How many pay for fire protection

watcher · #41 10/06/10, 03:10 PM

I'm sorry for the guy but he knew the rules. As someone pointed out if you could pay the fee when your house was on fire why would anyone pay before hand? It takes money to buy and keep the equipment functional and w/o all those $75 fees where is that money going to come from?

Patt · #42 10/06/10, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chickenslayer

Here we all pay a county fire tax. We have both paid and volunteer companies, I always send the $25 to the volunteer companies when they send out their fundraising letters because those guys are the closest to my house, in my opinion it would be beyond stupid not to support the local volunteers when they might not just save your house but your life as well. As far as the guy in Tenn who didn't feel it was important to spend the $75 to protect his house I agree with the fire company that let his house burn.

I must have missed something....where exactly did it say why he didn't pay it? Maybe the day they came by to collect he didn't have the $75. Maybe he forgot. Maybe it was hard to do, like you had to catch them at the firehouse. Why does everybody assume he just didn't want to pay?

The summer before our house burnt the guys came by for their annual fund raiser and ya know what? I was broke that day. I told them I would send something later, I just didn't have the money right then. They said that was fine. I forgot. Never thought about it again until the day my house burnt down. And you know what? They didn't sit down there at the end of my driveway and watch my house burn over a measley $30 bucks because they are decent human beings!

Sawmill Jim · #43 10/06/10, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watcher

I'm sorry for the guy but he knew the rules. As someone pointed out if you could pay the fee when your house was on fire why would anyone pay before hand? It takes money to buy and keep the equipment functional and w/o all those $75 fees where is that money going to come from?

Read post 22 . I know the man the nuts at City Hall and even some of his children .

arabian knight · #44 10/06/10, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watcher

I'm sorry for the guy but he knew the rules. As someone pointed out if you could pay the fee when your house was on fire why would anyone pay before hand? It takes money to buy and keep the equipment functional and w/o all those $75 fees where is that money going to come from?I agree with you 100%.

Sure it is a hard lesson but the guy did learn something now didn't he?

Patt · #45 10/06/10, 04:53 PM

I think Tamsam was right and all the self righteous trolls aren't actually in GC they are everywhere here......

thequeensblessing · #46 10/06/10, 05:08 PM

Pay as you go type of service is when you pay for something after you receive a service. This sounds so much like mafia-type "protection money". You pay a set fee every month or so and they will protect you. Otherwise, no promises! Yes, it's legal, but is it ethical? I can't wrap my brain around that.
We pay taxes that include fire response, make donations on fund drives, and donate to and attend VFD auctions. I'd be irritated if they added a "fee" on top of that. But if they do, I'll pay the fee, but they won't be getting all the other cash from me that they currently get.

MO_cows · #47 10/06/10, 05:08 PM

I feel very bad for the family. They made a mistake and it cost them dearly. But it was their mistake. Sometimes you just gotta put on your big boy pants and live with the consequences of your actions. It would really stink if their insurance policy refused to pay anything since they had overlooked paying their fire protection dues. But with a small community like that, hopefully there will be fundraisers and people will do things to help them.

Our fire protection is also by volunteers. They used to have the system of paying dues but were able to get some kind of tax-based funding put in place. Maybe this tragedy will motivate these citizens to come up with something better.

mylala · #48 10/06/10, 05:10 PM

Our FD has a yearly subscription for $120....if they have to respond to your place for a fire then there is no charge if the subscription was already paid....if not paid they still respond and put out fire....but they charge you $2,000, and after two hours it's an additional $1,000/hr. My homeowners insurance will pay like $3,500 to FD in an event of fire, so I have been slack in getting the subscription....there always seems like something else needs the $ so I put it off.

lmrose · #49 10/06/10, 05:18 PM

Hats off to all fire fighters both men and women! Here many people would have lost either homes or lives without these courageous volunteers. Most of our fire departments are volunteers who have had professional training. A tax of less than $50 a year is added to our property tax bills to help fund local fire departments. New equipment is funded by volunteer fund raising and some government money given. Everyone should contribute to help their local fire fighters.

arabian knight · #50 10/06/10, 05:29 PM

Yuppers what every happened to "Ask Not What your Country Can Do For You, But What You Can Do For Your Country"
Oh ya that Kennedy was Killed.
And now it is gimme gimme, its mine, I want it, even though I did not not earn it, or PAY for it. Give it to me for free.
What a wrong way for the masses of a great country to act.

watcher · #51 10/06/10, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MO_cows

I feel very bad for the family. They made a mistake and it cost them dearly. But it was their mistake. Sometimes you just gotta put on your big boy pants and live with the consequences of your actions. It would really stink if their insurance policy refused to pay anything since they had overlooked paying their fire protection dues. But with a small community like that, hopefully there will be fundraisers and people will do things to help them.

Our fire protection is also by volunteers. They used to have the system of paying dues but were able to get some kind of tax-based funding put in place. Maybe this tragedy will motivate these citizens to come up with something better.

From what little I've seen it seems like this is just what the guy is doing. He has owned up to his mistake. Looks to me like he is just trying to use his tragedy to change things so others don't have to go through it.

crispin · #52 10/06/10, 07:23 PM

I live in Nowhere, TN
My town is so small that we have nothing. No traffic light, no police force, no nothing.
We do however have a Volunteer Fire Dept. Their cost is covered by my property tax.
That is what property tax is supposed to cover.
I do not understand how they watched it burn.

arabian knight · #53 10/06/10, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crispin

I live in Nowhere, TN
My town is so small that we have nothing. No traffic light, no police force, no nothing.
We do however have a Volunteer Fire Dept. Their cost is covered by my property tax.
That is what property tax is supposed to cover.
I do not understand how they watched it burn.

Well maybe this will shed some light on the subject.
This occurred in an area not covered by fire protection due to cost.
Not every jurisdiction pays for fire out of taxes. This is TN like you said and along with a few counties each way its the last place in that part of the country.
This occurred in rural West Tennessee. There is no county fire department. Residents have the option of purchasing fire services from a nearby town, South Fulton.
And if you want to get legal about things.
The firefighters being agents of the dept. and bound by their agreement therewith. Hence the 75 bucks for fire protection services.

rkintn · #54 10/06/10, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arabian knight

Well maybe this will shed some light on the subject.
This occurred in an area not covered by fire protection due to cost.
Not every jurisdiction pays for fire out of taxes. This is TN like you said and along with a few counties each way its the last place in that part of the country.
This occurred in rural West Tennessee. There is no county fire department. Residents have the option of purchasing fire services from a nearby town, South Fulton.
And if you want to get legal about things.
The firefighters being agents of the dept. and bound by their agreement therewith. Hence the 75 bucks for fire protection services.

I think a big part of the argument is that there are several VFD's in the area that would have responded and put out the fire, but the 911 system would not route the call to them instead it routed it to the nearest town, South Fulton. Why didn't the town call a VFD of they KNEW they weren't going to help the guy? Sure, they had no legal obligation but ethically, I think they can be held liable for that. I for one hope the guy hires a lawyer and looks into his options. It may just very well save someone else from this disaster.

Because no matter how you look at it or what you may think about him not paying the fee...THSHTF for that guy and now he is out of a home, belongings, memories and peace of mind. It's just wrong.

TNHermit · #55 10/06/10, 09:02 PM

Here is a little thought for you. Where ever the word fire is insert Health Care

arabian knight · #56 10/06/10, 09:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TNHermit

Here is a little thought for you. Where ever the word fire is insert Health Care

And then you can visualize just what our health care will be like in the coming years. When the new health care gets up and running. You don't pay for something that comes from the government and your health care will go down hill fast. Just like this house burned down that the payment was not made for coverage.

Fat Charlie · #57 10/07/10, 08:22 PM

I understand the city not wanting its fire department running willy-nilly throughout the unincorporated areas outside the city- those trucks are expensive, and it reduces the city's protection. It's great that they have a program for people in the unincorporated area to opt-in to their fire coverage.

I've got three questions, though. First, how are medical emergencies treated in that area? Will they check the dues status of a car's owner before sending an ambulance to an accident?

Second, if 911 was so horrible for referring the fire call to the South Fulton FD when other departments were nearer, why had Cranick been a paying subscriber of the SFFD until this year? Shouldn't he have been a subscriber of one of the closer ones?

Third, Sawmill Jim, rkintin and tnokie are hoping that Cranick sues South Fulton. What is his relationship with them? He's not a resident. He's not a subscriber to their out of town fire protection, either. What are the obligations of a city government to people living outside the city? Morally speaking, I think they should have responded. Legally? Were I a South Fultoner, I'd demand that the city countersue to recoup their costs involved in defending against a frivolous lawsuit.

Responding to the fire would have been the right thing to do, though.

rkintn · #58 10/07/10, 08:59 PM

Most (in any) of the VFD's don't charge subscription fees. I really think if there is a law suit it's going to center around the wrong routing/not rerouting the call and the fact that the firefighters just stood around watching the property burn. The city may very well countersue..as a matter of fact, I'd probably bet on it and they'll probably drag it along as long as they can. It will be interesting to see how it all turns out.

Old Vet · #59 10/07/10, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rkintn

Most (in any) of the VFD's don't charge subscription fees. I really think if there is a law suit it's going to center around the wrong routing/not rerouting the call and the fact that the firefighters just stood around watching the property burn. The city may very well countersue..as a matter of fact, I'd probably bet on it and they'll probably drag it along as long as they can. It will be interesting to see how it all turns out.

I was a volunteer firefighter. When we first open up you payed the dues then as time went on the number of dues paying members got reduced and the population grew.They were like you and didn't think of paying dues until they had a fire. I have had people run out and have money for dues while we were trying to fight a fire to keep from paying the higher cost. Then we got a fire tax included in the real estate tax so now everybody pays. Where I now live you paid dues every year.

rkintn · #60 10/07/10, 09:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Vet

I was a volunteer firefighter. When we first open up you payed the dues then as time went on the number of dues paying members got reduced and the population grew.They were like you and didn't think of paying dues until they had a fire. I have had people run out and have money for dues while we were trying to fight a fire to keep from paying the higher cost. Then we got a fire tax included in the real estate tax so now everybody pays. Where I now live you paid dues every year.

Excuse me? Did you see me say anywhere that I didn't think of paying dues? No you did not. Did you see me say I didn't think it was right for the fire dept to respond and watch that guys house burn..yes you did. There are alot of questions still unanswered about the whole situation. Sometimes it takes this kind of situation and the resulting lawsuits to get problems in the system straightened out. There is obviously a problem somewhere.

I haven't heard of ANY VFD in this area charge dues..period. I am not sure if most of their money comes from taxes or grants or whatever. Thankfully, we live within the city limits of our town and I know the FD isn't gonna just come out and watch the house burn to the ground. The local city fire departments charge to those just outside the city limits. I know that for a fact because my mother lives just outside the city limits of Martin, TN and they sent her a bill for her dues while we were living there. It was for $100. She paid it and I'm glad she did. I'm sure should the FD come out on a call, they will put in a claim to her insurance as well. I can't believe a $100 will even come close to paying for the response.