Oh, Jlrbhjmnc...... (whew, that's quite an acronym (?))

Did I mention that it's nice to see you finally posting ? :)

You mentioned corrugated cardboard in your first post.
Just to be sure, that stuff is quite compostable and makes excellent worm food.

Welcome to thread and forum...... and never pass a free bag of leaves.
(at least not when I'm watching)

Thanks, Forerunner! I'm very pleased to have found this forum. :) The jumble of consonants is a family thing, in that Hubby and I have used a form of it online in various ways since our marriage. I hadn't considered it being awkward on forums, but it is odd, isn't it? Ah, well, then it fits me and our family perfectly :D - we're "weird" and getting more so every day.

Glad to know about the cardboard. We still have a bit of supply and I bet the guys at the local dump (ahem, "transfer station") would let us take from the cardboard dumpsters if we asked.

What is a good way to shred cardboard? Or should I just use it in the pile in between wet stuff? I do wish I had a mechanical way to shred cardboard and egg cartons. I'm sort of hung up on getting things into smaller pieces, though now I see I've been missing the importance having a pile of adequate size. All this clay and no compost for it ... :grump:. I am an impatient sort, but learning...

If I had a lot of cardboard or paper to contend with, I would layer it, sandwich style, with grass clippings, a bit of soil, a little finished compost, animal manures, etc.

Let the worms and the microbes shred it for you. Moisture would be the next thing.
Not too sopping wet, definitely not dry.

Sort of a cardboard sandwich for worms and microbes! I get it: Let them do the work. :doh: Now for some (extremely) smarter composting :o...

If I had a lot of cardboard, I might be tempted to run the lawnmower over it to shred it some and then mix it with grass clippings and kitchen scraps. . .

If I had a lot of cardboard (just plain ol' cardboard, not some crazy packaging stuff), I would use it as the base layer of mulch over an area of aggressive perennial weeds that were likely to push their way up through a deep layer of hay or leaves.

And the next time a start a garden i will have huge piles of mulch ready at head to go in as a permenant cover as soon the site is cleared and rooted up, so no vigorous perennials get a chance to thrive. Tilling in the spring and mulching heavily 6 months later in the fall is the hard way!

I can understand the addictive nature of collecting "valuable" stuff, but what in the world are you folks going to do with all this compost?

Have you figured out the time and fuel spent, let alone repairs and wear and tear on your equipment, to determine if the return on investment is even remotely worthwhile? Having a wonderful plot of land is great, bankrupting yourself to do it, then loosing it to the bank is not so great. Could be you are independently wealthy.

Pete

Redneck you should go read at the beginning. It's all explained there. Thats why threads have a beginning and you can't just jump in in the end.

I am SO incredibly jealous. Way too cool....and the toys....I want the toys :bow:

I'm thinking of asking Santa for a commercial chipper for Christmas<drool>.

Soil fertility is priceless!

If that isn't enough of a reason, just consider it as a recycling program: we are putting to good use that which is otherwise considered and treated as a waste product.

Oh, I'm not independently wealthy. However, there is no bank note on this plot of land or any of my equipment. I don't do debt. I can't speak for others, but for me, extreme composting is part of a pursuit of independence which is incongruent with the slavery of debt. :bash:

mudburn

Big chunks of cardboard are great for sheet composting. :)

Thank you, Jtjf. That was perfect.

No debt here, either. No banks. Just passion for soil.
The long term is to leave my children with some of the richest ground in the world. Food will again be king, soon, and those who can consistently provide it to people will again be afforded the honor and respect they deserve.

We'll not go into the independence that such would afford, nor the health benefits of eating from Utopian fertility.
Nor will I touch on the short-sighted tendencies and lack of vision/energy that has subsequently been bred into the masses and exacerbated by a general lack of real nutrition......

If we had a large enough property we would be doing this too. You can get the stuff for free, and it just increases the real value of your land which is its ability to produce. As it is, we are practicing a downsized version suitable for our property size. I am rather envious of some of these piles, even though they are bigger than our backyard, lol.

I actually have been reading this thread from day one, and I admire your motivation and initiative.

I grew up watching my mother spend more then twenty years digging literally tons of compost into very large, urban, backyard vegetable patch. It was truly wonderful soil.

She grew too old to manage the place, and moved to a townhouse. Less then a month later, the new owners brought in a bobcat, flattened the garden and sodded the entire backyard.

If you are the only one with food in an EOTWAWKI scenario, that food, and the ability to produce it will be taken from you by force.

Nevertheless, happy composting.

Pete

That's our situation, too, Ode. We have .72 acre and it is in a rural but semi-suburban setting, so we have to be careful of the neighbors. We have plenty of room to have at least a pickup-size pile, and thankfully our neighbors are all reasonable folks. Hubby can't wait to share with our fellow gardeners in the 'hood. I NEED this compost to improve our place, period. We have clay and rocks and we have no funds for buying soil amendments. Sadly (to me), a fair amount of our compost will go to grow grass in the front, to work on "curb appeal" for when we do sell. But I'll be using stuff I would have thrown out and had to cart to the dump, plus other folks' castoffs, so I can make progress within our means.

Pete, I can't say that I don't sympathize with your perspective.
As for your mother, she followed her passion, I dare say enjoyed it, and was blessed by the fruits of her own labor.

As for what happens post "structured" society, speak for yourself.
I don't know your situation, position, nor capabilities, and I've barely touched on my own, here. Providence will deal each of us exactly what "It" would have us to face and overcome in our time.
I'm rather looking forward to the challenge.

Forerunner, do you sell at a farmer's market? You have an extreme amount of gardening going on for just feeding your family. But who am I to wonder if one family can consume the produce from 500 tomato plants :) Just curious.

Every time I see a dead animal along the road, I have the urge to run the flies off, pick up the carcass; and take this this valuable resource home with me.

Does this urge ever go away?:pound:

I've sold on a VERY limited basis in the past.....gave a lot away.... but, this year I'm gearing up to sell on a larger scale.
The kids are really developing an appreciation for gardening, and Rachel and Sam are very interested in selling produce to the public. Sam even wants to open a general store.....
We'll see how it goes.

That said, my fresh salsa recipe calls for lots of tomatoes, and we eat LOTS of fresh salsa. :)

No, Ed, it really doesn't.

Myself, I like to catch my roadkill before the fly eggs hatch, lay it on the pile to age for a few days, then bury it when the maggots are out in full force.
I've been wanting to write up a dramatic, first-person (maggot) rendition
of what it must be like to be blissfully buried in a compost pile, on or in a rotting carcass, only to have the thermophilic soldiers show up a few short hours later, raise the temp to 160 degrees before anyone can get away and then slaughter the whole grossly oozing and pulsating feeding orgy in a sticky, gory, foul and stinking bloodbath. :)

Wouldn't that be too cool ?

Forerunner you have a way with words. Perhaps a composting book is in order.

How long does it take for the composting process to finish?

This is my composting book. :)

Of course, for those who haven't seen the link, there is a sticky in the survival forum.

http://www.homesteadingtoday.com/sho...d.php?t=332336

Fishhead, I like to let a pile sit for a year, but under rather easily attained ideal conditions, i.e. suitable carbon/nitrogen ratio, adequate, but not excessive moisture, good environment (summertime), 6 months can be enough.

That's good because my pile has to be done by this fall so I can spread it. I'm planning for a move and I can't leave a pile sitting there.

........ but, if I had a tub grinder and Ehrenfried Pfeiffer's 60+ strain bacteria cultures.... they say a week is enough.:bouncy:

You're going to spread a perfectly good compost pile, and then move ?
How intensely charitable of you!

It's my house so I want to spruce up the lawn for future resale. If I was planning on staying it would all go in my sandy but fertile garden.

Now that was just awesome!!! No wonder you and wally get along so well. I can't wait for you to meet little wally! ;)

:eek::eek::eek:

There's a little Wally ?!!?

Forerunner
thanks for starting this informative and inspiring post. I may not start any giant compost piles but it has reminded me I need to work harder on keeping a green manure crop planted and inspired me to look at things differently then I have been. Need to get a few sacks of cowpeas bought and planted.

Good stuff
 

Forerunner,you are the most inspiring read that i have seen on composting!!! Great what you are doing and MORE of use should follow your footsteps. I have started a small compost pile,but you inspire me to GO BIGGER.:rock:

Thanks, Felluhs.

The other day, I had a run-in (non-violent) with an old farmer/heavy equipment operator friend. He's getting up in years, and just happened to be visiting with an even older friend who's barn I happened to be scooping the old horse manure and bedding out of to take home for immediate use. :)
He started right in on how he sees me everywhere, hauling some compost material or another back to the farm.
He mentioned the tendencies of modern day farming, where you try to extract everything you can from the land for a short term profit..... and then compared that to the only operation he's ever seen where someone devoted their life to the exact opposite approach. He's one of those old fellows who watched me grow up, saw the hardships and the victories along the way, and knows me about as well as anyone can, from the outside looking in. He even lost an adult daughter a few years back, so there's even that bit of commonality.....
His perspective on that day we visited gave me new energy.
I hadn't thought of myself as being one of the so very few who is obsessed with putting more into the soil than I'll ever be able to take back out.... obvious though it must be.

All I know is, everything on the place that's planted and germinated right now is doing extremely well, even in spite of the cold, damp weather.
But...... there is that one patch of volunteer potatoes that Lori threw the shriveled parent seed of into the compost pile, right next to the house, a few weeks ago.
They dwarf the rest of my current potato crops, even though all basically planted at the same time..... These compost pile taters are 16 inches high-plus....rich, deep green with not a hint of stress.
It's these little reminders, just how well things do in compost, compared to the soil that I've already MASSIVELY composted, that tells me how very long a way I have to go.
I dream of what the soil in Eden must have been like, and I ponder that the western grain belt lost multiple FEET of black topsoil during and after the dust bowl.
We are given the choice here. We can walk through, taking in the sights, maintaining our comfort levels and our place of "normalcy" among our societal peers, contributing no more than is absolutely necessary for our basic, near-pointless survival.....
Or, we can roll up our sleeves, take the criticism, suffer the cost, and make one hell of a difference.
There's no choice for me.

Excellent post, Forerunner! :thumb:

Putting more into the soil than we can take back out makes perfect sense to me. It's part of being a good steward of what our Father has entrusted us with. It isn't the usual approach to life that is practiced by most around us. It seems to me that it's not so much of a choice as it is a recognition of the responsibility/right we have to take care of that which is given to us to 'dress and keep.'

Your experiences and stories of volunteer potatoes in the compost pile give me more drive to do everything I can to enrich and develop the fertility of the soil here on this little patch of ground. I do not have near enough going yet for what I want to do with it for next year.

Thanks for blazing a trail ahead so that I can see more clearly where to go. I appreciate it greatly! :bow:

mudburn

I think I may have pulled a volunteer tater myself, except not out of the compost...out of the yard, not too far from my little patch. Kinda funny, pulled it cuz I thought it was a weed, but the thing just snapped off, and then I made the comparison to my other taters. hmmmmm.....I wish my little pile would move itself along. I know I need more carbon, but durn! It got a lot of moisture.....maybe I'm impatient!

I too, enjoy the thought of putting more into the soil then what I took from it. Looking forward to the fall when I can "put the old garden to bed" under a nice pile of fallen leaves.....from other ppl's yards, and maybe a bit of my own!

Upon reading the replies..... I was compelled to look out at the volunteer taters again.
Turns out I lied. *blush*
They're at least two feet tall now.
That'll teach me to leave off paying attention for two or three days at a time.:hammer:

Well I may not be hauling huge loads like forerunner but I have come up with some different ways to get stuff into my LITTLE pile. I asked at the church (they have a wed. night dinner for families)if they would start saving me the prep scraps and coffee grounds. A few of the ladies who cook, then said that they would even start saving stuff at home and bring it to me :) I also take a few bags of the grass and leaf clippings the gardeners (locals) have every week and have been taking the "free" horse manure, from anyone who will give it to me. I also use wood shavings from my daughters guinea pigs and shred all paper from home and take up cardboard.
I should point out that my garden and compost pile are not at my home, as I have no space for it. Hey, my piles not big ........ YET! :D

Oh yea, I forgot to say..........that I too, have started taking pictures of said "pile", as though it were a child growing up, going through it's different stages in life............need I say more ;D

our 1st bucket and the next level
 

Woo hoo!! :happy: We have our VERY FIRST bucket of compost, the final result of last year's worm massacres and continued efforts at just tossing stuff in there and moving it around.

AND we have set up an area to pile all the great stuff we've been noticing around the community but had no place to unload. Yippee! Now, we're feeling a little shy and please keep in mind we are total greenhorns, but we don't lack enthusiasm. So here it is:

The first photo is our very first bucket of compost ever. Behind the bucket is the black plastic tub it came from (the rest of the contents of the tub are helping our new pile get started) and you can just see some of the red plastic coffee tubs that we use in the kitchen to gather scraps:

http://i424.photobucket.com/albums/p...R1stBucket.jpg

This photo is of our new pile. We started with some of the cardboard we had lying around, the contents of six of our coffee tubs o' scraps, the remainder of the contents of the black tub, a couple of double size milk crates full of last year's garden stuff and some newspaper. It doesn't look like much, but we have a visual guide now and a place to dump our finds as well as our own scraps and garden waste. The area is about three feet hight, 8 to 9 feet long and 4 feet wide. We tried to give ourselves the dimensions of a standard pickup load :nerd: ...

http://i424.photobucket.com/albums/p...URNxtLevel.jpg

Jennifer

Don't wait for something big to occur. Start where you are, with what you have, and that will always lead you into something greater.

Forerunner,
Need some inspiration here, if you have time, could you post some pictures of your garden and what is growing right now? Maybe of your two foot potato pants as well? Thanks, Bluebird

Great thread, and very inspiring. I've enjoyed lurking here, but have a question now for forerunner:
When I got my 40 it had recently been logged and a lot of the timber went into the chipper.
I'm opening up a new garden spot, pulling the soil from a swampy area where they did the chipping. It's sort of been composting for +/- 10 years, but laid out over a big area maybe 16" thick rather than a pile. There's a lot of really black soil in there but still a lot of intact (but soft, half broken down) wood chip material in there too. Lots of worms. I'd say it's 70% black soil to 30% rotting wood chips. Nice texture to it.
I know it's hard to say without seeing it, but do you think I could use it as is? Would you lime it? Are you going to tell me to pile it up and let it sit for a year, crushing my garden expansion dreams for this summer?
thanks!
this thread makes me with I lived next to a feed lot...

Do compost piles dry out by giving up steam?

I've dug into mine and find lots of spots where the hay is dry and dusty but has steam coming up through those spots.