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  #41  
Old 02/04/11, 12:39 PM
ET1 SS's Avatar
zone 5 - riverfrontage
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Forests of maine
Posts: 5,872
Rain, snow, sleet, rain, freezing rain, snow, snow, snow. ....

It will have some content of ice in it regardless of how much insulation you have.

A layer of snow blankets the ground, then we get some rain that soaks in and freezes, then some sleet, than back to snow. You get a solid layer of ice there, really before the heavy snow has even fallen.

One of more layers of ice underneath the snow, or layered in the snow is not an indication that heat is escaping.
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  #42  
Old 02/05/11, 01:17 AM
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Chickaloon, AK
Posts: 51
Just occurred to me. I haven't read through all the replies so pardon me if I am repeating something but...In the mean time heat tape can be your friend, though not really a long term solution really. It will stop the waterfall.

What ET1 SS says actually underscores the benefits of a metal roof system unless the pitch is so low that snow and ice will not slide off. Living in a high wind, high snow area, I have become a fan of metal roofing.

Rick
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  #43  
Old 02/05/11, 11:40 AM
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 390
Quote:
Originally Posted by RVcook View Post
I am SO over ice damming... I have owned 4 homes previously and NEVER had this problem!!!

We called insulation specialists in last fall who insulated the attic areas above the bedrooms and bathrooms. But they explained to me that we have what is called a "HOT" roof and there was nothing they could do to 'fix' our problem.

So after a bit of research, it became quickly apparent that we have 3 choices to 'fix' this issue:

1. Scrap the cathedral ceiling with it's plank wood finish and exposed beams. Dropping the ceiling to an 8' height and insulating to R-65 (like the rest of the house) would DEFINITELY 'fix' the problem. Least expensive option.

2. Insulate the cathedral ceiling from the inside by building a large airspace, spray foaming the exposed plank wood finish and then installing drywall or another plank wood finish over it. Moderately expensive option.

3. Bite the bullet and spring for a steel roof. Even though we spent over $5K for a new roof in 2007, installing a steel roof and new gutters would most certainly 'fix' the problem and look good too. Most expensive option.

My question is does anyone have an idea of how steel roofing is priced? And if you have steel roofing, what has been your experience.

I'm just trying to weigh all the options. Going up and down a 16' ladder in my snow boots is starting to wear on me...ain't gettin' no younger...

RVcook


The bolded is your best and least expensive option although I would remove the existing planks and insulate the cavities with sprayfoam. Keeping the snow raked back a few feet from the eves will help big time until you get the fix done.
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  #44  
Old 02/05/11, 02:15 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Central Wisconsin
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I put on a steel roof with some help from some friends and my Dad. It came up to a grand total of 850 dollars with screws, trim, and replacing all the wooden planking on the roof. I live in central Wisconsin too and steel was the cheapest and quickest option. I put it up about two years ago. When the sun comes out the snow slides off right away. The roof is not heated nor is it insulated. I am very happy with it

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Last edited by PhilJohnson; 02/05/11 at 02:18 PM.
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  #45  
Old 02/05/11, 04:49 PM
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Central Oregon
Posts: 6,175
If ice dam is the problem, you can either get yourself a snow removal tool and remove about a foot of snow at the edge of the roof whenever the snow gets thick or you can buy heat cables to go on the edge of the roof and turn them on whenever there is a storm.
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  #46  
Old 02/05/11, 08:46 PM
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 964
Some things to remember or think about.

Steel roofs come in basically 2 types. The traditional barn style that have exposed nails/screws, and a standing seam roof. The standing seam roof tend to be used more in residential construction, but cost more. ($145/sqr vs. $85/sqr) If you see a roof with narrow tall ribs, its probably the standing seam type. Less problems with washer failure, since the nails/screws are covered by the metal. If you have an ice dam, either type of roof will leak, just like shingles. Metal roofs are designed to allow the water to flow down and away. Pooled water will seep inside. I won't get into metal shingles, since they will not fix your problem.

Be very careful of multiple vapor barriers if you insulate the outside. Moisture barriers go on the hot side of the wall/roof. Inside in the north, outside in the south. The worst case is two vapor barriers, and one of them is compromised. The interior of the wall gets wet, and the moisture never goes away. Quickly rotting structures, mold/mildew and other nastiness ensues.

For the short term fix, I was going to suggest the heat tape as well. It will keep the ice dams drained, so they will be manageable, and hopefully no standing water on the roof.

If you have a "hot roof" and eves, you are going to get ice dams. With great insulation in the roof, it may be only a little, but they will be there. You can insulate more to reduce the ice dams, heat the eves, or cool the roof.

Cooling the roof would be easiest with the metal roof. Vertical 2x4's from the eaves to the ridge provide ventilation. These are covered horizontally with the 2x4 nailers that the metal gets attached to.

I'm a big fan of sprayed closed cell foam insulation in cathedral ceilings. They are an almost perfect moisture barrier, provide high R-value for the allowable thickness, and are easy to install. (since you get someone else to do it) The main down side is the cost. At $1/board foot, its not cheap.

Michael
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  #47  
Old 02/06/11, 11:10 AM
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: East TN
Posts: 6,977
Quote:
Originally Posted by RVcook View Post
E-X-A-C-T-L-Y! This is why it is so maddening. It's impossible for me to believe that anyone in our area would have built a home with so little forethought to the insulation that, at the very least, would improve the overall comfort of the home...regardless of the 80's codes or not.

I really do appreciate everyone's input and y'all given me a LOT to think about. I guess we'd better put some money aside each month until we have enough to do something. I sure don't want to be crawling up and down that ladder one more winter...ughh!

Thanks all!!!

RVcook

Houses are built everywhere with usually only the thought of making it look good for as cheaply as possible. They know who their buyers are and even the custom built homes are done this way as people care more about the color of the walls then the insulation.

Do a lot of research or you might be throwing good money after bad attempting to fix one problem and creating others.
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  #48  
Old 02/06/11, 01:09 PM
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zone 5 - riverfrontage
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Forests of maine
Posts: 5,872
I sprayed our spray-on foam myself. It was very easy to do.

Two components each in a bottle the size of a 20lb propane bottle. Hooked up to hoses and a disposable nozzle. The stuff shoots out real hot, it expands and within 15 seconds it is hard.

Our walls and roof are all steel sheeting. I sprayed 1 1/2 inches of foam on our walls and across the ceiling.

It sticks to everything. It hardens and becomes structural. It deadens sound. It stops drafts.

Then I hung 9 inches of fiberglass batting on that followed by wood grain paneling and trim.

I am totally in favor of spray-on foam

It is very easy to use.

The snow/ice does not slide off our roof quickly but that is due to us not having a steep roof. Our roof rises 1 foot for every 10 foot of run.
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