Privilege or Right

It's like "the pursuit of happiness." That is a right. Happiness though is not guaranteed right. That is a reward you get if we are successful in your pursuit.

One has a right to pursue home ownership if they so choose. Ownership is not guaranteed. If you are successful in your pursuit then you will be rewarded.

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If the grass looks greener it is probably over the septic tank. - troy n sarah tx

Our existance here is soley for the expoitation of CMG

That is EXACTLY what I was talking about. Homeownership is only a "right" if you EARN it. But since most people will never even pay off their mortgage, and no one truly "owns" their home anyway (since the gov't can take it from you if you do not pay your taxes) I honestly don't see why "homeownership" is regarded as this wonderful thing that everyone has a right to whether they can afford it or not. I would consider having a decent shelter over one's head as a basic human necessity, but why does it make a difference to the average person whether that shelter is rented or they are making payments on it (since like I said, most people will never pay off a mortgage and remain mortgage-free)?

There's Pride of Ownership.

How many people on this board bought land and put up a shack to live in while they worked their property. How many bought old trailers or campers to live in until they could better their situation?

A roof is wood, and nails,and metal until it becomes yours. Then it becomes hopes, and dreams and possibilities. Then it becomes a home.

Why do you think people are so devastated when they lose their homes.

You do. The quitclaim would transfer any rights he had in the land to the Grantee. If he had rights when he gave the first one they would transfer. At that point he would no longer have any rights and when he granted the second one he would be transfering what rights he had at that point which since he transfered them already would be none.
Both transactions would be perfectly legal.

When you really get right down to it "home ownership" no longer exists in America.

All realestate in essence belongs to government. No matter what size your house or land is, if you fail or refuse to pay even just $1 in property tax you loose that property. It will be sold to someone else and the government will keep all the money. If that person fails to pay just $1 in property tax the government will again take it and sell it to another and keep all the money.

There was a time in America when if you paid for the property it was indeed yours. There was no realestate tax or income tax which the government could use to take what you already owned. If you owned the house or land it was yours until you died as long as you didn't owe another man.

That America is gone forever. When our forfathers gave up a little bit of their liberty to government for the promise of security they lost that liberty forever for themselves and us.

Home ownership is niether a right or a privilage because you can't really own a home. You can only purchase the right to occupy it as long as you continue to pay the lawyers who run government whatever they say you must pay them in order to continue to occupy it.

When we leave this world God can give us a home that no man can take away. Many of those arrogant, self absorbed, greedy, lustful, power hungry lawyers and MBAs in government will end up with nothing.

The world passes away but the Word of the Lord endures forever.

Ownership and possession are two separate concepts and they can be separated. Even though the state can (and will) separate you from your possession and enjoyment of your property you may still be considered the owner.

Most people might think they are the owner of a property at the conclusion of closing. This is a mistake. The bank is the homeowner. You do get possession for as long as you make the payments needed. This is by contract. You have possession. The bank has ownership.

When I go to a machinery auction I might expect to buy machinery. When I attend a livestock auction I expect to buy animals. If I were to attend a tax sale would you expect that I was there to buy taxes?

The state never has had anything other than an equitable interest in the property through taxes and that is all they can sell. The deed they give is essentially a quit claim deed that transfers any interest they had in the property. Their interest is the taxes they presume are due.

The only way out of this, is to buy some land out of the way and start a church community/retreat and live there. No land taxes and the land belongs to whatever group you are.....

1. non-profit 5013c with a location "out of the way" so you don't get taken over by eniment domain. Kinda like the Branch Davidian Church home previously in Waco Texas.

2. keep the government off ya back, stay well legal if it is possible.

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I see a very dark cloud on America's horizon,
and that cloud is coming from Rome.
- Abraham Lincoln

May be hard to believe, the State was never consulted, when I decided to build my house. The State wasn't asked if a permit was needed or required. The State (and this might be even harder to believe) didn't know I had a house. No permits were filed (since they weren't required), no taxes were paid... no school, county, state, or federal taxes. The state didn't know I had a house till 14 years later... the developer next door was trying to get my land, by hook or crook... he reported my house wasn't on the tax grid... Silver spooned son of a biscuit eater.

The state didn't help me build the house, the state didn't tell me I could build, or not build, so I fail to see what the State has to do with anything. You might say I have a Patent to my house... if I dislike it, I can, without notifying anyone, (except the GF and the dogs) burn it to the ground, without legal punishments.

I guess, in a 'roundabout' way, the state granted me something, by "NOT" patrolling the skies continously, to make sure I 'wasn't' building a house, without their permission.

In this society, if a person wants to build a house, they should be allowed to. They should be allowed to, if they can afford it. If they cannot afford it, they can still want it, but they can't have it.

All of us have a right to a home, as long as we can pay the bills.

Like I mentioned before, People get misconfused into thinking they have 'rights', and those 'rights to' things, should be given to them, without sacrifice. This is wrong.

My house is humble... to some it'd be a shack, to others a mansion. If we have a Right to a home, I want a 30K' mansion, thank you very much.

I want a new truck... unfortunately, driving and owning a vehicle are priveleges also.

On the issue of taxes, and paying property taxes on our homes and land, I'm 100% in favor of doing away with all of them. A person wants govt. services, let them pay for them.

btw... I've done title work on my land from the State to present.

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Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity. Seneca
Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival. W. Edwards Deming

I wonder if we could get the gummint to let us pay a 'life-time' tax, whereby we don't owe another penny as long as we live? Then our heirs would have to pay the going rate once they inherited it. They might be just greedy enough to take a lump sum now, rather than collecting every year. Of course, the lump sum might be a little steep.....

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"What one generation tolerates, the next generation embraces." -John Wesley

Believe it or not but Nevada has a program to do just that. They developed something called 'alloidal title' in which you pay all the taxes up front and they will never bother you again. That is not to say they will not bother your heirs if they turn around and register the property again though.

Alloidal title from medieval law was the ultimate in private property. You owed no fealty to anyone under the sun, no knights service in exchange for possession, no taxes. Everyone is looking for the same type title in this country but few have achieved it in a straightforward and honest manner.

One way I have heard to relieve the tax burden for a property that has been registered is to divide it. Have it surveyed into two properties. This evidently destroys the single tax ID number for the original property and the state must wait for the next registration event to occur for new tax liability to attach. Just don't re-register either of the new properties. I don't know whether this works but have been told that it does, so this stands as an informational and educational post rather than legal advice.

In a Biblical sense, property ownership is a God given right. God makes us stewards of the land. When a person buys a piece of land (rightfully and honestly), he/she becomes the rightful owner in the eyes of God. If you read Proverbs, there is much to warn about moving boundary stones/markers.

The state (which is in rebellion against God), takes away this right by taxing that which belongs to God, thus making true ownership now no longer feasable and taking away true God given stewardship of the land.

I tend to agree with the writers of our constitution that we are "Endowed with certain inalienable rights and among these life, liberty and the persuit of happiness". These rights I was born with, but material things are not rights and I was born with none. The 2nd amendment recognizes the right to keep and bear arms, but does not provide a gun, that part is up to me. This whole politcal discussion of a "right to own a home" is political pandering, we have to right to private property but not to having one provided.

The article posted by Palani is worthy of much discussion. It is the only one of its kind because when I searched for this info weeks ago I came across the same one. I'll have to reread and comment and ask questions as time allows.

Vern: 501c3 is not a good idea. If you care to live totally isolated then that's your choice. The disciples of Christ should be together and near one another for daily fellowship and communication, preferably in a rural location not too far from a city.

As for the government owning the land, this may be of interest:

http://www.atgpress.com/kifap/britcol/b7.htm

"Mr. Montgomery is showing you the progression from a certain period of time that certain mere mortal men have decided that they were granted certain rights above all other men in claiming dominion over all land. The pecking Order starting from the top in controlling land are;

1. The Pope
2. The Kings of all lands, but we are talking specifically England here.
3. Knights
4. Lord Proprietors of the King in America
5. Royal Governors of the King, in America
6. Administrative officers of the corporate colonies of America
7. Freeholders/Freemen of granted property in America.
8. The officers of the newly constituted States of America which, gave way to the;
9. Officers of the United States which now reverses 8 and 9 due to the States joining Union.
10. The County officers which are the corporate instrumentalities of the State.
11. Simple man, meaning you, reading this." Quote from "The Informer"

How does one rightfully and honestly buy land? To do so I would have to agree that the state cannot be involved. If the state can be avoided, then how does one pay for the land? If he uses FRN's, isn't the state then involved?

Bryan: But the constitution is subject to "interpretation." Besides, it isn't holy scripture nor based on it.