air in the water? please help with our water problem.

agmantoo - well, I'm not gonna do the extended water off test thing cause I'd honestly never notice the switch kicking the pump on if I wasn't hanging out around it. Spending possibly hours waiting for something to happen in the pantry just isn't in my schedule right now.

As for the when the switch kicks on and off, I'd have to go check what the pressure settings are for that, but generally, the switch works as it should when we're using water -- it's those rare moments when the switch lets pressure drop to 0 when we're not using it. This has happened maybe once since December, but it would happen about weekly more or less from July to December. I'm sure this problem will return as the weather warms, just like the air in the pipes was absent from December to March and just returned when the daytime temps went back up again (or maybe it's a water table thing that someone mentioned).

I've not adjusted the pressure in the bladder tank, I simply checked the pressure via the top valve to verify it was set at the pressure the tank specified, it was.

The bladder tank has to be adjusted to 2 lbs below the pressure of the cut in pressure of the pressure switch. With this set incorrectly you will experience the drop to 0 water and no flow. Familiarize yourself with the function of a working well pump and return when you have more time and if my time permits we will go forward.

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Agmantoo
If they can do it,
you know you can!

If your well is equiped there is a simple test to determine if the air is coming from the well or the house system. Most wells around here have a garden hose conection right where the column pipe exits the well (main part here is before the pressure tank). run the well with this valve open and discharge it into a deep bucket with the hose submerged. If air keeps coming out then the pump is the colprit and I agree PITA to fix.

If this is the case it will be worth it to have a pump-guy come out and run a quick test (under an hour) while monitoring the water level. If money isn't to big an issue you can buy an electric tape sounder or rent an easy to use sonic sounder and do this yourself. The idea is to measure the water before the pump comes on and then watch it while it runs. If the water falls (in your case with a pump depth @ 200') to 180 feet or lower you could be sucking air. When a well is run (no matter the type) the water within the casing swirls and creates a kind of whirlpool around the pipe and given pump capacities you can suck air long before you pump dry (imagine flushing your toilet).

Electric tape (model PWS-300F for 300') $370
http://www.goestores.com/tabular.asp...&DeptID=241923

Sonic Sounder (Rental or pay BIG BUCKS) $40 a day $800 Deposit
http://www.globalw.com/products/wl600.html

I like having a sounder around the house since it's actualy pretty common for someone to ask you to sound there well if they know you have the ability and knoledge.

I better mention the problem with electric tape sounders. If you have a submersible pump (which it sounds like you do) the wires going down the well will slack with time creating little loops at every point they are taped (average 10-20'). the sounder can get stuck in one of these loops on the way down or up and without a lot of careful finessing you can rip the sounder apart in the well. This is not ment to scare anyone from doing it but to give them a full understanding.

If you can afford the deposit, or maybe get a bunch of neibors to pitch in and run tests on all the wells the same day, I would rent. Simply point, click, read. NOW THAT'S EASY.

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Please forgive Typo's and Gramatical Errors as a result of public education

"That's the governments job. To meddle and interfere equally" - Reynolds

i have had lots of problems with water systems and what you say is happening, i would bet your well is very low with water and its sucking air. when the switch cuts off and you have no pressure thats when its dry the switch is working just how its made to. its a low pressure cut off which means when the pressure drops from not having no water it cuts off to keep your pump from burning up because its not pumping water. it should cut off when the pressure drops to 20 psi if its a 30/50 switch and it will only cut off when it drops to 20. if its holding say 22 psi it will let the pump keep pumping so thats where the air is coming from when you notice it in the lines then as the well refills it will build up to 50 psi and then shuts off.

then when you have to restart the switch is when it drops below 20 psi. so lets say the well is low and you are using it and you turn the faucet off and the pressure is 25 and by this time its sucking air, so its still trying to pump and you go and turn it back on before it builds any more pressure and use some more water then the pressure drops below 20 psi and off the switch goes off but if you dont use any more for a while it will build up enough to cut off when it gets to 50 psi. thats when you notice the air in the lines because it was sucking air and you never knew it.

It is typical around here to have a light wired up to the well pump, goes on when the pump is on, off when the pump is not on.

This has saved me many times from various bad things over the past 40 years. I'd be lost without it. A person gets a 'rythum' for the pump, how often the light comes on, how long it stays on, depending what one is doing with water. If that light does things differently, I know something isn't right, & can look into it before there is a serious problem.

You might want to consider such a thing. My well is several 100 feet from the house, near a shed. We have the 20 watt light bulb in the wondow of the building, can see it from a window of the house.

--->Paul

When the water ceases to run they will be back willing to do what is necessary!

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Agmantoo
If they can do it,
you know you can!

up here in new york some of the houses have a small light by the kitchen sink as rambler mentioned. agman wouldnt the pressure dropping to 0 without the pump coming on signal a bad pressure switch or sediment or something inside the tiny port of the switch?.......mink

rambler - the light on the well sounds like a neat idea.

So, looks like we're at a stall with the problem most likely coming from inside the well and getting that fixed is on hold for now. Wish it would be something as simple as the pressure switch, but alas, that'd be too easy (plus, we fixed that last year already - though we will check for sediment in the pipe below it).

Since the sputtering water drives me nuts, we'll prolly end up with an air release valve much sooner than an examined well, well as soon as I convince DH to not continue with his fancy plan and stick to something simple. Or, we will just put up with it until it gets cold again, which may be more realistic but hopefully not what happens.

Thanks again for all the great feedback, glad to know there wasn't something glaringly obvious inside the house that we were overlooking.

Mink, with an improperly set bladder tank and according to the plumbing arrangement it is possible to not get any water for a short duration and for the pump not to kick in. When the pump does kick end, the system is basically empty and the pressure switch "thinks" there is no water and the low pressure cutout functions. IMO, the pressure switch xix has is the type with a lever that must be held until the system pressure builds to satisfy that the pump is actually pumping water(safety device to protect the pump) in order for the pressure switch to start functioning like an on/off differential switch. Normally with the most basic type of pressure switch the debris in the 1/4 inch fitting under the pressure switch is the culprit.

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Agmantoo
If they can do it,
you know you can!