some ideas about what to do with grazing lanes and such. But years of actual experience is more valuable than a mind full of theories. I might talk to the USDA too. They help farmers with that sort of thing.
Hopefully I'll have some barn costs and a counter offer on the land. My barn builder is getting me some barndominium's to look at. I'll try to get pics of those too. They are both the same size as what I am planning to build.

Freya · #37 07/14/11, 04:36 PM

Good luck! I look forward to watching your building story unfold!

Oh and PLENTY of people have built for far less. Think outside the box, do alot of work and always keep your eyes open for deals and freebies and trades!

trbizwiz · #38 07/14/11, 04:53 PM

shooting form the hip here are some guess prices based on past experience. i was a little low the other day
barn $45k....still dont have the quote
lumber $3K
labor for framing $2K
Drywall adn labor $4K
electrical $3K
plumbing $4K
hardwood and underlayment $2400....labor free
cabinets $4K
doors adn windows $3500
out door boiler $5K
well $4500
Septic $3500
AC$5K
paint, trim, odds and ends...$7,100
total $50K
You told me so!!
Maybe I can shop around and save here and there, but this will be close.
I should be able to build the barn structure, including slab adn infloor heat, and buy the 28 acres all for cash.
So, I'll either finance or save and build as I go The remaining $50K. i have no other debt so I am going from $2520 per month to well under $500 per month. Now that is sweet. making the same payment I could pay it off in 2 years.

Judy in IN · #39 07/15/11, 12:07 AM

Hubby and I looked at a place like you described when we were looking for a farm. It was a two bedroom home with a huge shop in part of the barn. There was a combine stuffed in the back, with plenty of room left over. The house part had a wrap-around porch, and ceramic tile floors. It was pretty nice.

Hubby didn't like the metal siding, but I loved the low-no maintenance. I saw in a recent issue of Metal Building that someone now offers a metal sheet that looks just like a stone wall. It is really cool! Just a thought for you.

trbizwiz · #40 08/02/11, 10:04 AM

Well we did the anti barndominium. We found a very nice house in town with an oldtime wraparound porch. It was built by a builder I know and trust. He has done work for me in th epast. We are able to nearly pay cash for it. So we signed the deal yesterday. I am still leasing 8 acres for my cows. I'll begin saving for an eventual farm of my own. But being debt free in this economy provides a lot of security. I was afraid if I bought land and built, I would go over budget as usual. Then I would end up deeper in debt again. Sorry I chickened out.