New Homesteader NEED HELP

Do you have bears in the area? I would want a bear proof shelter and a Q-hut from what I've seen isn't pear proof. (I am also bear paranoid)

How about a yurt?

I just left the Black HIlls area after 17 wonderful years there (west of Custer, 5600 ft elvation) You will not be able to live in a Q-hut there and correct - a composting toilet will NOT compost properly if at all there except in June, July, and August. The ground freezes 4' deep every year so a cistern will not work either and you will have to pay to have it filled and if the snow gets as bad as usual, the water man will not be able to get to you! A cheapy older mobile would be better than a Q or even a well insulated pole barn building would be better. The ONLY wood available for burning in the HIlls will be PINE which burns hot and fast so you will need MANY cords of wood to get through the 9 months of winter there. YOur growing season will be 90 days if you are lucky. I could only grow many things after I built several 14 x 25 greenhouses. No fruit trees will grow and produce there at all. If you are NOT used to living in a severe winter weather area with -20 degrees for days on end, never getting above 32 during the days, and feet of snow that does not melt and periodical hefty winds producing total whiteouts so you cannot see even 5' in front of you, you just may want to reconsider your timing on moving there. That 90 day growing season also holds true for trying to get anything built/delivered. The contractors and suppliers are already booked up for this summer, so you probably would not get very far with your developement building. Cannot beat that area for summertime weather and beauty, but you really need to visit there in the dead of winter, several times to get a true idea of the living conditions that are present for 7-9 months a year. Depending on the county you are considering, you may not be able to get the local permits for a composting toilet and/or a Q-hut for living in. Better check the local county permit department before making any purchases. And do keep in mind the cheaper the land price the less availability of water in any form, much less drinkable. Water is scarcer than oil in that area and priced higher to boot. If you have particular questions, you are welcome to Private Message me if you want. I not only lived there for 16 y ears, I was also a Real Estate Broker in that area and am quite familiar with many areas in the Hills.

pole barns can be quickly constructed and you can use it for a barn or shed later..insulation can be put inside and outside (foam sheets outside, roll bats inside) and it will be super cozy..my inlaws did one many many years ago and it is still being used, not by them as they have been gone a few years..they used a wood stove in the center, put the bath and kitchen along an outside wall and petitioned off a bedroom, but it could be unpetitioned if you want that

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Brenda Groth
http://restfultrailsfoodforestgarden.blogspot.com/

Makes ya wonder how Indians lived there.
jim

Since the Black HIlls was and is considered "sacred Land" to the native americans, they did not live there, they visited and conducted ceremonies there, but lived and migrated elsewhere. Just south out of the Hills are natural hot springs where make a really good wintering over place, used to anyway, before it became a town and tourist center.

Serious suggestion:

Start building your house now, and if it is not finished by mid fall, rent yourself a cheap studio apartment that you can keep well heated and comfortable for the winter. Once you get through the first winter alive and well, you should have time to be ready for the next winter.

If you get the land soon, and if you are an experienced builder, it shouldn't take you very long to build the core of a house, that you can live in. Build the main room and crowd into it. Then, as weather allows, you can expand the house.

You are going to need very good insulation and very good heat. If the area you choose has a lot of snow fall, don't forget the snow grade reinforced roof.

Quonset hut in the Black Hills in winter? No. You'll ruin your homesteading experience.

By the way, where do you plan to get the wood to burn? Wood has to be cut and dried before you burn it. It's going to take a lot of wood to get you through a winter. I don't remember a lot of trees in the Black Hills.

Pellet stove requires electricity.

Oregon smoke - you about described how our house was built. I am currently sitting in part that was the original 9x12 homestead (house is much bigger now).

I often think of what it was like for the original homesteaders around here - winters can be brutal and summers can be scorchers. They made it, at least some of them did. People still die in the winter if they aren't careful about the weather.

I grew up in MN, but did not know what a blizzard was until moving to SD when I was 42.

Back when people moved here, no one cared about how many animals they harvested to eat, and the government wasn't going to nail you for cutting trees in a National Forest. Of course, most knew they were talking a big risk, and many paid with their lives.

haven't read all the posts, but you could put up the Qhut, then park an rv in it--the hut would be plenty useful when you move onto a better home structure, but plant it where you want a barn or shop, not the house. the rv could be gotten pretty cheaply, since you could get even a leaky one since you can put it under a roof. then sell it when you're done.

First I would like to say thank everyone for all the advice, feedback and concern. Yes we think the Black hills area is perfect for us and it is where we want to hang our hat after having lived in any different places. You all have given us a lot to think and we have considered and researched a lot of the issues you have brought up and we thank you for the advice and information. This should cover every response we received.

No we have not lived herein South Dakota before but have lived in northern Idaho, so we know what wintering in the mountains is like.

Yes we have winter survival skills I have lived in Greenland (inside the Arctic Circle) Alaska and Iceland. I thank you for your concern, and do not think it was mean spirited.
What I haven’t done is build a quick shelter, I thought/assumed a Q hut would be easy to construct, insulate and keep warm. That it would provide a permanent outbuilding once we are done using it. Glad I posted my questions. I will look into other options, perhaps something I have some experience with.

Composting toilet, I was going to try to utilize a nearly dry system until we can add to our little homestead.

The land we are looking into has a pretty good county road supposedly with good year round access. Residents out in that area say winter access is good and that the county maintains the primary and secondary road as it is a school and mail route. They told me the only hard part should our own personal drive way that we should be able to maintain with personal equipment i.e. tractor or plow. We will have neighbors, they all use wells and or cisterns, so they are useable in the winter months here.

Cistern system for this winter's use I was looking at was going to be an elevated system and I was going to put it on a platform inside the shelter where I thought it would be warm that Idea is still good, however will have to rethink shelter.

Thank You for your concern

We have considered a yurt, but wanted to try to go with something a little more permanent for later use. Maybe we will re-look at that option!

We already have a good sized RV but looking to stretch out a bit, so I am not interested in putting a mobile home in but I do appreciate the feedback.

I checked at Lowes and other building supply stores/sources and they said they did not have any cabin kits, but that is a very interesting idea I will re-check that.

I know drinkable water from a private source is hard to come by in this area and that the growing season is short. In the spring of next year we are looking to put in a grow dome (solar greenhouse) which will extend our growing season.

Everyone tells me that a Q-Hut sucks and is the worst idea ever, and I do appreciate that. I am trying to figure out how they kept them warm when they were used in places like Alaska.

We still had a few in use in Greenland in the arctic circle and it was warm inside and very very cold outside.

Of course it had a loft for storage up above (they had a false cieling) and had walls inside how they were insulated I have no idea.

I do understand I would have to buy enough wood/propane for the season.

We already have an RV but looking to be able to stretch out a little bit, hence the Q-Hut idea.

I really do like the feedback though keep them coming.

Alaska has quite a variance in seasons. If they were used in the cold areas, I'd like to know, too.

Consider your wife and kids leaving you. I lost a wife and kids and my situation dosent sound NEAR as bad as yours. Wives tend to come to their senses before their men do. Men tend to try to stick it out and make it work until they finally find out it aint gonna work, and from what many have said, by the time u find that out, U might be alone, and froze, and crazy LOL

Haveing water inside will draw coldness to it. What are u going to do for electric?You havnt mentioned haveing a dozer and blade to keep the driveway, and maybe the road cleared, and maybe for pulling out the county man if he gets stuck. You would have better luck with haveing your cistern in the house, Build the kitchen sink above or next to it. put it near the center of the house, AND UNDERGROUND. A hand pump will draw nicely from that short a distance. bring up the wall enough so that inside pets, or small kids ect cant fall into it. Do you have the mondy to do these things, or is this wish list makeing? You say your a new homesteader. Why havnt you been learning to homestead in these other places that you say youve lived? Haveing some experience, even of the basics would be a great help.

You already stated how they were kept warm: low insulated ceiling, and insulation. Lots of insulation. It could be done. Why don't you contact the places where you were and ask for their specs?

A voice of dissent. Except for the very young, very old, or the unhealthy, cold will not hurt you. As long as you have plenty of warm clothes and bedding and food, you can withstand any temperatures. Mostly it is a matter of accepting the cold and not freaking out if there is ice in the water pail.

We spent the last winter in Minnesota with no heat. Not nice, but by no means was it unbearable.

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Flaming Xtian
I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
Mahatma Gandhi


Libertarindependent

You can make it in the Black Hills in a travel trailer (preferably a 3 or 4 seasons) with no problem . People there think the winteres are just aweful ( I lived there for 12 years ) but the winters are NOTHING compared to winters up here and in north western North Dakota and we made it just fine for a year in a travel trailer with 5 children to boot

There are thousands of folks living in travel trailers due to the housing shortage in the Williston ,ND area as we speak . It can be done , though it can be spendy with electricity and propane bills ....

Edited to ad > Oops ,I meant that we made it for a year up by Williston ,ND with no probs ! I worried more in the summer about tornadoes than I did about the cold or blizzards .

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-Amy
~Helpmeet to my best friend~
~Keeper at home with 6 little blessings~

A 9 month Winter? OMG, ain't no way! Best of luck to you. I'll stick to the South and continue to complain from Dec thru March!

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Ozark American Hippy Chick
Farm Mamma to:
Cows
Geese
Ducks
Pigs
Turkeys
Chickens
Goats
Dogs
and a couple of cats

Be prepared - good winter access usually means they'll plow 3 -4 days after the snow. and if drifts shut again, they main not plow at all. We have a deal with our government- we don't pay state income tax, and they don't provide much in the way of services.

I live on a main county dirt road in a more populated area, and we expect to be snowed in 4-5 times each winter for 3-4 days at a time. Just make sure you are never close to running out of something if there is snow in the forecast.

And like horsepoor says, it could be much worse - it could be North Dakota!