Road side farm stand or farmer's market?
 

Do you have a road side stand?
Last year, we went to farmers market. Was really unproductive, as it was new, people were not in the habbit of going- and we have a garden season that is not good anyway- so produce is limiting.

We have a big garden, besides other things from our place, and are considering a farm stand 1x per week. Anyone do this? what are the good and bad points? We have a fairly good location to do this.

When our farmers market opened people rushed in with enthusiasm. First farmers market in our area that I know of. Did not matter if they were used to going or not they were just excited to have it. I dropped off a flat of malabar spinach for my friend last weekend and the farmers market people cleared it off in less than 30 minutes.

On the flipside the lady who has a farm and sells realy cool stuff and was open one day a week is closed because of no customers. Kind of a shame because she had some cool stuff.

Me personaly I could make way more money at the farmers market. Not to mention we met all kinds of people there that make excellent future contacts.

My amish neighbors sell from their back porch 6 days a week and cars go in and out of there non stop. I imagine they pull in tons of cash. They also sell all kinds of canned goods and homeade candy and baskets, etc.

I think the farmers market people tried to start up in town fizzled out, but it was in a bad location.

If you're only open one day a week, I would forget which day it was. People here have a box and you toss the money in. No one watches the stands. The driveway stands near me are so common that few participate in the Farmer's Market exept the really big growers. The closest one to me is 18 miles. I think it does good business with the town folks, but the town is only 10K. Grand Rapids FM does a much better business. So which does best depends on what kind of area you live in and what the competition is. i don't know of anyone in my town of 600 that goes to the FM nearest to us- the farm stands are easier. So to answer your question - maybe you could tell us a bit more about your area?

Have you spoken to the FM people to see what they plan to up the customer base this year? What kind of advertising are they doing? Growing a business takes time - even a FM. Is there a bigger Farmer's Market around that is drawing the customers?

Farmer's Markets only work well near or in a city, worth the travel many times. Small town farmer's markets seem to flop unless it's a town city people travel to.
Roadside stands means dealing with the public, that can be ugly if you're not a public dealing accepting person.

Thanks for the good info-
Our town is less than 1000- and nowhere near a city of any sort, so even though they are doing a lot of advertising- I don't know if it is enough to draw in the customers. We were thinking of a drop box, too- the honor system if you will. (we could also be there on certain days to bring home baked goods, etc)
We deal with the public much, and that is what we are weighing in the decission.

Our local FM isn't going to open this year. Just not enough business. Lots of folks around here have roadside stands with an honor box. The stands tend to be very inexpensive, and very fresh. It's a win-win situation.

One of my neighbors sells hay, eggs, chicks, and rabbits; they have just set up a small building to sell produce from, in addition to their other items. I'm putting honey and beeswax in there. There is someone home all the time, so it might work out really well.

Farmers market is the only thing available to me as I live where there is no traffic and as it is a subdivision..none is wanted.(Oh, no lot under 2 acres and I have five+.) I got a taste for it last year and this year I am planting things specifically for it. I will have my surplus regular veggies,eggs and excess poultry. I plan to have some sort of baked goods too..maybe raised donuts as no-one does those.....or frybread with a meat filling/fruit filling.

It is only one day a week in that location from 8am to 1pm..but most are sold out and gone by noon.

The folks will not respect your one day a week policy if you are living on the same property.

They will just hassle you at your door. They will expect you to drop everything and give them a tour of your place and pick them some vegetables.

Post that would be a nightmare.

In Lancaster PA the amish have road side boxes on the honor system, family shops on their property, markets, all kinds of stuff, but that is a tourist area and gets the traffice. When you travel off the main road and into the heart of that amish area, it is basicly empty of traffic and buyers, there are just farms.

I buy from roadside stands but to tell you the truth most of them are too expensive, so I go to the few that I know that are low price. You know, come on, keep the prices low and you will get a steady business. Why charge grocery store prices if you have little or no over head...that just turns me off, makes me think the people are greedy, and I go away and never come back.

Now the new thing in the amish areas is that some of them want even higher prices for their roadside produce because it is "Organic". It always was organic, but now they are trying to cash in on the organic fad. Give me a break. I rather grow my own.

Their are couple of other options . Advertize as pick your own , maybe CSA . I have friends who advertize in the local paper , then put a stand out by the road . They don't keep the stand at the road , when things are out of season . Pick your own doesn't bring in the same amount of money as selling at the road side stand .

What about legalities and insurance when it comes to pick your owns and roadside stands? people are so sue-happy these days I wouldnt want to lose everything because of some legal red tape.

IMO I dont see CSA systems lasting that long into the future. I may be wrong, but it seems like a fade for yuppies. At least that is what it is here in New York City, just a trend for yuppies.

Here, CSA's are very successful! It isn't about a fad, but about convenience for folks. The larger ones are made up of many Farmers/Gardeners (all sizes). You drop off your produce once/week. They package up the combination of varieties & deliver it to the "drop" location. There, the CSA members pick up their bags. No one comes to your property this way, you don't have to sit at a stand, or worry about laws/regulations about that. Farmer's Markets are expensive, so I wouldn't be bothering with that. If I wanted to start my own CSA, I could certainly do that, but I'd need to expand our garden areas even more. Not my plan this year. The only thing I grow in great excess is Garlic.

Lori, maybe CSA programs will work out in the long run, what do I know. That is just my opinion.

I think they will work out better in the long run "here," but don't know what it is like where you are. On the opposite side of the Country from you ;)

My spin on farmers markets, is that time is money, so every minute you spend selling, is time you cannot use to get other things done and my weekends are precious. If you are making good money, then great. If you are spending an entire Saturday and taking home $23, then it would not be worth it, IMO.

Our home location is so-so (county road), but we do all right selling eggs roadside, from a self-serve kiosk with a small fridge in it. No big problems with egg stealing. We don't have a huge nimber of eggs, so if we sold them at the farmers market, we would sell out very quickly, or wait around all day.

We have tried selling tomatoes, cucumbers, etc. with ok success, as when we have them, seems everybody else does too. I have noticed that the people down the road sell melons and they always seem to sell out (assuming people are paying for them), so maybe we should specialize in something.

I like "honor system" sales, because you can be doing other stuff, not attending your roadside market, but be nearby if necessary. Of course, if it got busy enough to warant an attendant, then that would be a different story.

I vote for home sales, unless the farmers market, has great potential.

Lori, you are right the outcome depends on the market and the nature of the community.

Plow jockey, you make some good points. i wouldn't want to sit around all day for only $23. I wouldn't mind doing it twice, because the novelty would be there and I would be mingling and socializing with customers (like I do when I have yard sales) but then I would grow tired of it.
I rather just sell my stuff at a low and attractive price, in one big lot, to someone who already has a place at the farmers market and just be done with it, and let him or her deal with the hassle and the wait. Is that the wises choice, maybe not, but sometimes I just like to cut myself free from all the hassle and if getting a little less money is all it takes to get the monkey off my back, then I might do it.

Bartering might be a good choice also. You could use the extra crops and goods to barter services and to barter for credit at stores. Maybe you can barter with the manager at the movie house and get movie tickets in exchange, maybe a dinner for you and your sweet heart at a nice restaurant, maybe your doctor or dentist would really like some home grown vegg, meat, and eggs. Money isn't the only way to get things done.

Good point, City Bound!

Speaking of "Bartering," I went over to a Massage Therapists property to do a gardening design for her (one month ago). This also involved provided a plan of action to complete it. I also provided E W Onions, Garlic Cloves, and some seed varieties. In return, I was provided an excellent lunch, paid $30, and also get credit for massage time. Any other work DH or I do for them, will be bartered for homegrown pork OR massage time.

Plowjocky- that about summed up our last years farmers mkt experience- but sometimes we made nothing.... ended up giving produce away- not worth the time.
Last year I tried a "point and pick" for seniors, that worked pretty well. It was whatever they could get into a plastic grocery bag for $6-

have thought of it, I have sold some things by putting SIGNS by the road and the people had to walk up to the porch..

To have an honor stand, you'd have to be on a road with traffic.

I'm afraid that honor is a commodity that's getting to be short in supply. I'm in a very low crime area and I still had a lot of my fruit crop stolen last year from behind a gated 6 ft fence. I'm not about to pick the fruit and put it out for the thieves so they can simply pick up a full box and not even have to pick the fruit they steal.

I think the local farmer's market brings a lot of money, but local growers can't get in.

Before you venture in to selling foods from your home you should check into your local regulations. Here in MN you can't sell any processed foods including baked goods from your home unless you have a certified kitchen and are licensed. The farmers' markets are a better option here.

Lori, that sounds like a good deal. The most direct path to meeting your goals is the best path. it reminds me of a reality show I watched a few years back where these tribal natives are taken to america from the south pacific, given a tour of america, and then taken back to their little island and their tribe. When the tribal men stayed on an american farm and the farmer explained what he was doing with his land and how he lived to the tribal men, the men sat there confused for a while and then said to each other in their own language "I don't understand, why would someone grow fields and fields of food just to make money so you can then go and buy your own food? why not just eat the food you have already grown?" Anyway, that just came to mind.

oregon, they came on your land and stole your crops? man, that is low. i would have a mean dog out patroling my land ready to rip anyone apart that even thought about stealing.

Before going to the farmer's market, you need to verify what the regulations might be regarding insurance, sales tax, and things like that. Lots of people think that all you have to do at the farmer's market is set up a table or open the trunk of your car and sell things from it, and there's really a lot more that needs to be done.

How about taking produce, baked goods, etc. over to a friend's house who's having a garage sale, and selling it from there? They might be especially amenable to it if they can have anything that's left over, and you probably wouldn't have the liability issues.

When I had my own garage sale last summer, I had some extra tomatoes and cabbage and put them on a table with a "Make an offer" sign and while I didn't sell everything, I had a few dollars I wouldn't otherwise have had.

We have several farmer's markets in a 20 mile radius. The main one is a full-summer commitment and I think there is a waiting list to get a spot! It's in a smallish, liberal, rich college town so the customers are plentiful and so is their $$! Luckily, competition keeps the prices in check.

Some of the smaller ones allow you to show up and pay a token fee for the day. That's what I'm going to try this year once I speak to the Market Masters. This is if I even get anything in the ground with all this rain in Ohio! I plan to use it as a venue to advertise the pastured poultry, too. I'm planting 20 different varieties of tomatoes, 6 of potatoes and 6 different string beans, several types of pumkins and squash. Hopefully this will make people take a second look at my stand :) Or maybe it's just justification for going nuts with ordering seeds this winter!

it seems to me both .. like every 2 days or .. something . pick your prime goos and A send them to the farmers market or road side stand or fill CSA basket. that way its always peak. and your not picking green to sell at the market

What is "CSA" ?

Green horn, this is just the oppinion of one guy who goes to farmers markets, keep your prices decent if you want to sell. When I go to the farmers market there are vendors just sitting around because the prices are too high and people are not taking the bait. Sure, you get a few middle class or upper middle class people who have no trouble dishing out dough like it is nothing, but they are only less then five percent of the traffic in the market. You know what i see happening the vendors sit around with their goods asking too much, not getting many sales, and then eventually reducing the prices when the produce is about to bo bad. Then people jump on the deal. If you keep your prices decent you will sell more, have less to clean up at the end of the day and to take home, and less waste. Just my oppinion based on what I see observing human nature and activity.

There is an amish guy that comes to our market and tries to sell a half pint of home made canned pickles for ten bucks......that is the kind of insanity I am talking about. Another guy was selling Sun-chokes for $7 a pound, that is nuts also.

CityBound, that's exactly my plan! That's why I said luckily competition keeps the prices in check. I try to keep a good feel for what the going rate is and then just make my stuff the most appealing that I can. I guess what I mean by the rich folks is that there are plenty who will not blink an eye at paying $2.50-$3.00/lb for the chicken and don't mind spending $70 on a turkey. I'd say 40% of this town "in the village" have $100,000+ incomes. It's a weird place!

Ok, yeah, greenhorn, i can see why you could ask more there, that sounds like a middle class area. I would never pay $70 for a turkey.

Community Supported Agriculture

Here is an example, but other models exist, too, along with multiple Farmers providing the different fruits/veggies.

Farmer Dale would like to sell his extra produce, but doesn't have time to go to Farmer's Markets, doesn't like the idea of having a stand, doesn't want just "anybody" coming to his homestead, not interested in a U-Pick, and doesn't want any signs out. So, he posts an ad at his Church, offering "shares" for sale, and limits the shares to allow for 10 families. The ten families sign up, pay an up front fee (usually), then a weekly fee for their CSA Share. The Church allows Farmer Dale to make his drop there. Each of the families go there once/week to pick up their "share." Each family has a bin for its share, so they open their bin, remove the bags of produce, and leave the bin there for next week. Farmer Dale also grows flowers and begins bringing them to decorate the Church, in gratitude. The members see the flowers and some want to buy regularly from Dale. He starts a small Flower CSA.

City Bound, I also find it odd all farmers don't grow their own food. The way I see it, we grow for ourselves first, and the extra can be offered for sale (if there is any). We plan to build a larger greenhouse. When we do, I will start a CSA. I get asked regularly if I sell my fruit/veggies/especially Garlic!

The last few summers we have just had a farm stand here at the house and sold our extras. We do yard sales and vegetable sales at the same time. Since we are the only ones in the area to sell vegetables we have quit a few people come by to buy from us. We figure we probably do just as good as if we drove 25 miles to town, pay our dues, and compete with other farmers for customers.

People will be a little disapointed this year as we are not growing near as many different varieties as in the past and don't plan on selling much. We decided to grow more corn, taters, beans, okra, and tomatoes to put plenty in the pantry and freezer. We figure if times get really tough these vegetable will help us through the next year.

but the amish and the other person are coming back apparently what ever they do is working for them although it seems rather insane pricing.

as for not selling other than your own goods at market i am generally against it BUT if i cant produce enough wheat(for example) for animals/baking and market i think if there is a reasonable demand thats not met i wouldnt be opposed to reselling organic wheat berry (free grinding lol) from in state or as local as possible as long as its well known to buyers not if its competing with annothers home grown goods

I planted a Upick this year. I called my insurance co, they said as long as they didn't have to cross a creek or bridge or any other 'obstacle' I was fine. Also - not let kids play on play equipment in my yard and to keep all animals away - mine and theirs. I plan on using craigslist to advertise my berries as well as a poster at the Feed Store.

When I was picking fruit last year, I noticed that everyone had the same prices - or within pennies per pound anyway. I finally asked about that and was told that the growers get together each year and decide on prices so no one undercuts others. I really, really object to this. If I can produce a tomato for 20 cents a pound cheaper than you can - I should be rewarded for that. I am surprised that this is legal. I suppose it prevents people that aren't in it for an income, from coming in and getting rid of a bumper crop of something to make a quick $.

Calie, your u pick sounds good. I dont like that rule ether because I would try under cut the other people in price just to get rid of my stuff quicker. it is like walmart, they may get less per item, but they sell more and it all adds up.

Sticky, maybe you are right, maybe they are doing good. I dont know.

Are you sure about that? There are seed costs, seed starting medium, containers, greenhouse and all it takes to run them, low and/or high tunnels, row cover, tractor, tiller, baskets, knives, shovels, spades, hoes, hoses, water system and other equipment. Labor isn't cheap. My land wasn't free and I pay property tax on it every year. There are other expenses too. Gas and diesel are expensive. Even small places without big equipment have overhead.

Shouldn't you pay for a better quality product? Tomatoes are a great example. You aren't going to find tomatoes picked that day, at the right time for maximum flavor and nutrition, in a grocery store. Tomatoes like that don't ship well. Now account for commodity vegetables and money. Commodity crops aren't just soybeans, corn and grains. Farmstands most likely are not run by farmers getting commodity payments.

Why should I charge .99/lb for tomatoes that are many times better quality?

CSAs started in the 1960's. That's not a fad.

Not necessarily. I live on a dead end road in a town of less than 60 people. In many areas a grower can do the work necessary to build a customer base and live remotely.

I started locking up at night after having my stand raided. It's more work but like you, I'm not doing back breaking work in the heat, rain, bugs, cold and everything else Mother Nature throws at a grower to make it convenient for the thieves. That thief is no longer in the area and will never be back but I lock up anyway. My best apple tree is close to the road. A game cam in plain sight and barking dogs have cut down on those thieves. I have a few interesting pics of people who approached the camera to see what it is. This is a small community. Even without faces, I know who's who. "Hey! I saw you on the game camera! Did you have any questions about the apples?" I haven't had a repeat photo! ;)

Maine allows 25% of what is sold at farmers market to be resold as long as it was produced in the state. The market I used to attend didn't have a strawberry farmer. A couple of new farmers who didn't have much to sell went to PYOs. Customers appreciated being able to get fresh, ripe strawberries and farmers were able to point customers in the right direction when asked "do you have strawberries?" Same thing for blueberries and apples.

You might want to look into wholesale. You don't have to have a lot of land to sell wholesale and make a comfortable living as long as you know how to work with seasons and the proper tools.

Price setting is illegal.

This would be a good conversation for the Market Gardens forum where there are more people doing this for a living. It's a good place to hang out if you're thinking about commercial growing. There are experienced people in that forum who are very helpful.

And conversely, undercutting is not allowed at our local farmer's market, nor is drawing attention to one's booth by yelling, having flashing lights, etc.

If there's an independent grocery in your town, they might be willing to sell your extra produce. One such store in a small town near my house bought 25 squash from me last fall! :happy: They belong to a co-op and planned to re-sell them there, and they buy produce and eggs from other local growers.

This is exactly what kills the small producer's chance, of profits or maybe covering their costs. In no way can a small producer match the business model of Walmart.

It's called "dumping" and it can even hurt large industies. One substantially cuts their prices, forcing everyone else to cut theirs, often to the point where they are giving everything away.

I see this with Fresh Eggs- $1 dozen at roadside stands :mad:. Big surprise that they are always out of eggs. Even those that produce their own corn/soy feed, are not turning a profit at that price. But that's what they are charging, so customers surely gobble up their eggs and scoff at those who must (and should), charge considerably more.

Consumers should be "trained", that if they like the quality, taste and safety, of homegrown food products, they need to be willing to pay a premium price, for these products. That is the only way producers will be able to supply the products.

Home grown producers ,can only continue to give their products away, for so long.

Then after that WM is the only choice. Yuck.

I really don't have any plans to pick and drive my produce anywhere. I will only have an acre or two in production at the most and that will be in a couple of years if all goes well. I don't think it's anyone's business what price I sell my berries for. If I know someone is down and out - I can greatly reduce the price. If I have more berries at the end of the day than is good- I can put out an ad as such. I will need to be flexible so I won't be participating in Farmer's Markets - at this point anyway. If the customers won't come...we'll see what happens.

I also use to think that farm produce was cheap produce. I went to the Farm Markets to avoid grocery store prices. I was disappointed in SOME of the products...but others were a great price. With the deterioration of grocery store selections, I have changed my mind. If I want a real strawberry I have to go where they are grown. If that isn't in my back yard....well, it will be in someone else's. I am happy to pay more.