Farmer's grant from uncle Sam

springvalley · #21 11/09/10, 12:45 PM

The less you deal with the government the better you are, Had a few guys around here apply for the EQUIP. program and had nothing but trouble. The CRP program is ok but the payments you receive for enrolling your farm in it is alot less than you can get for renting your farm to another farmer. It is good if you are ready to retire and don`t need alot of money, farms paid for, and your just sitting back and waiting for the dirt nap. Regular farm program is not worth a darn as they have you doing no till corn-soybeans in hills that were never meant for soybeans. And as far as young/begining farmers program, I don`t know of anyone around here that has ever used it, most young farmers around here have Dad to back them up, or Grandpa. When you ask Uncle Sam for monetary help you just ask for trouble. > Thanks Marc

ksfarmer · #22 11/09/10, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by springvalley

The less you deal with the government the better you are, Had a few guys around here apply for the EQUIP. program and had nothing but trouble. The CRP program is ok but the payments you receive for enrolling your farm in it is alot less than you can get for renting your farm to another farmer. It is good if you are ready to retire and don`t need alot of money, farms paid for, and your just sitting back and waiting for the dirt nap. . > Thanks Marc

Marc; I can't speak for Illinois , but, around here CRP payments pretty well match the average for cash rent.

springvalley · #23 11/09/10, 12:54 PM

Some of the big boys are still buying farm ground, but alot of it is bought by investors and then rented back to farmers, land is a good investment if you can buy it right, they sure arein`t making anymore of it, what we have is all there is. Was a farm sold a month ago about ten miles north of me, brought 6800.00 an acre. There is another 200+ acres being sold today, I will find out what that brings but I bet that much or more. I`m afraid to put a price on mine as I might get it.> Thanks Marc

springvalley · #24 11/09/10, 01:00 PM

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Originally Posted by ksfarmer

Marc; I can't speak for Illinois , but, around here CRP payments pretty well match the average for cash rent.

Most Government payments around here are around 160 per acre, and rents are anywhere from 200 and up. Depends on your farm, but some of the old timers are getting as much for rent as they paid for their farms back 40-50years ago. > Marc

Sammy · #25 11/12/10, 10:12 AM

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Originally Posted by brreitsma

No one can begin farming in my area. A lot has been sold to developers. $100,000 an acre.

You need to move out of New York City !

brreitsma · #26 11/12/10, 10:18 AM

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You need to move out of New York City !

I'm in a suburb of Minneapolis in Minnesota. Yeah my area is highly over rated.

fantasymaker · #27 11/12/10, 10:51 AM

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Originally Posted by texican

It's almost impossible to make a go of it, in traditional farming, with land prices so exorbitant... You could be looking at a multimillion dollar investment, along with infrastructure... the interest payments alone would kill you.

The only way I could see a newbie getting into traditional farming is to marry into it or inherit it. Even if you inherit it, it's going to be destroyed by the death tax rule... doesn't take much to get hit, and Uncle Sam and his Entitlementistas will take up to ? 45%.

The Dynasty tax only affects those sucking off the dead if your building a farm on your own it wont affect you at all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ErinP

Most people managed to skirt the death tax rules by transfers prior to death and other perfectly legitimate methods. This is what estate planning is FOR, afterall.

So far as your original point, yeah, even in ranching (which has considerably less upfront costs (very little machinery, MUCH cheaper land, etc)) there's still no way to get into it in a traditional sense.
Not even if the wife has the proverbial job-in-town.
We've looked at it from every angle.
It's just not possible.

So, you have to approach it from a non-traditional sense, build up a little at a time, and maybe someday with some luck and time, it might support you.

LOL THAT IS the traditional way of building a farm.!
Heres how its done as told to me by a guy that just died a couple years back with over 3000 acres here. In Il where 640 is a good farm.
First you get out of the army with a few bucks saved and buy machinery and a farm....way more farm than you EVER think you can pay for.
Then your folks rent you a farm about the same size.
Now heres the key
You get lucky and after a few years land values take a big jump. so your original farm is now mostly paid for.
Then after a few years you agin borrow far more than you think you will ever pay off and buy twice as much ground. but you already have half the ground nearly paid for to help.
and heres the key
You get lucky and land takes a big jump in value.
at this point your big enough to make a good living and to still have enough left over to by 40 acres or so every year out of earnings.
and then ya agin buy a big chunk,FAR more than you think you will ever pay for....
At this point he died but his kids are pleased that farm earnings here to a huge jump in the last couple of years......

ErinP · #28 11/12/10, 11:01 AM

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Then your folks rent you a farm about the same size.
Now heres the key

No, the key is just before you think it is.
I'd bet my left arm, he didn't pay the going rate for the farm he rented. Which goes back to the point about having to inherit it.

Also:

Quote:

First you get out of the army with a few bucks saved and buy machinery and a farm...

Either he was in the Army for a number of years, or he was paid considerably better than they are today, OR machinery/land was a lot cheaper. There is no way someone can buy a sustainable farm today on an Army salary. Unless it was saved for a decade or better!

texican · #29 11/12/10, 11:33 AM

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Originally Posted by fantasymaker

The Dynasty tax only affects those sucking off the dead if your building a farm on your own it wont affect you at all.

So, you don't believe a person should be able to give there children their estates... instead, half should go to the govt.

Sucking off the Dead. Interesting way of putting it. Methinks it's the Dead Weight on Society, the non-productive classes, that are sucking off the Dead Formerly Alive Producers of Wealth, And the Currently Living Producers.

I started to say something snarky about the above comment, but realized it would not be nice, and if you can't say something good, say nothing at all...

Your belief in "Dynasty Taxes" reveals volumes. Assume you'll not get any "Dynasty" and not give any "Dynasty".

I got some Dynasty, and I'll give even more Dynasty upon my passing. And the Dead Weighters I hope get nothing... they can get off their couches and work and get their own.

I don't reckon I have any rights or claims on anyone else's property when they pass away. It should go to whoever they stipulated in their wills, whether it be their children or the dog.

ksfarmer · #30 11/12/10, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by texican

So, you don't believe a person should be able to give there children their estates... instead, half should go to the govt.

Sucking off the Dead. Interesting way of putting it. Methinks it's the Dead Weight on Society, the non-productive classes, that are sucking off the Dead Formerly Alive Producers of Wealth, And the Currently Living Producers.I started to say something snarky about the above comment, but realized it would not be nice, and if you can't say something good, say nothing at all...

Your belief in "Dynasty Taxes" reveals volumes. Assume you'll not get any "Dynasty" and not give any "Dynasty".

I got some Dynasty, and I'll give even more Dynasty upon my passing. And the Dead Weighters I hope get nothing... they can get off their couches and work and get their own.I don't reckon I have any rights or claims on anyone else's property when they pass away. It should go to whoever they stipulated in their wills, whether it be their children or the dog.

I agree with Texican on this. Part of our farm is inherited, part has been added by 45 years of hard work, scrimping, and saving by my wife and I. Why should the govt be allowed to take a big portion and dole it out to those who did nothing to earn it? I hope to leave it to my 2 sons, they helped earn it by doing without some of the things their town friends had, such as fancy cars. My sons put in a lot of hard hours of work helping us to build this "dynasty". I hope they have the oportunity to continue the "dynasty".

fantasymaker · #31 11/12/10, 08:18 PM

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Originally Posted by ksfarmer

I agree with Texican on this. Part of our farm is inherited, part has been added by 45 years of hard work, scrimping, and saving by my wife and I. Why should the govt be allowed to take a big portion and dole it out to those who did nothing to earn it? ".

LOL thats pretty much how taxes work.Like it or not the government takes it.The government takes a big chunk EVERY year. Id rather pay my taxes after Im dead and let everyone start on more or less the same footing ,remeber that line about "Alll men are created equal"?
I would like to think that sometimes the government uses my tax money for something useful like roads and defence.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ksfarmer

I hope to leave it to my 2 sons, they helped earn it by doing without some of the things their town friends had, such as fancy cars. My sons put in a lot of hard hours of work helping us to build this "dynasty". I hope they have the oportunity to continue the "dynasty".

Id say thats great but why do they have to wait for someone to die to reap the rewards of their hard work? If they have worked why not PAY them? Thats one of the keys to our nation,that when someone works he is entiled to the fruits of his labor.I think that if the dynasty tax was to replace a lot of the other taxes ALL of us working people INCLUDING your kids would live a MUCH better life.
BUT No one is entiltled to another mans property.....except the government!

fantasymaker · #32 11/12/10, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by texican

So, you don't believe a person should be able to give there children their estates... instead, half should go to the govt..

Actually I think it ALL should go to taxes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by texican

Sucking off the Dead. Interesting way of putting it. Methinks it's the Dead Weight on Society, the non-productive classes, that are sucking off the Dead Formerly Alive Producers of Wealth, And the Currently Living Producers.

I started to say something snarky about the above comment, but realized it would not be nice, and if you can't say something good, say nothing at all...

Your belief in "Dynasty Taxes" reveals volumes. Assume you'll not get any "Dynasty" and not give any "Dynasty".

I got some Dynasty, and I'll give even more Dynasty upon my passing. And the Dead Weighters I hope get nothing... they can get off their couches and work and get their own.

I don't reckon I have any rights or claims on anyone else's property when they pass away. It should go to whoever they stipulated in their wills, whether it be their children or the dog.

I very much agree with you about the government carrying a lot of dead weight its a shame Id like to see something done about it.
But that really dosent affect the WAY taxes are apportioned, I dont like the current system.

texican · #33 11/13/10, 01:12 PM

The govt. is nothing but society's construction for order. The govt. is us. As long as people believe it's alright to do something, it will be done, right or wrong.

fantasymaker · #34 11/13/10, 02:58 PM

Good point! But we as the people can change things for the better ,I prefer the Dynasty tax over the income tax.
I think that I would have more through my life if I could build wealth without a good chunk of any profit being shiphioned off by the governmet.
After Im dead who cares?