Dogs!? Do you live rural? In the mountain?

Firethorn · #61 02/03/10, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DJ in WA

Seems to me you picked the wrong property. If you wanted livestock, why would you put them with bears and wolves? Did you put dogs in with the list of predators? I thought dogs weren't a problem around there.

Dogs aren't, they could be as we are rural and I hear on here all the time about dogs being dropped of. Im just expecting it all. The wolves are everywhere, not just here and the bears as well. Part of living in the mountains. How does not have coyotes? I hear there are bob cats and cougars as well. Again, its part of the life. But plenty keep livestock. You just learn to protect them. And the dear, and elk and "other" are so plentiful they tend to not be desperate. I intend to give them all reason to look elsewhere.

Firethorn · #62 02/03/10, 11:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shygal

Even a 6 week old puppy is not any better than a 4 week old puppy being out.

You seem to have gone through a whole lot of dogs, Firethorn.

Did you not read? We took in foster dogs for rescue. Yes, we have had many come live with us. But the Pyrs were mine.

ChristieAcres · #63 02/03/10, 11:24 PM

Firethorn- I can sure agree on your last posts' points. In addition to what you wrote, the same comparison could be used for a garden. We have deer and rabbits galore, so why have a garden? Hmmm, we figured out how to protect our garden and orchards from them. If our dog is smart/sensible enough to stay away from the forest (where the coyotes & bears are), there is no reason why we shouldn't have Sam. He is a fantastic watchdog who lives outside and comes inside to visit almost every day. Sam spends hours in the shop with DH, while he works. If I was worried about him at night, I'd bring him in. I love to get a 2nd dog in a few year; a larger breed this time.

Firethorn · #64 02/03/10, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patt

You can rescue and foster dogs without being a part of an official group you know.

I do it on a regular basis when somebody dumps one off here. I have "been through a lot of dogs too" they have been dumped by others, rehabbed by me and sent on to new homes.

I also have a dog who is 7 1/2 who has never been chained or fenced, visits the neighbors and lives outside and amazingly enough he is happy and healthy and ticking along just fine.

It would be nice if people could share knowledge without the side dressing of judgement!

texican · #65 02/03/10, 11:30 PM

Some breeds are better than others if you're starting from scratch...

Any dog will be better than none....

We have no fences... our dogs, and we have a bunch, roam at will. Our anatolians go far and wide.

I've contacted the nearest neighbors, half a mile away, and told them if they have any problems whatsoever, let me know and I'll take care of the problem, and make it right. I've only had one phone call to complain about a dog.....turned out it was some stray that'd been dumped.

If you follow the country dog rules to the letter, you won't have problems... of course, not having neighbors is an automatic plus if you have any dogs...

Firethorn · #66 02/03/10, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lorichristie

Firethorn- I can sure agree on your last posts' points. In addition to what you wrote, the same comparison could be used for a garden. We have deer and rabbits galore, so why have a garden? Hmmm, we figured out how to protect our garden and orchards from them. If our dog is smart/sensible enough to stay away from the forest (where the coyotes & bears are), there is no reason why we shouldn't have Sam. He is a fantastic watchdog who lives outside and comes inside to visit almost every day. Sam spends hours in the shop with DH, while he works. If I was worried about him at night, I'd bring him in. I love to get a 2nd dog in a few year; a larger breed this time.

Yeah, our guys arent smart enough to not go in but it also comes right to our door literally. We dont have a "yard". My yard is thousands of acers of national forest on one side and loging land on the other. LOL
And some have wondered about the 5 day stretch. I wish I knew. The first two times they were home by morning but this last time I think they may have had a hard time finding home. Its not hard to do. And they both slept for days and would not eat much.
You talked about being fast. Man our basset sure is. Its a sight to see.

TedH71 · #67 02/04/10, 12:47 AM

LGDs as a general rule tend not to stay on their property...they stay with the livestock and sometimes consider fences a game to play...getting over the fence or under. They are not the type to STAY with people...but more so with the livestock based on my experience. You could consider a Tibetian Mastiff but I was told they can be terribly dominant and difficult for an inexperienced person to handle and they're NOT LGDs even though they may be marketed as much. I would consider and am considering this breed: Caucasian Ovcharka commonly called Caucasian Shepherd. Here is a website about them: http://www.courageouscaucasians.com/ they come in a long hair or short haired version. They're NOT cheap though. $1,500 to $2k is their general price. It seems to be a breed that is a LGD but yet also good with people and livestock.

**Shrek** · #68 02/04/10, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Firethorn

I badly need all the info I can get.
Now please note that I realize there are drastic differences of opinion as to the place of dogs in ones life. And how said dog is to be handled. And I am also aware that many consider them selves THE authority because they "X,Y,Z".

I dont care about all that. I dont want to argue such points either. I just need to hear HOW those that are doing, HOW your doing it. LOL, hopefully this will help defuse some thread drifts.

Ok, I need help figuring how to "keep" our dogs. Yes I know, fence them.

If they are in a fence how in the world do they defend us?
Type of dogs. Well, yes that is part of the equation as well.
Basically it comes to this. I want to get fence in to keep some sheep. I want chickens. We have wolves, coyotes, bear, coons, dogs. Strange people wonder up.
We inherited a spastic lab with the house and she does her job of warning but she loves everyone and wonders off for a few days now and then. So she could not protect us or sheep. We have a worthless St. Bernard and a basset hound. They wonder off and stay gone only to come home and sleep for days. Both are looking for a new home. Why have a dog that has to live its life in a fence?
You cant fence in the whole mountain. (money wise we cant but its also not feasible to to drill holes in rocks to put in posts)
What kind of Dog? Rather, Dogs? Neighbors are not an issue. We only have one near and they are wonderful. They would call if there was an issue.
I like the lad she really dose well but she is not capable of fending of wolves or two leggeds. (she is too friendly for the later and shes small for the bread). I like our dogs big so thats also a factor. I have children so thats another factor. I want one dog that will sleep in the house. Fallow the kids around ETC. The other dogs will be our first defense out side always.
Anyone willing to share that does not fallow the mindset of "fence them". How do you do it? How do you "encourage" pack behavior?

Edited to add:
Anyone have experience with wireless fencing to keep them "home". What do you recon it would cost to fence in say 10 acres? Will those "feced" dogs do well when let out of the boundary? I mean will they stay with us when we are out? On hikes, paroling the rest of the property or working ETC.

Welded wire fencing surrounding where you want your dogs to patrol is the best option.

Wireless fencing may contain your dogs, but it also puts them at risk of predatory dogs not detered by your wireless system. I have seen the collar and scraps left behind after a wireless confined dog was ripped apart by a predatory pack. Not pretty.

A good fence stucture can be expensive, but is worth it.

lamoncha lover · #69 02/04/10, 01:13 AM

my neighbors also think their fluffies aren't a problem. Since they moved in with their running loose dogs..you seldom see a deer or turkey/
I can't even walk my own dog on my property without a leash because there dogs are running my propert.
other neighbors have asked them to put them up//after one got hit on the road and was wouned you would think they would learn..nope
SSS is coming to the neighborhood.

Firethorn · #70 02/04/10, 01:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lamoncha lover

my neighbors also think their fluffies aren't a problem. Since they moved in with their running loose dogs..you seldom see a deer or turkey/
I can't even walk my own dog on my property without a leash because there dogs are running my propert.
other neighbors have asked them to put them up//after one got hit on the road and was wouned you would think they would learn..nope
SSS is coming to the neighborhood.

Sorry to hear this. The situation here is quite a bit different. But I sympathize.

Shygal · #71 02/04/10, 02:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Firethorn

Did you not read? We took in foster dogs for rescue. Yes, we have had many come live with us. But the Pyrs were mine.

Oh yes, I read. Ive read quite a bit of what you have said before, actually. Quite a bit.

Old John · #72 02/04/10, 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mnn2501

It defends from something that gets inside your fence where it doesn't belong, why would you want a dog defending the road or the neighbors property?
Why would anyone want their dog on the neighbors property or the road? I want my dog at home protecting her property and her property is inside the fence line.
Its very rude to think the neighbors like your dog roaming free - they don't and some will shoot it on sight.

Honestly, we're not exactly Homesteaders. We have no livestock, just 13 rural acres, with a garden, a lot of woods & a few critters, dogs & cats, wild birds, deer, possums, racoons & wild turkeys.

Our dogs are two Dobermans. We had Dobies when we lived up in the City, Indianapolis, 7 years ago. Our older ones died & were replaced.
They weigh about 75/80 pounds. They have had leash & obedience training. They mind most of the time. They do not sleep on the furniture.
They sleep on their beds in our bedroom, at night. They are good watch-dogs.
Our dogs are house dogs. They are constant companions to me; I'm retired.
We have a fenced yard for them 150'x150'. They always let us know when strangers are about. However when friends or neighbors come around we "crate the dogs". We have "Beware of Dogs" signs around the House & yard.
Our dogs never leave our Place. Our neighbors are the same way.Hunters out here are bad about shooting stray dogs & cats.

I've had to deal with 3 young feral dogs, litter mates, a couple years ago.
We tried to feed them, gentle them, maybe tame them. They ended up killing two of our cats & eating on them. We did manage to get one of them to the pound, where we were told, they always dispose of feral dogs. Sheriff said to "take care of my own problems."

Now, I only feed my own dogs and they don't Wander.

Countrystyle · #73 02/04/10, 08:12 AM

Seems to me you could fence in the sheep use fencing that will contain the LGD and/or a donkey or llama -I've seen others do this.
Keep the family guard dogs in a fenced yard. We only have ten acres but still have a large fenced back yard for our 4 dogs. They sound the alarm whether it's someone driving down the road too slow or in our drive. If I had children in your situation I'd have a fenced in yard just to help protect the children from wandering and from the predators having easier access to them.
We have the chicken coop and run attached to the yard fence allowing the family dogs to help protect them. We close up the henhouse every night to keep out possums etc. The coyotes don't come near the house because of the dogs. When you go for walks etc take the family guard dogs with you.

I don't understand the need to patrol your entire place. There is no reasonable way to keep all predators off your property. Just need to keep them away from the livestock and family.

JMHO

**Terri** · #74 02/04/10, 08:21 AM

WOW what a response!

I just wanted to say briefly that every dog we ever had would roam, and that is why I fence them. I do not want them being a nuisance to the neighbors, as I might lose them. Instead they stay home, keep the varmints away from the chickens and the garden, and are a watch dog at night while we sleep.

They cannot do their job if they roam, and all of mine have roamed if they get the chance. From what you have said, so do yours.

#75 02/04/10, 09:12 AM

When I had my own place with acreage, livestock ( goats) and chickens, I fenced in 3 acres surrounding the house..my Kuvasz took over that area..she was a joy to watch..checking the fence line "on patrol", sitting on high ground looking left, right and "up" for hawks..our neighbors lost livestock to predators..never lost so much as a baby chick at my place..Inside, I had a German Shepherd, a Black Lab and a wonderful mutt..those four dogs wouldn't let anyone past that farm gate unless I was there and waved them off. I was known locally as the "Yankee woman with mean dawgs."..

LGD will patrol until they come to a fence..they consider everything their area until they cannot go any farther..personally, I'd not have a LGD without a fence..Lord knows where the dog would end up.

Firethorn · #76 02/04/10, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shygal

Oh yes, I read. Ive read quite a bit of what you have said before, actually. Quite a bit.

Stalk much? I wish you would just leave me alone.

edcopp · #77 02/04/10, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Firethorn

I badly need all the info I can get.
Now please note that I realize there are drastic differences of opinion as to the place of dogs in ones life. And how said dog is to be handled. And I am also aware that many consider them selves THE authority because they "X,Y,Z".

I dont care about all that. I dont want to argue such points either. I just need to hear HOW those that are doing, HOW your doing it. LOL, hopefully this will help defuse some thread drifts.

Ok, I need help figuring how to "keep" our dogs. Yes I know, fence them.

If they are in a fence how in the world do they defend us?
Type of dogs. Well, yes that is part of the equation as well.
Basically it comes to this. I want to get fence in to keep some sheep. I want chickens. We have wolves, coyotes, bear, coons, dogs. Strange people wonder up.
We inherited a spastic lab with the house and she does her job of warning but she loves everyone and wonders off for a few days now and then. So she could not protect us or sheep. We have a worthless St. Bernard and a basset hound. They wonder off and stay gone only to come home and sleep for days. Both are looking for a new home. Why have a dog that has to live its life in a fence?
You cant fence in the whole mountain. (money wise we cant but its also not feasible to to drill holes in rocks to put in posts)
What kind of Dog? Rather, Dogs? Neighbors are not an issue. We only have one near and they are wonderful. They would call if there was an issue.
I like the lad she really dose well but she is not capable of fending of wolves or two leggeds. (she is too friendly for the later and shes small for the bread). I like our dogs big so thats also a factor. I have children so thats another factor. I want one dog that will sleep in the house. Fallow the kids around ETC. The other dogs will be our first defense out side always.
Anyone willing to share that does not fallow the mindset of "fence them". How do you do it? How do you "encourage" pack behavior?

Edited to add:
Anyone have experience with wireless fencing to keep them "home". What do you recon it would cost to fence in say 10 acres? Will those "feced" dogs do well when let out of the boundary? I mean will they stay with us when we are out? On hikes, paroling the rest of the property or working ETC.

Control of Dogs is a state by state issue, and in some cases more local than that. Hope you get the problem straightened out. You might want to read the statutes in your state for directions.

You might also have the courtesy (for your neighbors) to just shoot the dogs that you let run for days on end. Good luck.

Patt · #78 02/04/10, 01:56 PM

You know what is fascinating to me is how few people either have read the OP thoroughly or have comprehended it. Firethorn lives between state forest land and logging land with practically no neighbors and the ones she has are fine with her dogs. So all the griping about her being kind to her neighbors is completely not applicable to her situation.

It would probably help too in giving advice if you don't project your personal issues onto the problem being addressed. Just a thought!

Janis Sauncy · #79 02/04/10, 02:05 PM

When we first moved here, my dogs were disappearing up into the woods (the back of my property borders national forest).

As soon as we were able to, we put up fencing to contain the dogs (you'd be surprised at how effective a two-strand hot wire is). I wasn't concerned about the dogs bothering neighbors by going into the woods but for their own safety from bears, cougars, coyotes, hunters, and injury.

I would be horrified if my dogs disappeared for days at a time and I'd be doing my best to make sure it didn't happen.

painterswife · #80 02/04/10, 02:14 PM

We live on the mountain next to National Forest. We do have neighbors.

We have petsafe no wire electric fence. The dogs don't actually need it now that they are trained. We do have to watch the intact male in the spring. He would like to do a runner every when he starts thinking about mating.

We do the electric fence because we have to make sure our dogs are not running livestock off the range or wildlife. They can be shot for that.

The dogs can run off cattle if they are on our property and under our control. They can chase wildlife off the property but not past the property line, again under our control.

The electric fence is for keeping them on the property when they are outside and we are not. When we are out we have no worries about them running off. This took training and time.