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  #41  
Old 11/27/09, 06:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by salmonslayer View Post
I just dont go cussing everyone out or threatening them with a shotgun if a neighbor or someone else comes onto my property. I go out to talk to them and if needed I kick them off the property and in this case, if I had found out he was a neighbors brother I would go and talk to the neighbor about what had happened.
I'm not so sure in this day and age it's such a good idea to go out and chat with a stranger who appears intent to harm your animals unarmed. Too many crazies out there.
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  #42  
Old 11/27/09, 06:41 PM
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The OP asked if she has rights against a hostile trespasser who brought his aggressive dog onto her property to harrass her turkeys.

Some of us answered her question.

Some of us decided she isn't entitled to an answer. They decided that she is nuttier than a fruit cake that has been re-gifted 13 times, and that she should never live next to them! Why they decided to go on this tangent is beyond me, but you will sometimes see such irrelevent and condescending thread drift. It happens, I am sorry to say.

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  #43  
Old 11/27/09, 07:40 PM
 
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Quote:
Some of us answered her question.

Some of us decided she isn't entitled to an answer.
You seem rather hostile to alternate view points. Some advocated guns, some calling the cops and some talking to the neighbor about the situation. Who didnt answer?

No where in her post did she say the trespasser was hostile (she said he was a preacher and only smiled when she rushed out cursing him), no where did she say the dog was aggressive and if being against shooting someone or brandishing a firearm as a first course of action is irrelevant and condescending I dont know what to say. I wouldnt even shoot someone if I caught them red handed killing my turkey on my front lawn. I just think that the OP could have handled the situation much better and with all of the history she provided, she sounds like someone who over reacts to things.

I surrender.

Last edited by salmonslayer; 11/27/09 at 07:49 PM.
  #44  
Old 11/27/09, 08:59 PM
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Salmonslayer, would you be so kind as to point out who advocated shooting anyone? By shooting at, I mean pointing the loaded gun and pulling the trigger?

I don't know if you are male or female, but I am female. There have been times at my ranch where I have had to confront trespassers. I can assure you that there are plenty of men who find it humorous or even irritating when a female asserts herself. This guy did. He knew he was trespassing, and he knew his aggressive dog was terrorizing the turkeys. Rather than apologizing to the OP and leaving immediately, like any decent human would have done, he stood there and laughed at her.

She said [I]"Woke up turkey day-slept in till 7 am. Went to the mud room in an effort to gather up the turkey/chicken feed. I look out the window to see a big grown man in my yard a good 40-50 feet. I thought at first he was throwing something at/towards my turkeys- who were running away from him. They were not in their fence pen, but do not go off the property on that end since the neighbor has a dog who barks at them and they scare easily.
So I watched for a second and the man did the motion again (he was smiling and laughing while doing this). This time I see it is a dog leash in his hand and he is provoking his dog to chase my turkeys! On my property!"[/
I]

The man knowingly trespassed on her property, bringing a dog to harass someone else's poultry is hostile in every reality except yours. As I previously said, turkeys are prey animals, and dogs are predators. The sadist was enjoying the turkey's distress immensely, as demonstrated by the smile she saw on his face.

He also enjoyed her distress immensely, as she said that twice she ordered him to leave and he stood there laughing at her too. He didn't leave until she threatened to call the township police. She was right to call them, as it was only the threat of calling them that caused him to finally leave.

I can't begin to describe the creep factor that is involved when you are smaller and weaker than someone who violates your rights, and the law, and enters your property , refusing to leave when ordered to do so. There is definitely something wrong in the guy's head.

I am a former Customs Inspector, and I spent time on the Mexican border. I wore a badge and carried a gun in the line of duty. Every once in a while I would run across someone who didn't want to comply with a Customs inspection, and decided that they could avoid it by injuring me. It never ceased to amaze me when some guy that stood a foot taller than me and was escalating in rage would look me up and down, figuring just how easy it would be to hurt or kill me, until they saw my hand resting on the grip of my service revolver. I didn't need to point it at them, or even threaten to shoot. The presence of the gun and my hand on the grip (still holstered) was enough to calm them down to a point that they were suddenly willing to comply with the law, and submit to inspection.

Every person who advocated having a gun, or even pointing a gun was right in that it sends a message to the trespasser that he has overstepped his bounds, and NOW would be a very good time to leave.

You didn't address the question that the OP asked, about her rights, until you had harshly criticized her ad nauseum and were then specifically questioned by another poster where you stood on her actual question. Your attack on the OP was uncalled for and hostile. It was thread drift in a major way. You have not sought to be helpful in your answers. Only critical and judgmental. Perhaps the next time someone asks for help with a question, you might consider reading their post, and answering the question. The OP didn't ask to be psychoanalyzed, and You clearly aren't qualified to provide that service for her.

You were out of line, and I believe you owe her an apology.

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Last edited by Common Tator; 11/27/09 at 09:10 PM.
  #45  
Old 11/27/09, 10:02 PM
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I never advocated shooting anyone but obviously the dog was being taught to haras and attack livestock which is highly illegal in this state and warrants a death sentence by law. The law also states you can legally shoot any dog which is in the act of attacking your livestock, doesn't say the dog has to be off a leash. And any nut-job who brings a dog onto anothers property with the intent to destroy or haras livestock will not hesitate to turn such dog onto another person, IMO. I thoroughly advocate the shooting of said dog and would not have hesitated to do so if I were in such a situation. And if the owner was to go after her she would totally have been within her legal right to shoot said dog owner. Castle doctrine applies in Ohio.

As for complaints to the township and pagan symbols painted on a barn, whoop de poo. If we were judged by how much we have complained to our respective communities about things we perceive as unfair I would probably be at the top of my townships hit list. And the school district wouldn't be far behind. The Pennslyvania Dutch paint pagan symbols on their barns to ward off evil spirits. As Lunagardens said, no different than painting a cross or erecting a wooden cross on your property. I've even seen the star of David painted on buildings. So? Should I complain to zoning?

I might turn the other cheek on stuff you do to me but don't mess with innocent critters or my kids.

I can't say what I would do to a kid that was messing with my baby like that. I can understand the temptation and admire her ability to refrain from giving in.

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  #46  
Old 11/27/09, 10:35 PM
 
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Common Tater, I dont understand your hostility and we just see things differently, did it ever occur to you that the trespasser was holding a leash in his hand (she didnt say the dog was leashed or at least thats not the way it reads to me), he may have been trying to retrieve his dog, entered her property and was gesturing to the dog? He could have reacted in shock when she came at him yelling obscenities? He told the police he was a preacher, he was visiting his brother (also a preacher) and reacted the way he did because of the cursing (what was he supposed to do, curse back?). This all came from the OP who also never stated a turkey was attacked or killed. Now that may not be true but no one knows because she never took the time to find out before calling the cops and then when the cops didnt give her the answer she was looking for she wants revenge.

Quote:
Salmonslayer, would you be so kind as to point out who advocated shooting anyone? By shooting at, I mean pointing the loaded gun and pulling the trigger?
The below quotes from this thread are what I am talking about, seems kind of violent to me over a turkey when no one has bothered to find out the real story.

Quote:
few people don't respect personal property, but just about everyone respects a shotgun
Quote:
Obviously I wouldn't have fired directly at him unless he was harming me or my animals,
Quote:
Hooligan a shotgun is a universal attention getter. You wouldn't believe how big folks' eyes get when they're looking at the business end of a twelve gauge.
Quote:
I personally wouldn't shoot that close to another human, but she would have been within her rights.
Quote:
If the man had been on my property with his dog chasing my animals, I'd have used his dog for target practice. And I'd have used the .308 with the 20 round magazine
Quote:
Wow, he's lucky. I would have grabbed the shotgun first and asked questions later.
Quote:
Like i told someone i'll get out of jail long before you get out of the hospital
Quote:
There is one cure for stupid, and it usually will solve the other problems. SSS.
If SSS (Shoot, Shovel, and Shut-up) does not work, then have a conversation with the dog
Quote:
I would have shot the dog. Leash or not, you were within your rights
Maybe you didnt read those parts but I carry a weapon for my job and I cant imagine shooting someone or threatening them with my weapon over personal property. My advice to the OP; learn to talk to people and communicate. If you go nuclear as a first course it kind of leaves you with no where to go doesnt it. I mean if she had tried to work it out and got no where with the neighbor would the cops have been so dismissive?
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  #47  
Old 11/27/09, 11:50 PM
 
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If you can find out the name of the church many have a board that has the power to fire the preacher. I would file my complaint with them. One complaint probably won't have much effect but if they've had others or are tired of his attitude they may send him packing. Also look up verses to use that talk about how he's supposed to represent Christ. If you convince them it's the behavior of Christians that keeps you from being one you might guilt them into action (even if it's just a stern warning). If I was having problems with a neighbor and his dog kept coming into the yard I think I would send the dog off to the pound as a message. If there dog barks incessantly at you when your in your yard sit out there late at night then file a noise complaint when it starts barking. There are lots of ways to get even if you want to.

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  #48  
Old 11/27/09, 11:58 PM
 
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Salmonslayer, I don't know whether you are being obtuse or are choosing to ignore the crux of this matter. This guy was knowingly trespassing on private property, appeared to be encouraging his dog to attack her livestock, and she says was slow to vacate the premises when told to leave. Her other ranting aside, nothing else is germane, tickets, signs, prior difficulties, are all irrelevant.


You comment about her cussing and yelling instead of finding out why he was there and what he was doing. She isn’t required to ask why he was trespassing. It makes no difference why he was there, he knew he was trespassing and should not have been, and she could see what he was doing.

I'm and old guy, suppose you looked out early some morning and saw me urinating on you front door, would you come outside and just talk to me, politely inquire why I was there and what I was doing and not waste police time by filing a report?

Or would you come out angry yelllng and cursing a little?

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Last edited by 65284; 11/28/09 at 12:06 AM.
  #49  
Old 11/28/09, 12:11 AM
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If the author of this thread had been a man , most likely the guy would have left immediately. It seems to me he knew she was alone and that he could get away with what he was doing. There are some pretty sick people out there and some of them just happen to be ministers. Make sure your doors are locked and your weapon of choice handy.
Linda

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  #50  
Old 11/28/09, 12:31 AM
 
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Quote:
This guy was knowingly trespassing on private property, appeared to be encouraging his dog to attack her livestock, and she says was slow to vacate the premises when told to leave.
Look, you dont know the lay of her property anymore than I do. All we know is what she posted and she admits she never tried to find out what he was really doing. If it makes sense to you that a preacher visiting his sibling next door (also a preacher) would bring his Jack Russell terrier over to his brother's neighbor to attack turkeys then so be it. Sounds a bit hard to believe to me. I would have gone out and confronted him too but things are rarely as they seem at first blush.

And you know what, your an old guy and I am a big guy, if I find you urinating on my front door I will come out and maybe yell a bit, I will find out why your there, I may call the cops, but you wont be shot. What I will do is think a bit and figure out you may have dementia or some other issue and I would try to help you. If I find out you belong to a neighbor I will escort you to their house and have a talk with them like good neighbors do.

Actually, this thread has made me sad that there are so many fearful people out there.
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Last edited by salmonslayer; 11/28/09 at 12:35 AM.
  #51  
Old 11/28/09, 09:18 AM
 
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Thank you, salmonslayer.
So maybe the man was wrong, but her reaction is like purposely hitting a pedestrian and backing up over him because he wasn't in the crosswalk. Totally, ridiculously over reacted.

As for her daughter, after reading her other comments, I can only think about the 6 year old boy who was arrested for kissing his classmate. Total innocence carried to the ninth degree.

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  #52  
Old 11/28/09, 09:38 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by salmonslayer View Post
Look, you dont know the lay of her property anymore than I do. All we know is what she posted and she admits she never tried to find out what he was really doing. If it makes sense to you that a preacher visiting his sibling next door (also a preacher) would bring his Jack Russell terrier over to his brother's neighbor to attack turkeys then so be it. Sounds a bit hard to believe to me. I would have gone out and confronted him too but things are rarely as they seem at first blush.

And you know what, your an old guy and I am a big guy, if I find you urinating on my front door I will come out and maybe yell a bit, I will find out why your there, I may call the cops, but you wont be shot. What I will do is think a bit and figure out you may have dementia or some other issue and I would try to help you. If I find out you belong to a neighbor I will escort you to their house and have a talk with them like good neighbors do.

Actually, this thread has made me sad that there are so many fearful people out there.

Exactly,

We know very little here and her initial presentation came across as an irrational rant leaving out many details. The guy could have been smiling because he was having a great day. He may have misunderstood the gravity of the situation not being from around there. His dog could have been scared to death of the birds and he was trying to encourage it to toughen up. The birds could have been in no danger at all and the guy's biggest sin could have been simply stepping into her yard. She doesn't give a clear picture of the set-up but she seems to have neighbors all around in front porch viewing distance so it sound a bit suburbanish to me. Did the man cross a fence and walk a distance to get where he was or did he simple step off the sidewalk?

Lot's of details missing. The law didn't seem to think it was deserving of followup but I guess they TOO are out to get this poor women.

I know, I know.... trespassing, even if it's only a step off the sidewalk is not appropriate. But come-on man...


For you shotgun toting folks who think just the sight of that shotgun is going to scatter folks to the hills. hahahaha.

The 11th rule of gun toting I was taught is NEVER pull a gun on someone unless you absolutely plan on using it. Personally, I would laugh in your face in that situation.

The next guy might just shoot you though....
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  #53  
Old 11/28/09, 09:44 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by o&itw View Post
Do you have daughter? If you found a 10 year old boy gropping her when she was 3 or 4, isn't there a possibility, that you would be a little sensitive to intrusions by neighbors?
My kids weren't ever playing unsupervised at 3 or 4...

As for the guy with the dog, when you are in any given situation and start cussing like a sailor, it's difficult for people to take you seriously rather than take you as a psycho. Next time, take a breath first... If you act respectable, you will get respect.
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Last edited by NickyBlade; 11/28/09 at 09:48 AM.
  #54  
Old 11/28/09, 10:07 AM
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while the trespasser certainly was out of line in this case, something tells me that the OP provides ample opportunity for people to bother her

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  #55  
Old 11/28/09, 10:12 AM
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Hey.

You say you are moving, so you best put all your futile hostility aside. Your husband should have manned up and handled the situation early on...the neighbor knows he's a pushover now.

RF

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  #56  
Old 11/28/09, 01:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Hooligan View Post
Exactly,

The 11th rule of gun toting I was taught is NEVER pull a gun on someone unless you absolutely plan on using it. Personally, I would laugh in your face in that situation.
You seem to have forgotten the 12th rule. Never laugh in the face of someone pointing a gun at you. Escalating the situation when you are not armed or don't have your weapon in hand and ready is a good way to get shot....whether accidently or intentionally. You may be right but it might be kind of hard to argue the validity of your position if you are dead.

Some folks are tetchy about uninvited people coming on their (in my case posted) property. You also forget that the person holding a weapon ON YOU on their property might just be willing to shoot.

Your mileage may vary depending on where you are.

Mike
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  #57  
Old 11/28/09, 09:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by salmonslayer View Post
Not what I am saying at least. I am a very direct person and would not tolerate that but I sure wouldnt walk out guns blazing as you advocate.
I always walk out, guns a blazing. ANYtime I have a reason to believe somethings up outside, I pick up the Ruger MKII .22 pistol. To go outside without it, and then need it, is usually enough time for the varmint to escape.

If some yahoo tried that here, I'm sure the dog would be a scooby snack for one of the three loose Anatolians... they're always hungry for something small and crunchy . Sure, if the yahoo hadn't wet himself being bayed by three 80lb dogs, the site of me leaving the house with a shotgun or so called assault rifle would.
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  #58  
Old 11/28/09, 09:23 PM
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Keep paying your land taxes and keep believing you "own" the land.

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  #59  
Old 11/28/09, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by WindowOrMirror View Post
while the trespasser certainly was out of line in this case, something tells me that the OP provides ample opportunity for people to bother her
Since THIS trespasser had never met her before, there was nothing the original poster did or could have done to provide him the opportunity to bother her. Regardless of the extreme dislike that some of the posters here have taken to this lady, she still has rights, and one is the right to not have someone trespass on her land witht he intent to terrorize her poultry.
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  #60  
Old 11/28/09, 11:15 PM
 
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Quote:
I always walk out, guns a blazing. ANYtime I have a reason to believe somethings up outside
I am surprised to hear that considering Texas is such a small state and all Texans are so shy and all....
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