Big Vehicles Still Outselling Small Ones

"If the traded cars are going to be crushed, I don't see a dealer giving any trade in allowance, other that the gov't rebate. If the dealer can't re-sell the trade in, it has no value to them."

Excellent point. Hadn't considered that aspect. As I understand it only the body has to be crushed. The engine and other 'take-off' parts can be recycled. Thus the dealer would still have that value.

My actual mpg on my truck and suv have been right on the window sticker or a little higher. My 2005 Yukon has got 18.1 mpg avg. for the last 4 years/50,000 miles.

It will hurt other nations too. Most cars sold in Mexico are used cars from America. They simply can't afford new cars, and only the fairly well off can afford a decent used car.

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I yam what I yam and that's all what I yam.

Popeye

Yep, they are still buying the fullsize vehicles here as well. There is no mystery in this, the people want comfortable, safe vehicles with some hauling capacity.

Design and build what the consumers want.

Drill and refine oil wherever and whenever possible. The oil is there, the infrastructure to refine, transport, and dispense is there, the vehicles are there, and the technology to obtain said oil is there. Let's get it done.

Explore alternate energy options concurrent with the oil exploration/extraction. Implement said alternative energy options only when they prove to be a viable alternative to oil.

As far as the cash for clunkers program goes, I was thinking about using it on one of our vehicles to get something else, but after researching what the dealers are offering around here and running the numbers I came to pretty much the same conclusion as you. Sounds good on the surface, but it is mostly moving some numbers around with little net affect of saving money on a new vehicle purchase. Not to mention the whole issue of sales tax, higher tab costs for new vehicle, and potentially higher insurance rates for new vehicle. If we make a move it will be per our usual M/O, which is to purchase a lower mileage used vehicle from a private party.

We drive Front-Wheel-Drive sedans.

I rather enjoy watching so many big pickup trucks fish-tail, spin-out and slide into the ditch each winter. As I drive on securely hugging the road. Many people make the mistake that a Rear-Wheel-Drive pickup will hold onto the pavement beter because it is big. Physics proves them wrong each winter.



When we first had the need to begin hauling [livestock, hay, feed, building supplies] we got a trailer. I buy my feed by the tonne, and I bring it home hauled by my saab sedan. When I am done hauling stuff, I disconnect the trailer and once again I get good mileage.



Pickup trucks tend to cost more to purchase; they are built to lower standards of safety [no side I-beams and less roll-over structural protection]; they tend to have lower gas mileage; and because so many of them are RWD they become terribly dangerous in the winter.

We pay half the price to buy our vehicles; we pay less in fuel to drive them; we have a higher level of on-road safety standards; and our vehicles hug the road much better on snow /ice.

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http://www.mofga.org/

http://www.mofga.org/Programs/FarmAp...2/Default.aspx

Yep, that Camaro is a nice vehicle that is energy efficient. And, it seems the Japanese still don't make a viable large truck for towing/hauling? I thought the latest Tundra had equivalent towing/hauling capacities to the GM/Ford/Dodge???

http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/...079_634601.htm

There's some fine government logic. Crush the body, but keep the parts that do affect mileage, and put them into another vehicle. I don't have a problem with it, because I thik the program is stupid, but I do see the irony.

My DS owns a small used car dealership and specializes in affordable cars. He's concerned that this program will have a negative impact on the availability of decent used cars, since he buys many dealer trades. Most of his customers are still buying SUV's, trucks & vans.

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Goat's Milk Soap, Lip Balm & Gardener's Hand Balm
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In last weeks paper GM had a crew cab for sale -- at $57,000.00! CDN: eek:
Who has that kind of money?

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tinda
Life may not be the party we hoped for,
But while we are here we might as well dance.

There is a lot of misinformation out there about this program. You talk to 3 different people and you'll get 3 different answers on how it works.

So here is how I think it works. The dealer will offer no other trade in amount if you qualify for the program. So your trade needs to be worth less than $3500-4500 for it to work for you. You also need proof of insurance or other proof that shows that you have owned the vehicle for at least a year so no going out and buying a clunker just to get the deal. Also for trucks/SUVs, you can get the deal if your new truck/SUV gets 2mpg better than your trade. However most trucks/SUVs unless they are really old will be worth more than the program is going to offer and therefore not that useful.

Anyway, I think this is alot more reasonable than just giving the car companies another government loan - this is the consumer's chance to cash in on the government money.

Also around here trucks are super expensive and in demand. To get something under $10,000, you have to look for something older than at least 1998.

Has CARS link been posted here?
http://www.edmunds.com/cash-for-clun...ulus-bill.html
at the top are links to complete lists of vehicles that are eligible for vouchers and vehicles eligible for purchase.

odd thing, we have a van that they list as eligible, and yet I get 22.4 mpg avg.

If you read what I wrote, I wasnt talking about the govt program. I am talking about last summer and $4 gasoline. People were trading perfectly good cars for Prius and such when they would never make back the cost difference in fuel savings.

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"What would you do with a brain if you had one?" -Dorothy

"Well, then ignore what I have to say and go with what works for you." -Eliot Coleman

I seen an ad here in Eastern NC from a dealer who was saying that the government was contracting with them to buy diesel trucks and SUVs to send to other countries, so they wanted people to trade them in for new cars and trucks. They had to have less than 100,000 miles on miles on them and there was a year cutoff too. Maybe obama isn't crushing them after all? Our Dodge is on the C4C list and it is diesel, but we would NEVER get rid of it, it's only a 2001.

If it wont haul people or cargo or get 40mpg then its an impractical car at the money they want. In other words its a sports/luxury car for somebody who needs to massage their ego, not a practical car. And I'd believe it when I see it getting 29mpg. My guess is if it did actually get that kind of mileage it would be a dog to drive with that size and weight. But who knows, some of the high tech caddies got rather amazing hiway mileage if you had a light foot. Not so great in town. Still doesnt make it practical. Didnt GM offer a 2.5L 4cyl Camero at one point? I am sure they sold whole bunch of them....NOT!

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"What would you do with a brain if you had one?" -Dorothy

"Well, then ignore what I have to say and go with what works for you." -Eliot Coleman

Just out of interest, how much was it costing people to fill up their huge trucks and SUVs when gas prices peaked. $70 and up to more than $100 wasn't it?

EmilyMArkansas is correct with some of the additional details she posted about the Cash for Clunkers program. I was going to try it because I had an 18 yr old Dodge Dakota that got low milage and was starting to need a lot of fixing, after 16 wonderful years. It's book value was a lot less than $4, 500 (the amount it qualified for), but having a new car/truck would triple the minimum monthly insurance which is too much for me at this time, even tho I have the cash to pay for a vehicle after the rebate. So I sold it to a neighbor who needed a work truck. ldc

that's pretty much my thoughts as well.
Also, regarding the idea that one needs 4WD to get down crappy roads, I've discovered that there's really no where my full sized pickup can go (in 4WD) that my little Metro can't! (front wheel drive)

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~*~Erin~*~
SAHM, ranch wife, sub and quilt shop proprietress
the Back Gate Country Quilt Shop

I got one of the "clunker" cards in the mail and assumed they were talking about my 2005 chev trailblazer that has never in its short life gotten more than 15mph- i think it is all the four wheel driving i do and the mongo tread tires it wears. But I see that it is not on the list so it must be either the 85 ram charger that gets about 14 or the 91 ford f150 that gets about 16 lol. The ad said I could get something to replace the clunker for "as low as" 106.00 per month. So I am figuring a 10 thousand dollar car financed for 10 years at a low 9 percent interest and it would take me a long long time to spend that much on gas! even with my clunker gang! sis

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www.MontanaSticksAndStones.com at Goshen Farm

Yes.

Until I re-join the circus, my clown car days are over.

Actually depends if you need the ground clearance more than anything. Otherwise set of chains will get you up and down most roads. I had to give up driving my Festiva for couple or three years when driveway started looking like a bombed out war zone. I was even \having people with 4wd pickups complaining. Though you didnt bottom out a 4wd IF you knew which way to zig and zag. And my 3/4 ton has pretty good ground clearance anyway though I even hung it up at one point when things were very slick. Neighbor is trying to sell few acres that use same access so he found bulldozer guy to smooth it out. And dang I didnt get the dozer guys name. Shame as this guy knew what he was doing and worked cheap. In hindsight, could have found him some more work around the place. Anyway I am able once again to use the Festiva without reattaching muffler and patching gas tank every trip down the driveway.

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"What would you do with a brain if you had one?" -Dorothy

"Well, then ignore what I have to say and go with what works for you." -Eliot Coleman

To get through deep snow a 4wd truck with good ground clearance will beat anything. Especially if you can lock the axles. Long wheelbase always more stable. On slick roads where ground clearance not an issure however you want vehicle with long wheelbase and low center of gravity. Front drive has no real advantage. Best ice car I ever had was an old Chevy Nova 4 door straight six with saggy springs. On glare ice I started put on brakes and it started to go sideways. let up on brake and it straightened right out. Couldnt ask for any more than that. Around that era I had a VW Rabbit front drive. Some idiot was coming head on in MY lane towards me FAST in cloud of snow so didnt even see me and it was either suffer direct front end crash or try to get over. I lost traction in the light weight rear, pirouetted, and finally slid sideways and rolled over into ditch. Still better than front crash in ANY car. He didnt even stop. Short wheelbase with light rear end meant it was lousy ice car despite the front wheel drive. And it wasnt good in snow either as it had low ground clearance so compacted snow just wedged up under until it lost traction.

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"What would you do with a brain if you had one?" -Dorothy

"Well, then ignore what I have to say and go with what works for you." -Eliot Coleman