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  #21  
Old 07/10/09, 03:31 PM
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Indiana, USA
Posts: 12,674
Quote:
Originally Posted by mpillow View Post
"When America has to become an underground economy, we've got a real problem on our hands."

But when American gov't creates and enforces (excessive) laws that undermine small holders/producers and there's nothing on the grocery store shelves because of global economics and/or poor weather....those of us who more or less thumb our noses to the bureaucratic BS will be the ones who feed ourselves and others....

Personal freedom trumps all....Don't let the gov't play you for a fool, they don't even read the crap that they vote on more than half the time.....
Who's call is it to say when some regulation is "excessive"?

Everybody is for regulations to ensure health and saftey - until regulations hit them directly.

Case in point.

Everybody was crying and demanded regulation and inspections, when toys were coming from China, were painted with lead based paint. Who cares about the costs to business and eventually consumers? We want safe toys for our children! Not too much to ask.

When the government came down on US home crafters, for regulation and inspection, for the paint that they put on their home-made toys, which likely came from China, people were outraged. The "small guy" was losing all of his god-given freedoms, spending huge amounts of money to comply with "stupid" regulations, causing some home crafters to quit, as they did not want to comply, even though many could probably comply, stay in business and continue to make a profit.

Why should we have a double standard?

"The Little guy" can sell rotten eggs and tainted meat, just like the big boys, maybe even easier.
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  #22  
Old 07/10/09, 04:34 PM
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: CHINA
Posts: 9,569
"The Little guy" can sell rotten eggs and tainted meat, just like the big boys, maybe even easier.

Not if they want to keep their customer base....plain and simple....personal responsibility and all... for both parties producer and consumer....my customers bring their families to play with the animals and on the land that helps to feed them....they know the man that grows our hay....they read the tags on my grain sacks so they know what the animals are eating....they come to see the animal babies that are born....some like to help with chores!

I don't need my food irradiated, I don't need the gov't "policing" my life...I'm not dumb and I can think for myself and it doesn't cost the gov't (taxpayers) anything. And I'm pretty sure the slats on my crib in the early 70's had wide slats and lead paint...my mother kept a good eye on us though....

Less is more truly.
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  #23  
Old 07/10/09, 04:47 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Lone Star State
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpillow View Post
[I]

I don't need my food irradiated, I don't need the gov't "policing" my life...I'm not dumb and I can think for myself and it doesn't cost the gov't (taxpayers) anything. And I'm pretty sure the slats on my crib in the early 70's had wide slats and lead paint...my mother kept a good eye on us though....

Less is more truly.
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  #24  
Old 07/11/09, 02:10 PM
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 880
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stann View Post
Many of you people are missing it. The OP's referenced article is talking about a PROPOSAL. That means that the information presented is not yet required to be followed.

Here's the applicable statement from the article, "The new proposals, recommended by a working group that President Obama created in March, emphasize prevention, enforcement and improving the government's response time to such incidents."

It seems that this article referenced by TurnerHill describes FDA REGULATIONS. They are rules that must be followed and are government enforced.

Do you see the distinction? There is NO indication that the OP's referenced article is referring to TurnerHill's referenced article.
The administration outlined a variety of measures yesterday to prevent the spread of salmonella, a bacterium that causes more than 1 million illnesses each year in the United States.


"Among them is a final rule, issued by the FDA, to reduce the contamination in eggs. About 142,000 Americans are infected each year with Salmonella enteritidis ..."

They are exactly the same thing.

See the text here:

http://www.fda.gov/Food/FoodSafety/P.../ucm170746.htm
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  #25  
Old 07/11/09, 04:46 PM
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: lat 38° 23' 25" lon -84° 17' 38"
Posts: 3,051
Good googly moogly, some of you folks could argue about a horse shoe. Ya make it sound like a bout of 'Mooooooooooooom, he's looking at meeeeee'.
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  #26  
Old 07/11/09, 04:50 PM
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: now... SW Oregon
Posts: 408
Quote:
Originally Posted by TurnerHill View Post
The administration outlined a variety of measures yesterday to prevent the spread of salmonella, a bacterium that causes more than 1 million illnesses each year in the United States.


"Among them is a final rule, issued by the FDA, to reduce the contamination in eggs. About 142,000 Americans are infected each year with Salmonella enteritidis ..."

They are exactly the same thing.

See the text here:

http://www.fda.gov/Food/FoodSafety/P.../ucm170746.htm
No, the articles don't have the same meaning. You assume that the final rule was the only "set of measures" discussed, as indicated by the reporter. We have no indication that that was the case.

From the article, "Overhaul of Food Safety Rules in the Works"...

The administration outlined a variety of measures yesterday to prevent the spread of salmonella, a bacterium that causes more than 1 million illnesses each year in the United States.
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Among them is a final rule, issued by the FDA, to reduce the contamination in eggs.


The phrase "among them" obviously apply to the phrase "variety of measures". The referenced Final Rule (ie. a regulation) is APPARENTLY only ONE INSTANCE OF THE MEASURES THAT ARE UNDER DISCUSSION BY OBAMA'S TEAM. Did you speak to the reporters to determine what exactly they meant?

It's clear that the article is imprecise and not written well, which is common given today's diminished-ability news reporters.

Anyway, I wouldn't bother to comment other than to emphasize we agree that YOUR REFERENCED ARTICLE DOESN'T DIRECTLY APPLY TO MANY HOMESTEADERS READING HERE, since the final rule apply primarily to large egg producers, more than 3000 hens, and to eggs not directly sold to consumers.
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  #27  
Old 07/11/09, 06:04 PM
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 880
Quote:
Originally Posted by VOR. View Post
I saw in one of your posts that you went to law school. I'm surprised that you are not familiar with Wickard v. Filburn.
You're contending that homestead sales of eggs have a substantial aggregate effect on interstate commerce? Or what? I'm not following...

Last edited by TurnerHill; 07/11/09 at 06:09 PM.
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  #28  
Old 07/11/09, 06:09 PM
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 880
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stann View Post
No, the articles don't have the same meaning. You assume that the final rule was the only "set of measures" discussed, as indicated by the reporter. We have no indication that that was the case.

From the article, "Overhaul of Food Safety Rules in the Works"...

The administration outlined a variety of measures yesterday to prevent the spread of salmonella, a bacterium that causes more than 1 million illnesses each year in the United States.
ad_icon

Among them is a final rule, issued by the FDA, to reduce the contamination in eggs.


The phrase "among them" obviously apply to the phrase "variety of measures". The referenced Final Rule (ie. a regulation) is APPARENTLY only ONE INSTANCE OF THE MEASURES THAT ARE UNDER DISCUSSION BY OBAMA'S TEAM. Did you speak to the reporters to determine what exactly they meant?

It's clear that the article is imprecise and not written well, which is common given today's diminished-ability news reporters.

Anyway, I wouldn't bother to comment other than to emphasize we agree that YOUR REFERENCED ARTICLE DOESN'T DIRECTLY APPLY TO MANY HOMESTEADERS READING HERE, since the final rule apply primarily to large egg producers, more than 3000 hens, and to eggs not directly sold to consumers.
What if I told you that on July 7, 2009, the FDA released one final rule, and only one?

Would you then acknowledge that it is at least purdy durn likely that these rules are one and the same?
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