tricks at burning green wood

Cottonwood?!
Yikes!
We were given several Cottonwood trees two years ago, burned it last year...can you say NO HEAT!!! I about froze last winter until we got back to the Pine and Cherry in the woodshed.
The remainder of the Cottonwood (that didn't get split) has been left for birds and mice.

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"At The Worlds Beginning There Was A Mother"
~ Chinese Tao Te Ching~

Please, everyone, pay attention to this poster. A chimney fire is not a fun thing. A chimney fire will sound like a jet engine and fire and sparks will fly out the top of the pipe and land on the roof. Find dry , seasoned wood to burn and if you need to use green wood, cut it this year to use next year.

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* I'm supposed to respect my elders, but its getting harder and harder for me to find one. .*-

Yes, I am also concerned about chimney fires.

And I'm glad that you have ready access to dry wood.

I hope to get dry wood soon. Maybe when it stops pouring rain and I get a bit of time off from work.

Since I've burned a lot of green wood, and I have never experienced a chimney fire, I'm not sure if I'm safely burning green wood (which so far, I think I am) or if I may be sitting on a powder keg (I think you are leaning to the latter).

My understanding is that creosote is built up whether you use green wood or dry wood - that the real creosote builder is cooler fires. But by running really hot fires, you burn all of the creosote out of your chimney. All of it. No creosote means no chimney fire, right?

Are you saying that a really hot fire doesn't get rid of creosote? Or that it doesn't get rid of all of it? Or, perhaps you are saying that there is something other than creosote to be concerned with?

Your chimney should only have a light coating of creosote but it all depends on your draft and other factors.My farther had a chimney fire years ago that cracked his liner and outer cement bricks he was glad there was snow on the roof at the time. I burn some green wood in my boiler but prefer it dry. You can see in this pic the creosote that came out of the horizontal pipe when i burned some walnut that seemed dry I also have a pic of my chimney that i just took it did not need cleaning last winter and the only pipe i will clean i the one inside.

cut the wood short 8 -10 inches it will split easier and then get it under cover as soon as you can like they said a lot of the drying happens from the ends so less distance between ends the better , i haven't much experience with the burning of green or wet but whne i have logs that don't want to split i cut them short about 8 inches and then they split into chunks fairly easily

but i notice a big difference in wood that was covered vs uncovered unless it has been dry (no rain) for atleast a week , my advise is elevate , like with pallets and tarp it as soon as possable , even if it is not split yet try to get it off the ground even if it is sitting on concrete it keeps it's ,moisture much more than eleivated on a pallet

if you can keep a few days supply in the house that will help atleast to get the outside dry

idealy you should have flames unless it is to coals

isn't creosote more likely to build up the more bends you have in the pipe? We have a straight up pipe and clean our pipe once a year and never get a lot of junk out of it, even though we make a super hot fire only very occasionally and also sometimes burn green wood(one year we burned more green oak and ash and there still wasnt' much build up to clean out). Also, we never burn fir slow(cuz it won't)--just the oak and ash goes slow.

A super-hot fire does clear out creosote, but depending on the internal structure of your walls, how well the access for the chimney is separated from same, you could be overheating the surrounding wood, altering its nature and making it extremely more susceptible to catching on fire inside the walls. Be cautious!! Sue

Marinemomtatt is right about cotton wood! It practically burns cold.
Dont waste your time even looking at it.
I also remember that horrible thunderous whoosh in the chimney. Cant say if it was from cottonwood cause in those days I cheated and turned on the floor furnace.

You guys are CRAZY!......said with respect and in a friendly tone! I used to work for the fire prevention office at our local FD and have seen so many burned down houses from woodstove fires; they are horrifying!

I would NEVER burn green wood or *gasp* stack wood up against a stove to dry it. You're asking for a fire that will burn your house down. Your house, belongings, maybe your pets, or God forbid, family could be lost in that fire you caused just to "save a few bucks".

You know how many times people have come in to the FPO after a fire and said, "I did it for years and it was ok"? Hardly anyone loses a house to a wood fire the FIRST time they don't heed warnings.....it's the LAST one that counts. I don't know anyone who ever made a mistake like that, that ever did it again after they lost their home, insured or not. Many would not ever even install a wood burning appliance again.

I know, you will probably say I'm a fearmonger, but you're talking about your house and family's safety. You know what burns even better and quicker than dry wood? Your home. Why risk it?

(Preaching over. LOL)

I was always told not to store any wood in the basement. Wood that is not dry will produce moisture in the air that is not good for the basement (ie, may contribute to rot). Or vice versa, if your basement is damp (noticeable or not), you wood will not dry as easily. Also, you may be introducing not only mice, but possibly wood-eating vermin (termites, ants) into your home.

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"The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese in the trap."

Now for the real info on wood burning and creosote.


All wood fires produce Creosote period. The dryness or wetness has nothing to do with the amount produced. Soft woods in fact produce less than hardwoods. Pine for instance will produce about half of the beloved Oak.

So what is the difference? Well it's very simple. Creosote is the precipitate out of wood smoke that starts just above the steam point of water about 220F or so. The denser the smoke the lower the precipitation point.

Now to burning wet v/s dry wood. Well we all know how it's harder to get wet wood burning hot, Right? Well this lack of heat causes the chimney to be below the critical precipitation temp. This causes the buildup. But so does burning the driest wood in a smoldering fire.


To prevent creosote buildup and the associated chimney fires....

1. Never burn a cold fire. If you need less heat put in less wood.

2. Have an insulated chimney. This will maintain the smoke temp longer.

3. Provide maintenance to the stove and chimney to see it's all clean and in working order.

4. **** Burn Hot at every firing. Each and every time you load the stove you should bring the stove up to full temp to be sure the chimney is hot. **** Then you can slow the fire down slightly to lengthen the burn time.

Can you expand on this a little...as in how I know I'm doing what you're suggesting? Should I get a thermometer for the stove, the stovepipe, or both? I have SS insulated stovepipe from the outlet on the stove all the way to the roof. What's the ideal temp for the stovepipe and/or the stove?

Can you also explain what a cold fire is? I always thought that in the morning you make a rager for about an hour and then load the stove up, lower the draft, and keep it flickering all day. Then at night, you load the stove up to the top, turn the draft down again and let it go low and slow all night. Am I wrong or is there a difference between older stoves and the newer airtight models like mine?

I've burned firewood for over three decades and agree fully with everything Stan has written. The key to minimizing creosote buildup is to keep the chimney temp high enough to keep water vapor from condensing.

One way that you will know that creosote is building up in your chimney is if the inside of your firebox is black and glossly after a cool, slow fire. In other words, if creosote is building up inside of the firebox it is certainly building up inside your chimney.

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This is the government the Founding Fathers warned us about.....

Well how to explain....

First your probably doing it right in the morning. You load the stove and get it hot. Then you can slow it to where you maintain the secondary burn. This is critical. You must keep good flame. With the "overnight" burn. Well you should do it the same as the fire during the day. In fact you should be setting it at the same burn rate always. You adjust the burn time/ heat out put buy the amount of wood you put in the stove not the draft control. The draft is to slow only a really hot fire, Not to make a cold flickering one.


Here are a few tips to get longer, cleaner burns.

Use larger pieces (only in a hot fire), thicker pieces take longer to burn. Place them side to side instead of front to back(If your main draft is in the front. Some models have a side draft. If this is the case place them front to back.)

Use batch loading. Fill the stove. Then allow it to burn down fully. Don't add a piece or two every hour or two.

Realize that your stove will only give about 8 hrs(some may give 6 or some may give 10) of good heat. So be sure to tend the fire as needed. Wood heat isn't a furnace so it's going to have hot and cold cycles. This is what makes them feel so warm and comforting. When they are fired in a cool house.

P.S. I only heat with wood, No furnace here. So, yes we have heat cycles.

Stan is correct in his decription. My brand new stove has a built in thermostat that plainly shows the "safe" operating range for that load. It also has an adjustable damper and a mechanical one-both of which can be adjusted for the fire in the box.

Each and every load (morning and night) I have to make sure it's in the safe operating range before setting the dampers for the day/evening. If I do it correctly, I have a really good bed of very hot coals the next time around-and it only takes a short while to get the new load of wood into safe operating range.

Here's what we have...the Ultra, based on size:

http://www.blazeking.com/Stoves/king1107.html

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A glimpse into my life and thoughts up here in Southcentral Alaska-visit my blog www.suvalley.blogspot.com

So with an insulated chimney that gets warm to the touch but not hot, how do you know your chimney is hot enough to prevent buildup?

Fin, the best way to be sure is looking at your chimney out side when the fire is going.

Do you see smoke? If you do make the fire hotter. If you don't maybe you can lower it a bit. But check for smoke. If your stove is hot enough you should see no to tiny amounts of smoke. If your chimney looks like your running a Coal fired steam train... heat it up.

Experience

It's like this, even if you knew the temp of the gases in your stovepipe as it left the woodstove, the temp is going to cool down as it rises upward. The rate of cooling is dependant on how long your chimney is, whether the majority of your chimney is inside or outside of your house, and the material the chimney is made of (ie,m concrete block or insulted chimney pipe).

Because of this, the best place to monitor your chimney temperature is at the very top of your chimney! In a perfect world, the temp of the vapors exiting your chimney at the top should be well above the temp of boiling water (ie, >212ºF).

So, if you want to get this down to a science, you might want to try this experiment. Place a magnetic thermometer on your stovepipe. Send someone up on the roof with a walkie-talkie. Have him hold a thermometer over the top of the chimney. When the temp of the wood smoke exiting your chimney is about 220 to 250ºF, look at the temp on your stovepipe thermometer and remember it. This "experiment" should get you in the ball park of knowing what is the safe burn temp for your woodburning stove.

__________________
This is the government the Founding Fathers warned us about.....

You volunteering, lol? When the installers were here, the looks on their faces indicated they were less than impressed with the height of the peak...at least we have a good draft...

That does seem like a worthwhile/interesting experiment.