Rethinking Wally World

Steve, I buy my coffee at a highend grocery store ... which sells it for cheaper than Walmart. Last time I was there, I saved so much on the Folgers (3.99 for giant cans - a necessity in a caffeine driven household) that I was able to buy extra good tea (my fave, too, jasmine green tea!)

I read somewhere last week that Wally made 1.5billion last Friday alone. Could it be that Wally World discovered a secret formula for success???? Give people what they want at a price they can afford?

When I see something I want or need I buy it. Sometimes its junk. I know it's junk. I like to buy quality, but something I'm going to use sparingly, why buy quality?

I go to Wally's all the time. I can drive around town all day, buy the same stuff, have no return policy, pay more, or go to Wally's and get it all in one stop. Yes, that is called convenience. A lot of folks are willing to pay for that. Use to buy my tires for several vehicles at the local tire shops. Zero warranty, oops, belay that, they would give me a couple dollars off on new ones, but no road hazard warranties. Wally has a no questions asked policy for 5$. Returned wore out tires with blowouts for new ones. Last $110 tire cost me 2.78$. I don't know about ya'll, but an extra $107 I didn't have to pay for the tire is a big deal to me.

People will be rude anywhere if they've had a long day or a bad day. Can't remember when I ran into a rude or discourteous Wally world employee. Can't say the same about the mom and pop shops, especially if your bringing something back. Talk about the Evil Eye. That alone will send me running back to wallys.

Wages. Dang, I need to look for the guards with the shotguns, and check for the ankle chains, keeping those poor souls from escaping their bondage. Out here in the boonies, the $8/hr starting local wage is pretty dang good for a high school 'grad y ate'. Same people are there for years. Those people are there cause they either want to be, or have no drive to find better employment. Same people think McD's and BK's should pay a living wage. It's a starter job, who wants to work there forever?

Quality. Get what you pay for. Some folks can't afford cadillacs and have to settle for yugo's or nothing. Poor folks buy what they can afford. I've got several dvd players, including one of the absolute cheapest pieces of so called junk ever made, an Apex 1100. It plays everything I throw in it, dvd, cvd, vcd, svcd, even unauthored mpeg files. Compliant files, it doesn't care. My expensive progressive scan player is so blankety blank finicky, I rarely if ever use it. $40 player beats the @$%^ out of the $200 player. Even dropped it one day, fell four feet, figured it was a boat anchor. Still works perfectly.

China Mart. This is the old chicken and the egg argument. Life imitating art, art imitating life. Jobs go overseas because someone in Malaysia will sew that shirt for fifty cents an hour instead of fifteen an hour in the states. It's getting harder and harder to justify paying $42 for a pair of pants, American made, when I can get 3 pair of foreign pants for the same price. The $5 closeout hiking boots I got last spring are/were cheap. But their wearing as well as the $95 pair that look/feel just the same. At $5, I got several extra pair as backups. The equation boils down to this. Everybody wants to see a return on their labor/investment. If I work, I expect to make money. If I price myself out of the market, I have no work. If I invest, I expect a return. I don't want the company I'm investing in to lose money, but to make money. Certain low skill jobs are better/cheaper done overseas. If your stuck in a low paying job, learn a skill in demand that will pay higher wages. I can work at McD's for min wage, or do a plumbing job for $40/hr. Work all day, or one hour? Any job that that can be exported will. Is it right? Are you willing to pay 3x or 4x to save that job. Honestly.


I'm sure a lot of you have had problems with your wallys. I simply haven't run into the same problems. I try to consume as little as possible. I daresay, if everybody consumed as much as I do, the country would grind to a screeching halt within a week. All restaurants would close immediately. Clothing shops, bye bye. Malls, see ya. Cinemas/nightclubs, lets open em maybe one night a year.

We have three walmarts and a two Sam's clubs within 1/2 hour of the house, been to all of them and really haven't seen the rudeness people talk about, also went to a walmart and Sam's when we lived in Ga. same story, you might run into one once in awhile but most of the rudeness was from customers. I go to walmart a couple times a month, don't often buy anything, just look around. We never buy groceries there any more, the prices are better at Albertsons and Smiths, we shop the sales, and something is on sale all the time, if we use it we buy it then. Bought 20 cans of tomato sauce at Albertsons this evening for $2.00, we didn't go there for tomato sauce but it will not go to waste.

The only time you can consistantly get a good deal at a walmart is within the first six months they are open, and service galore, after that the prices go up and the help gets let go = long check out lines and very little assistance in most departments. One thing it does do though, is it causes every one else in the area to lower their prices. One question I've long wondered about is if the local guys can sell it for a dollar less now that walmart has come to town why couldn't they before? They have been taking us to the cleaners for years but now are our best friends.

As far as the quality of their stuff I have noticed on a few things that I have been interested in, even name brand stuff, you can not find the model walmart carries anywhere else. Why? Don't know, don't care, don't want it. Guess I'm affraid of not being able to find repair parts should I need them. Now if they have a better deal on the very same thing or if it's something I am not going to use much I'll buy cheap.

They opened a Wally World 25 miles away from here, and it effects the local businesses in an adverse manner.

What really chaps me is that governing bodies bend over backwards to bring WalMart and there low wages/no benefits into town.
Screw WalMart. Our Pharmacy has been paying taxes, providing employment, and being involved in the community for decades. Same with our hardware store, grocery store, etc. Giving Wal Mart a nickel so they can take part in destroying your local business is beyond stupidity.

WalMart has long been sucking on the government teat of corporate welfare, in the guise of economic developement, work force training (I haven't seen any job position in WalMart that requires over a few hours of training), reduced or complete elimination of property taxes, land grants, free leases, special road constuction etc.

IMHO, giving corporate welfare to a company that is directly competing against businesses, that have sustained and contributed to your community for decades.... is complete insanity.


I won't even go into how WalMart has wrapped themselves in the US flag......while they continue to be communist China's biggest customer.

i dunno where YOU live... but the wal marts here (4 within 30 min of me plus a sams club) start you out at an aboue average wage and you get benifits.. ---- good benifits. plus bonus'.. like the more the store saves from theft compared to the last quarter, a % of that is split equally amoung all the employees... I know a woman who is a district manager, she said the next theft-bonus going out was @ 1200 bucks, they had a really good quarter and the employees were realy nailing people left and right when they started that program. You dont stay where you start, they continuously move people up the ladder and bring new people in "on the floor". you play the walmart game and you go up. i dont call that bad or exploitive. I know 5 people who work there, one guy started in the auto department changing tires, in 2 yrs he is now the auto dept manager, and he doesnt have a degree or any speacial training. they moved him up because he was a good worker. all 5 of these folks wouldt work anyplace else.
Someday if I really need a full time job, i know wal marts there and what I can get out of it.
Here at least, wal mart isnt a blessing for the tiny stores, but it sure isnt exploiting the job hunters for low wages no benifits.
I work on and off in a larger than average hardwar store owned by one guy, its been there for years. people come to that store because they can get stuff the depot and lowes dont have, or cant get. he losses business on common stuff HD and lowez sells cheaper... but the specialty stuff he cant keep up with. example... I'm putting in some baseboard heaters, lowes and home depot have one brand, after i looked them up they have bad reps as heaters go. A 6 footer cost 50 bucks, with no thermostat. my buddys store will special order me cadet brand heaters (good rep) 6 footers for 35 bucks, and the custom theromstats for that model for 12 bucks a pop. Yes, I have to wait a few weeks, but the quality is better and so is the price.
sometimes, it just boils down to that people dont want to wait, so they buy junk.
small stores have specialties they can exploit... most dont even try. we have 4 lowes and 4 home depots within 30 min of here, and he hasnt gone down the tubes yet. he has to reorganize and sell different stuff, but he's still floating well.
ya gotta adapt or die.

Comfortablynumb,

4 walmarts
4 lows
4 homedepots

Where do you live? Heaven

I agree with everything bad that anybody ever said about Wal-mart....

BUT

The main reason I don't shop there is because I don't want a dime of my money going to China. My reason for this won't matter to everybody but here it is:

The Chinese government kidnaps, tortures, imprisons and kills Christians.

That's enough reason for me, to never step a toe into Walmart. I know other stores carry stuff from China but honestly, we do not buy it. Its not easy or convenient to take this stand, but we don't care. Rather do without.

Isn't that one of the good things about homesteading? Move towards independence, so you don't have to do stuff that goes against your conscience, just to survive. We're not homesteading yet, we're renting another 6 months, but we're willing to have a different definition of "needs."

Amy

It was a blessing to my heart to read some of the posts regarding WalMart. Yes, you can get some good deals -- but the "tariff" you and your community pay just don't make the savings worth it in the long run.

I have seen many communities with no store available -- except WalMart -- because all the mom & pop places had to close shop. Then watch what happens to the prices at Wally World. Suddenly, the deals aren't so good anymore.

The service and convenience of patronizing my small, locally owned stores is worth much more to me than anything WalMart could ever offer. They know me by name, and sometimes know my needs better than I do myself. And the money I spend helps support their families -- and my own community. My dollars stay right here. I buy their stuff... and they buy mine. Works out rather nicely.

The nearest town with a WalMart is 20 miles from me. And I hope it stays that way. They did try to build a warehouse about 10 miles away, but when the county wouldn't meet all of their demands -- they packed up their marbles and moved on to the next county. It was quite a controversy. Rather than purchase land already zoned for warehouses, they wanted to buy up a large horse farm and have it rezoned. Only reason they wanted to do that was to avoid paying the full price for commercial real estate. I'm glad they got mad and decided not to play with us. Have respect for our community -- or take your game elsewhere!

Bea

Better look a bit closer. Sometimes we pay more than money for cheap goods made with cheap labor.

Someday it might cost us everything we have....

dear Unregistered...

I owe no one. I have a great home (not a house, people sell houses, I have a home, can never sell it) and a better homestead. The only bills I have each month are for the extras. When I buy something, it's for the extras that make life a little easier.

I follow the self sufficiency credo. I also have survivalist training and experience. Phd in Bush Engineering, trained by the best. I have excess money coming in each month, and a five year cushion of savings. If I don't buy these extras, it'll just go into savings, stretching the cushion further into the future. Being a survivalist, looking into the future to see what problems might confront me, I realize that cash savings are worthless. So why not spend the excess on worthless junk and trivial pursuits??? If society falls tomorrow, my 5 year cushion is just a piece of paper with numbers on it, good for starting a fire maybe. I have lived years without stuff, to what end? It didn't make me a better person, just a person without stuff, sitting in the dark. I know I may be in the minority here, but I have everything I ever planned on, except for a someone to share it with, but that's for another board. So why not get junk at Wallyworld. Is my buying a cheap piece of plastic going to endanger my future? I can live without it, but I cant see how it's gonna bite me in the rear. Oh, I guess someday if I decide to take a minimum wage job, I might discover that it's been exported to China. Now if we could just import some of the Chinese willing to do the backbreaking farm labor jobs, that no one, repeat NO ONE wants. I've offered hs and college kids to work on my place for $10/hr. they ask about benefits, time off, promotions. Hey, I want you to come build fence for a week, not a corporate vp. position.

Should we build a wall around the country. Shut off all, repeat ALL foreign trade? Cut out the oil, the food, the tools, clothes, communication, transportation, etc. Yeah, more jobs would be created, but would you be able to afford the stuff. We cut off the spigot to the rest of the world and what do you think they're gonna do. Call in their loans, pull out their investments, nationalize our assets. Sounds like an economic death spiral.

I could go on and on. Basically, bring on the end. I'll need to start milking the cow again. Yep, guess that's the big change I'd have to endure. No new music or movies. Have thousands of hours of each already, and thousands of books.

You'll have a hard time convincing people to stop shopping at Wallys. Its genetic. Hunter gatherers. Who wants to walk twenty miles for the good grubs and berries when this place five minutes walk away has better grubs and berries? I'd rather kill the mastodon in an easy closeup location than trudge through the tundra for a week, and maybe not even see one, and risk death wandering into Grog's territory. Does that make sense. Hunter/gatherers settled around places where life was easier. Convenience strikes a chord in our genetic makeup.

Still need to write down note to myself: Check out the evil guards who are keeping those unwilling slaves working in Wallyworld, forcing them to work.

Are you sure? Money is going overseas. It will be used to build up another nation.

What will we use to rebuild ours? Oh, thats right. We can't, because we don't manufacture anything anymore, and we have no money.

We have a old walmart and are getting a new "super center".... By 2008 it is speculated that walmart will have 52% of the grocery business in the USA.. Being a farmer that really bothers me............I feel they are getting way too big for themselves.......Remember what my dad always said "once you get to the top there is only one way to go" I am hoping they are at the top and it all falls apart..... may take a while but hey one can dream. Our town of Ozark , Missouri bent over backward to help them with the new store area..... Which I am sure they would help me with my beef business just as much........HA HA.... I do shop some at walmart but I am trying to "wean myself" from them.... I think that educated people can see what is happening but we all know the everyday consumer doesn't care where it comes from or who sells it .... just who has it the cheapest.................well that is a bad concept. and I am a cheapskate bigtime..............but I know cheap is not always best.............I don't think we will ever see coverage bad about them on the big three tv networks because guess who has big time ads on all three networks???? yep Walmart.............

I personally hope that the local stores do better after the supercenter is opened.............time will tell..............I will give an update next spring.

Keep the faith!

Scott

__________________
Lower your heating costs!
www.outsidewoodheater.com

Before I got into real estate, i spent several years as a buyer/manager for a large retail chain, and has a wholesale sales rep for a major appliance manufacturer. Back then, there were very few major manufacturers of tools and appliances that had that practice. Almost none. My brother, who has spent the last 15 years as a wholesale buyer for power tools and electronics, says the practice is all but non-existent today. He deals with companies such as Black and Decker, DeWalt (same co.), Sony, Panasonic, Makita, Toshiba, etc. Virtually all of the major manufacturers. Had dinner with him last night and brought this subject up. He tells me that the major companies just can't afford to have a bad reputation that would result by producing crap. Essentially, what you are saying, is an old wive's tale. Yea, Walmart sells crap like Apex electronics, and their paper cups may fall apart. But if you buy a Black and Decker drill at Walmart, it is the same quality as the drill you pay at a hardware store or anywhere else. Some store chains may have certain models that is only theirs, for competitive reasons, but the quality is generally the same.

So.....hate to burst your bubble, but you are wrong.

It makes me feel good that many others share my feelings about Wal-Mart.
Screw Wal-Mart!

They are reported to be the largest private employer in the U.S. . Now that is a very scary fact. Now you can have a job with the largest company and still qualify for gov't assistance. Besides that the company you work for gets tax breaks from the gov't. and who said communism is dead? The $2 you save on your buggy of groceries will go towards paying the gov't assistance for the WM employees.

then stop paying income ttax too...



so does isreal and a lot of middle eastern countries.

I havent done that business in 10yrs... but I still can tell the crap major brands from the hiq stuff. I bought and handled the stuff, thats what I saw. MAYBE what I was getting was copywright infringed clones, I dunno. I was just IN wallyworld tonight, looking over thier xmas tools they have piled everywhere. if they dont do this practice, then the "house specialty" from the major brands is cheaper made clones... sorry dude I see them all the time. maybe what I am seing isnt what i think it is, but I see good brand name stuff and CRAPPY brand name stuff cheaper but almost identical. figure out what I am seeing and what I was buying and I'd love to hear what it was really.
I have had in my hands tools with NO name whatsoever on them, and brand name tools that except for the stickers were IDENTICAL.
again this was 10 or more years ago, but i DO still see this stuff around in stores.

what am i seeing? what did I have in my hands? I'd really like to know for sure.

where can you do that? not where I live for sure...

oh you are living the communist DREAM. communism dressed up as democracy.
Komrade... you pay income tax, send your kids to public schools, pay property tax, use a centarized bank...and all the other planks of communism.
tis not dead, just crossdressing, komrade.

One thing it does do though, is it causes every one else in the area to lower their prices. One question I've long wondered about is if the local guys can sell it for a dollar less now that walmart has come to town why couldn't they before? They have been taking us to the cleaners for years but now are our best friends.



My hometown friends run a family hardware store, as they have for two generations. When walmart and home depot came to town, my friends attended a seminar on how to survive the retail mega chains. What they learned was disheartening: standard mega-chain policy is to operate at a loss for up to five years, to squeeze the life out of all the existing local businesses. Once they've strangled the independent stores within an x-mile radius, they're free to boost prices and reduce service. So your bargain can of coffee this year is going to cost you more next year, and you're going to have to stand in line for it, too. Moreover, a little piece of your community is going to wither up and die.

Likely, the dollar less your local guy is selling for is coming out of his hide, and he won't be around very long.


Here's a quote from today's New York Times:

Etch A Sketch is the same child's drawing toy today that it was in 1960, when Ohio Art first produced it in Bryan, Ohio. But efforts to keep its selling price below $10 on shelves at Wal-Mart and Toys "R" Us forced the company to move production to China three years ago.

Today the same toy is made not just for lower wages, but also under significantly harsher working conditions. Kin Ki's workers, in fact, are struggling to obtain rights that their American predecessors at Ohio Art won early in the last century, though the workers are without the aid of independent unions, which remain illegal in China.



And here's a link to an article from yesterday's Times, about walmart's operations in Mexico:

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/12/06/in...as/06MEXI.html

I have never seen a town that only had a wal-mart, strange. The Chinese Gov. murders Christains so we are going to punish the Chinese working slaves, makes perfect sense to me, actually it doesn't. I really do not think it is possible to buy anything where your money stays only in the U. S. since we don't make much anymore, most of our companies just assemble foreign parts here. So your money is still going overseas. Those few that actually do make things that are 100% american (U. S.) are either way too expensive or very few people use those things anyway. Whats the answer, don't know. Would be nice though if we could really buy american without spending too much more and still get the same quality as we used too.

Farmy,

Sorry that your friend is having such a tough time, really I am, it's hard to express real concern over the web. Not sure what you mean by (coming out of his hide) if you mean coming out of his profits, ok. If you mean operating at a loss, does he belong to a buyer (retailer) co-op of any kind, has he considered any other alternatives to stay competive? Don't get me wrong, I am not condoning what the mega-chains do, but at the same time it is a business and they are there to make money, and everyone's bonus depends on making a huge profit for the investers. Maybe that's the key, maybe we should abolish the stock market. Oh just wondering, does your friend sell anything in his store that ultimately sends money to a Communist nation other then this one? Or are we just picking on the mega-changes here?

etch-a-sketch, why is it so important to be the only thing in Toys-R-Us under $10 that you would move your manufacturing operation overseas? Don't be fooled by these people it was done for profit that's all. Although they are being a positive contributor to the Kin Ki's workers fight for a better way of life, and to borrow a phrase, that's a good thing.

NY Times article, nice try but I don't give out that type of information just so I can read what those people have to report, even if it were true.

Comfortablynumb,
You say that where you live WM employees(full time) don't qualify for gov't assistance? WalMarts personnel office will actually help you get assistance. not long ago there was a post on here linking to the story how they will assist you at getting assistance while you work for them. I guess it's part of their benefit package.

Has anyone noticed the evolution of Wal-Marts commercials? They are now advertising how well they treat employees and what a great place it is to work. The commercial showing the family at their nice home and the husband working at WM wearing his blue vest. Like anyone that works there wearing a blue vest could afford a nice home and support a family.

Quote:
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Originally Posted by texican
Is my buying a cheap piece of plastic going to endanger my future? I can live without it, but I cant see how it's gonna bite me in the rear.

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Are you sure? Money is going overseas. It will be used to build up another nation.

What will we use to rebuild ours? Oh, thats right. We can't, because we don't manufacture anything anymore, and we have no money))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))) ))))))))))

Sorry, I haven't figured out how to quote properly.

Response. Look into the future. If you see your area of expertise in decline, change jobs/areas of expertise. If you have no skills, no areas of expertise, well, your future is dim. And please, unregistered, register. Let's get on the roll of accountability. Think of it as learning a new skill.

I produce raw materials. They can be imported from overseas, but the shipping is exorbitant. When people stop wanting to eat, build homes, or heat their homes, well, I guess I'll be in trouble. I have timber, oil and gas, food, water. All of which people in cities cannot live without. Folks in Dallas use coal dug on the border of my land. Yankees use the natural gas produced from the well on the back 40 of my place, and the thirty other wells I own interest in. They still like to eat the beef eating my grass.

Invest in your future and your future will be more secure. But, you must invest wisely. Buy land, land, and more land. They aren't making anymore of it, except in Hawaii. Or you can buy some internet bubble stock.

My land provides an income. Value goes up more than 5%/year. Some has doubled in five years. Can look at it everyday. If necessary, could sell it all, and make a killing. But with a possibility of it appreciating 1000 to 2000% in ten years, think I'll hang onto it. Know it can happen, a real estate agent bought land bordering mine, is selling lots on a private lake for 70-500k/lot.

I've got relatives who had the exact same opportunities/assets that I had, they spent theirs on liquor and loose women, now their livin in 30yr old trailers, shopping at Wally's complaining about their zero skilled job goin to china... So I do know folks who complain, but empathy level for them is sorta low.

And to ? who mentioned farming. I empathize with you. Have farmed in the past. Come from a family of farmer/ranchers. Still have one uncle who's full time. Farming is the only business where you buy retail and sell wholesale. If you don't have a contract, you sell your product and take what they give you. Sorta like Walmart's doing to regular business, right?