Extreme Composting

Pig poo good stuff - depending on how much mulch you have. In my limited experience, it is going to stink up a storm when you move it to the wood. Can you bring the mulch and mix and cover where it sits?

A foot, or two if they are big chips, of mulch will absorb the stink. So that should keep the fam happy.

Awesome. That's good! What mixing ratio do you think would be okay. The tree mulch (leaves in it too) is a year old now. Would like to stretch the dung as far as possible in my mixing to make the most of it. Just enough to get maximum conversion without turning or adding more N later.

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Do not panic, the government will save us...
NOT!

Got LOTS of mulch. I think somewhere around 25 dump loads right now. (Came from a local tree service that gives me all I want for free) Can't move the pile to the dung though. Gotta move the poo to the pile. Need to get that area ready for hogs next fall. Stink?? OH YEA.. no doubt about that. Right now it's frozen poo-ice, so not stinking now.....BUT that will definitely change as thawing comes. I will be mixing it into the pile as soon as I can get it off of the lime to get rid of it before it gets too warm. Just thinking of that makes my eyes water! Also, the tractor WILL be getting a bath after that job.

__________________
Do not panic, the government will save us...
NOT!

Your memory fails you! Never have I come out against using sawdust or other non-soil products when hilling potatoes. Especially since I have been recommending it for a number of years and probably before you became a member. HT threads are now available back a number of years in case you wish to look them up for specific applications. And since I've been using that method before HT, you might have to go back to the old Countryside forum to find the first instance of sharing that information.

You have been informed wrong. As you no doubt already are aware, there are many who grow their potatoes under hay, straw, or similar non-soil mediums. The seed potato piece doesn't even have to be buried but merely laid on or pressed into a prepared soil and covered with the other medium. That allows gardeners with high pH soils to grow scab-free potatoes since the tubers develop in the other medium above the infected soil.

With rare exception, you will never find a potato root above the seed piece. What forms above the piece are modified branches called stolons. Although they are underground, they are not roots and they are only formed below the surface on a short section of the stem. If done properly, what one does when hilling is cause that section to elongate and form additional stolons and create a production zone of at least 6". (That's the idea behind growing potatoes in barrels or stacked tires.) If not hilled, all of the tubers would be formed in an area of perhaps a few inches. Not only would there potentially be less tubers but they would be subject to turning green from exposure to sunlight.

Martin

Thanks for the help, folks.

If anyone has any more input, I'll take it. I have lots of sawdust, and I want to improve my garden, thin hay fields, and reclaimed strip mine growing grass.

StayPuff.....I envy your situation, for the moment.

If you want to stretch that golden poo, you're in an excellent position to do so.

You could estimate your percentages and mix the hog manure so as to use up all of your available wood chips (especially since they are a year old and contain the leafy matter, to boot) and likely come out with a screaming winner of a final product.
Let it sit six months or longer, after mixing, and then prepare to formally join the ranks of the Extremists!

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“I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.” Barry Goldwater.
III

Bja....you're in a good way, too, with unlimited sawdust.

Gentle and consistent applications of that stuff to existing grass and hay ground will take you where you want to be. The atmosphere, rains and existing soil flora/fauna will give you the N and the micro-nutrients and enzymes that you need to compliment the sawdust.

__________________
“I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.” Barry Goldwater.
III

Ok, I can go with most of that. (Yes, I know what stolons are) However though, you can only grow potatoes in straw or hay bales if you add manure or rich mulch onto the top of the bales. The rain incorporates the nutrients and nitrogen into the bale for the potato plant to eat. Since Irish potatoes are of the nightshade family, they don't need much nitrogen to feed them. (We want potatoes, not humongous dark green bushes, right) This is why the straw bale idea works.

Also, are you saying that the potato plant doesn't feed on nutrients above the seed potato 'line'? From my experience, potato stolons can either create modified stolons (the potatoes that we eat, that store nutrients) OR they can produce new stems on the end of a stolen, making another potato plant. I know this because we would see new plants emerge between the mother plants. There are many ways of doing things, and you can definitely do it the way you say, but you are really doing yourself a disservice if you don't use soil to hill your potatoes. The stolons that create new potato shoots at their ends, will need nutrients to grow, and so by hilling up the potato plant, you are theoretically raising the root line. That's the way I looked at it. Sure, you can definitely place a cut seed potato directly on top of the soil, and 'hill' with nothing more than straw or sawdust, but in my experience this will yield the least amount of 'taters. If you hill with soil, you will make not only more potatoes, but more potato plants that make potatoes too.

This is the method we used. Keep in mind, I grew up in the southern most area of Illinois, where the soil is red, and very little topsoil exists naturally. In the Fall, we would manure the field with all of our horse, mule, goat, rabbit, and cow dung. (I grew up on a self-sustaining homestead) After about a week, we would then plow it in using a 3-abreast mule-mule-belgium team with a 16" single-bottom plow. We would leave it alone that way through the winter. Before planting potatoes the next spring, we would then disc it down, really GOOD. Then using a string to keep the rows in line, we would hill the soil with concrete hoes about 12 inches high, and the rows about 48" apart. We would flatten the top of the hill to about a 4" width. While we were doing this, Mom and Grandpa would be cutting the seed potatoes and throwing them into the back of the pickup truck. When all of the rows were hilled up, we would go to the truck, scoop up a 5 gallon bucket of seed potatoes and place them on top of the flattened hills. Another person would come behind and pull about another 3 or 4 inches of soil on top of the hill, and lightly tamp in the potato piece so it didn't easily erode out. After the plants emerged, we would then pull more soil up to leave jut a couple inches of plant exposed. We would do this (If I remember) about four times. When the hills were finally finished they would be HUGE. When it came time to dig them, we would hook up the middle-buster to our mule team and run it right down the middle of the hill. Very few potatoes would grow below the hill (probably because of the hard red clay???) And about every 3 feet would yield a 5 gallon bucket full of potatoes.

Sorry Forerunner, I hope I didn't turn your thread into the Extreme Potato thread!

__________________
Do not panic, the government will save us...
NOT!

WooooooHooo! Awesome. Thanks! Do I get an extreme composting certificate too!

__________________
Do not panic, the government will save us...
NOT!

My reply was not about growing potatoes in straw but under straw. Growing in straw is a totally different system of planting.

Correct! There generally are no roots above the seed pieces and the stolons are incapable of taking in any nutrients since they are branches rather than roots.

Martin

I now have a new farm (in Northern IL) where the soil is rich, well drained, and loamy. I will definitely try, this year even, to grow them under straw like you say. I have never seen that, but that would be so much easier if it works.

__________________
Do not panic, the government will save us...
NOT!

I believe that there have been past threads where a member tells of planting a large field by placing the potatoes on the tilled surface and unrolling a round bale of straw over them. Then harvest clean tubers in the fall and till the straw into the ground to prepare the field for the next season. No hilling required and little weed control required. Only potential drawback is the number of damaged tubers due to voles.

Martin

CP that is a great idea and might be one of the paths I take. I figured that a decent band saw mill would just about pay for itself putting siding on the house and building a pole barn. I'm on the forestry forum as well and have been looking into it for years. The problem (or blessing) is that these dead tress are just about rotten and not good for lumber.

StayPuff,
That also sounds really cool but there is no way I could swing that. We are starting small right now and trying to build the house with cash. There is no way we could invest in what is required to run cattle. We don't even own a truck right now. Also, I'm an engineer about 45 minutes away so I'm gone about 10.5 hrs a day. We will start with chickens, orchard and big garden. Once we are doing well in those regards I might look into it again, but I see us moving to goats before we do anything else. We already buy whole raw goat milk and would love to make our own.

FRunner,
Yes, I think it will work ok. It will help me get more level ground and improve the soil.....even if it takes a little longer than chipping and cooking in a pile with the addition of some N. But don't worry, I'm already planning on communing with the pile of logs.

thanks
Austin

Not to worry, StayPuff....... taters are a favorite staple around here, and any info concerning them is welcome.

.......and, if we don't take this thread to it's extremes, what good is it ?

__________________
“I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.” Barry Goldwater.
III

I'm so EXCITED! I emailed the stockyard about 20 miles from us and got a reply saying they have an unlimited supply of mixed bedding/manure that we can have for free if we load it ourselves. Forefunner and Mudburn have stirred up something in me. I couldn't have imagined being so wound up over news like this. Now our surburban gardens can really thrive as our smallish compost pile takes on some new life beginning next week. Thanks guys.

That is the way I get my compost and compost material.

Suburban gardeners have the same chances as rural gardeners to produce good compost but just on a smaller scale. In the 70s and 80s, my cars all had big trunks and there were always six 5-gallon pails and a short-handled shovel in them. (Car of the 90s could only hold 5 pails.) Any time that I was near a pile of cow or horse manure, it was a little smaller after my visit. Doesn't seem like much but it adds up. For this century my "car" is a pickup and will hold 18 pails or 3 times the old way. Presently, one of my piles is about 450 gallons. It's 2 parts tumbler compost to 1 part horse manure. Pretty much all of it came here in 5-gallon pails.

Martin

Now see, Martin ?

THAT's the kind of make-do-with-whatcha-got-and-grow-from-there story we like to see around here.

__________________
“I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.” Barry Goldwater.
III

Rome-G, welcome to the club.

On a side note, when your friends and relatives finally drag you in for therapy, don't resist.

Just nod your head and smile a lot, and remember........when you get home, a good hot compost pile will cook those silly meds, pills or liquids, and you can get straight back to work.

__________________
“I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.” Barry Goldwater.
III

"Forefunner".

I just caught that.

__________________
“I would remind you that extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice! And let me remind you also that moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.” Barry Goldwater.
III