Anybody make money raising feeder rodents/bugs?
 

Just curious... I've always wondered if there's any money in it. I think I read on here about a lady whose best cash "crop" was feeder mice she raised in her barn. I know there's also different kinds of bugs and whatnot that pet stores sell as feed... anyone raise them for sales? Besides worms of course, I know about composting worms :)

yep
 

Yes....There is $$$ in raising rodents...Pet shops...zoos...Reptile Hobbyist all are in need...I have a friend who has a Zoo account and numerous pet shops account and make a killing....Lab mice is another possibility but lots more regulations...The only downfall I notice is the ammonia smell...its there even when you clean the cages...google feeder rodents at look at the competition...No USDA checks required for mice and rats...

Ive raised feeders for my own reptiles and too trade local pet shops for supplies..pretty easy... Noah

There are great rodent breeding set ups available. I never raised them. I have a freind that dose push 5k mice out a month at .70 each. Not bad for a guy on SSI with brain damage.

When we had our pet store we purchased from feeder banks. There is money in mice and rats. There is also money in lab rabbits and rats.

Just the feeder market is more profitable and easier to keep under the table.

There are great rodent breeding set ups available. I never raised them. I have a freind that dose push 5k mice out a month at .70 each. Not bad for a guy on SSI with brain damage.

When we had our pet store we purchased from feeder banks. There is money in mice and rats. There is also money in lab rabbits and rats.

Just the feeder market is more profitable and easier to keep under the table.

I used to raise them for the wholesale market. Yes there's good money in them but my RA got really bad and I couldn't keep up. I tried hired help and couldn't keep anyone around long enough.

Yes, Freedom breeder has great systems.

This is a very high price system. You can set it up MUCH cheaper if you can work with wood and plastic pans.

At one of the zoos where I worked they had a great "rat room" set up. Floor to ceiling racks where dishpans could slide in. They fit closely enough together to prevent escape. They were divided into ages/sizes with permanent breeder areas. We fed lots of animals with the rats, from pinks on up to adults... not a bad hobby/job if you could get in touch with the folks that wanted them.

I remember my aunt worked at a huge cricket farm in Mississippi once years ago. I have no idea if they would smell like rodents do...

Michelle

If you really do it, it's a fairly easy way to qualify as a farm - whoops, agricultural enterprise - even if you're just doing it in your garage. You can get the tax write-offs and exemptions pretty easily .

Interesting thread. I'll have to remember this when I get a barn someday :)

My brother in law sells crickets & fruit flys. He just orders 10,000 in bulk & resells at $1.00 a dozen, which is still cheaper than the closest pet store.

I've been doing it for about 5 years now. I'm rebuilding after the move now~ but here are some pics of my racks I took before the move~ I built the wooden ones~ each tub holds 1.5 (one male to five females) rats. The metal one I purchased~ it was expensive and is hard to load the feed hoppers~ wish I had just built a mouse rack too
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/imag.../RatRacks2.jpg
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/imag...ack4-24-06.jpg

with that set up I ran 20 colonies of rats and up to 35 colonies of mice. I use about 100# of feed a week~ so about $40-$50 and two bales of pine~ about $8 worth. I produce enough rodents to feed my snakes.....at the largest point somewhere around 100 snakes plus neonates (babies) and still sell enough to cover my weekly feed/litter bills with a little pocket change left. I sell the baby snakes too.

I try to sell the feeders live when I can find a buyer~ it's easier for me. But if I can't find a buyer I Euthanize with CO2, vaccuum seal and freeze to sell later when I find a customer
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/imag...s/Frozen_2.jpg

I'm hoping to expand my facility this year as I've now got a dedicated building for them~ and make a bit moe money. I'm also hoping I can claim them and the profit as "farming" rather than "pet feed" as I did in CA.

so I won't have to apply and be a "Business" again? I was "The Red Dragons Den" in California for tax purposes and had to file my taxes quarterly. I disolved the business last June because I was prepping for the move and had sold off my rodents and was not selling any more snakes. I'm kind of hoping not to have to be a "Business" again but rather to run the rodents and the snakes as "farming" here in AL. I plan to talk with a CPA when I file this year (gonna be a nightmare) but I'd kind of like an idea what I should be trying to ask them to do for me.

I have not made any sales since May of 2007 and don't expect to make any till Feb or March of 08~ but the rats are definately working for me (got at least 20 litters down right now) so I will be ready to start selling again soon.

Do you know Larry in Des Moines Iowa?

Larry Suttles? I'm not sure where Larry lives~ midewest *I think* ~ but I know a Larry Suttles who breeds rats~ he has some nice ones. The Larry I know breeds for feed as well as form and color like I do. I did not purchase my new stock from Larry~ too far away~ but the gentleman I bought my new stock from has so I do have some of Larry's hairless bloodline in the lines I'm working with right now. Unfortunately~ I think hairless rats are about us ugly as a rat can get......so I'll probably be trying to breed it OUT of my lines! Beauty is in the eye of the beholder! LOL! I got lucky and found some blue rats and some silky mice yesterday so now I'll close the colonies (no new rodents in) and start breeding my own "line" from the stock I have.

Lets just say Larry has a need for feeders. More then ANYONE else.

If Larry can not get it NO ONE can get it. That Larry.

There is money to be made in breeding feeders and research rodents.

Not my thing.

Interesting. Wonder if that could be made into a business in Wichita, KS?

You can do it anywere. I would suggest air conditioning.

Yeah~ you have to watch the temps. All those little warm bodies produce a ton of heat themselves. I've never had a problem in winter keeping them warm enough.....but I was living in So Cal so no real issue there. But in the summer if they get much about 85F the stop breeding~ if they get above 90F they start losing hair~ if they get above 95F they start dying. AC units are a problem because the ammonia gets in the coils and ruins them~ and then there is the constant "rat dust"~ it gets into everything. I ran an AC in CA~ but I'm hoping here in AL to get away with fans. If you build your racks with the tubs far enough apart to allow good air flow you can run a couple good BIG fans across the racks and out a window. The constant air flow keeps them cooler and keeps the flies from having an easy time lighting in the tubs. You wind up with a lot of litter and rat dust flying~ so don't aim at a nieghbors house! And blow your fans out with a leaf blower every week when you clean.

There are all sorts of feeder insects you can raise as well that don't really require too much time/effort, and you can feed them to your own animals, or use as fishing bait. Right now a lot of people are raising species of tropical roaches to feed to their reptile pets instead of crickets, and a lot of people keep roaches as pets too.

Yes, Freedom was $ but met our needs and did pay for themself.
There really is money in it but it was work too.

customers that you might not think about.
Rapter places. (lots of hurt eagles, owls ect up in AK) Great reg money flow

Would you believe Labs that test for red tides (shell fish) And they pay BIG BUCKS
(but that is really hard work-request for 5,000 female same age (down to the day and same weight )
It was good but it is work to have a clean set up. For us having a metal set up no wood reduced the chance of illness, odor, and was easier to maintain.

I think I read on here about a lady whose best cash "crop" was feeder mice she raised
 

yep..That was my post. The young girl is in Terrace BC and she raises chickens ,quail, horses and mice. I think her website is jbobsfunnyfarm@telus.net or yahoo.com...not sure. She told me she gets $1 a mouse at the pet store..Thats pretty good. I don,t imagine they eat much.

I raise mice for fun. I actually like to play wit the colors, so most of what I have is fancy. I'm going to be trying to obtain a high producing strain to toy with.

I keep anywhere from 2-6 tubs of a male and 3-6 females. I had a lot of variety, but lost a lot too. I have black satins now, but just two females.

Perhaps we should swap some mice around. I've shipped live mice befre. Although it isn't "legal", with priority mail they get there within a few days. I've never had higher than a 50% loss on shipped mice. I just culled out my bins(I give mine away to the pet shop or just toss them, sometimes at birth, sometimes when they are grown), so I'm down to nothing really. I have two bins of a male and three females.

Now that I think of it, today is a good day to go around looking for some more blood.

I've also done mealworms. They are good, but I hate getting them out. The sheds make it impossible to sift them.

What about using air flow like they do to separate grain from chaff?

This is the message I got from a person who is in charge of animal nutrition at a zoo:

"We use a large number of rats and mice every month. I'm talking 100's of each. We have tried to use local vendors before on purchasing mice and rats but most people had a hard time keeping up with the orders. Then we would call to place an order and they would be out of business. I can tell you that you would have plenty of business from pet stores and rehab people who work with The fish and game dept. I have no problem purchasing from local vendors, Actually at this point in time some of the large rodent companies are completely out of large rats.

As for insects We use crickets, mealworms, wax worms and giant meal worms. We use about 30,000 crickets a week, different sizes from pinheads to adults.

We also go thru around 100,000 mealworms a week 3,250 wax worms and 2,000 giant mealworms.

Raising rodents or insects either one is a good business if you can keep up and be competitive with the competition.
I would suggest one or the other either rodents or insects, I wouldn't do both that is quite the undertaking."

2nd message is from a raptor center:

"I go through about 600 jumbo mice and 50 large rat per month here at my center alone. I would get in touch with other people or companies that breed rats and mice. You need knowledge in trays and racks, cleaning, feeding, euthanasia, supplies, breeding cycles etc. I rehab and train raptors so I am not someone who you would get this information from. Try your local pet stores that sell mice and rats and they may be of help. I hope that you are able to get this started, it would be nice to have someone local to get a food supply from."

I'm considering buying a mice rack and starting from there. Was wondering where to buy a CO2 machine and a vaccum packing machine. Probably will start with bugs first.

Reauxman~ be very careful about bringing in "new blood"~ all mice/rats have "myco" (an upper respiratory disease) most "healthy" rodents are immune to the strain they carry which is why they are healthy~ but if you combine two "healthy" rodents with different strains of myco.......you'll have an outbreak. I lost a lot of rodents to that a few years back. Now that I have obtained the silky mice and the blue rats I was looking for I have "Closed" my colony and no new rodents will be coming in. I'll be doing all my breeding from production in my closed colony.

Two other points~
I don't want to lecture you~ but Please don't ship live mammals USPS~ it's cruel and illegal

It sounds like you have your male and female mice separated. Mice are colony critters~ very nasty little beasties actually. Once they have decided what their "Colony" consists of they will kill outsiders. Put a colony of mice together with one male and however many females and leave it alone. If you need more breeders in the tub bring up pups born in the tub as future breeders. You can swap rats around~ but mice are too mean and it rarely succeeds (yes~ I have heard of it succeeding~ but not often).

TedH7~ I made my CO2 chamber and put a how to up on my website~ here ya go:
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/co2.htm

The vacuum sealer is just the standard ones you buy to seal people food~ once the rats are dead......they are just food.

Good Luck!

I've shipped over 15 shipments of live mice, from 200 miles to over 1000 miles with great results.

I breed in small colonies, from 2-6 females. I like 3 females and a male. I just find they work best with the cages I use. I could easily turn 50 mice a month from a tub of 3 females before I lost my strain of albinos.

I don't worry much with my fancy guys. If I loose them I loose them. I don't have that much work in them. It's my strain that I lost that was my big producer.

For those looking to start, when looking for breeders, try the big chain stores. PetCo and Petsmart. The reasoning is that they will have mice from good lines, heavier producers than most pet stores. Mine came indirectly from a lab, but I'm thinking of getting some from petco.

I don't do rats. They are just nasty. I like my mice. I've kept mice or 8 or 10 years. They aren't a real bother really, but again, I don't depend on them, I just like having them. I can feed them when I clean the cage and if I don't have time, I don't need to even check on them but every few days. They stay in my closet and don't smell at all.

It really depends on what your looking for. If your after fancies and want to breed for color and form as I do and it sounds like Reauxman does~ then petstores are the way to go. If you want to breed for production~ than lab strains are the best bet. Swiss Websters are supposed to produce 20-25 per litter consistently. You can get those from a lab supplier (pricey) or some feeder breeders have them~ but be carefull. If you really want the production make sure your breeder has not outbred them~ it is said to ruin the line if you breed fancies into it.

Which ones would you say that breeds faster...the mice or the bugs? I think rats take a while and also mealworms. 3 months for 1 mealworm to develop and reproduce....personally I love the fancy mice..I like the colorful ones. I thought about possibly buying some from fancy mice breeders who also show theirs but a lot of them are not interested in their mice breeding babies that will be eaten from what I understood.

Also one more thing..what do you do with the litter (wood chips or whatever) after you're done cleaning the cages?

I throw mine out, but I don't have a lot.

When we had a lot of cavies we used to toss it in with the other animal waste in a pile.

I threw the litter out in Ca~ I was in a residential neighborhood and could not mulch it so I bagged it and contracted for extra trash pick up. I would do about 4 of the big 33 gal bags a week in litter. Now I'm putting it in a mulch pile around back~ but I can already see the flies are going to be a problem~ I'll have to move it farther from the house than I have it now.

I don't know anything about bugs~
Mice and rats breed at about the same rate. Some people prefer mice~ I personally think the stink more than rats do~ and their personalties are not as friendly or intelligent as rats. To each his/her own though~ some people say the exact opposite. I breed both rats and mice because I need the mice for baby cornsnakes. I was getting $1 each for a big mouse or small rat in CA~ but my understanding is that here I will be able to get more for the rats, less for the mice. I'll still keep mice~ though I don't like them as much.

Lets see~ usually if I put a group of juveniles together I'm to the fist litters of pinks within three to four months. The first litters are smaller~ and sometimes a new momma or another cagemate kills first litters. If you keep the male in with them (with mice you should or the girls will kill him when you try to put him back) then he will re-breed the female before she is even giving birth to the litter~ she will drop new pups every three weeks. Sell day olds as soon as dropped~ pinks up to a weak~ fuzz up to two weeks (give or take)~ crawlers up to two three weeks~ weaners at three plus weeks~ adults when they get bigger (another couple weeks).

If you colony breed with the male in all the time your females will last about a year to a year and half of heavy breeding~ then cull them and sell as retired/jumbo breeder feeders. If you pull the female rats when heavy and let them raise the pups without the male she will last longer~ but you'll have more time between the litters.

bump

The freedom line are great modes. You can build out of pipe and plastic dish bins from sams clubs great raisers.

My self I know the money that can be made. I do not do it. I do not have the time.

Just it is there.

Also, go to your local reptile dealer ans ask them if they have any pinkies. Most do not, if they do they do not have a steady supplie.

Folks with snakes, dragons and many other animals need the feed. The smaller reptiles need the small feed. The full grown mice are not in such a shortage, yet they are easy to get rid of 100-10000 in a single phone call for many folks.

I used to raise my own rodents, but don't have near the time since my daughter was born...I can't find a decent rodent supplier to save my life...Unfortunately, most of my snakes prefer live prey. I may have to start a small colony again in order to keep the weight on my snakes.

It has been my experience that rats work better in colonies than mice and do not stink as bad.

Have a question. How do you make the cages stay on the racks? I know it's a dumb question. I checked the M.I.C.E. website and like their set ups and the fact that they also have vaccum systems that vaccum away the stinky air and refresh the air. Pricey though. I was thinking of a PVC assembled version. How do you put together the tubs to prevent the mice from climbing out?

You make tracks out of thin pieces of wood so that the tubs slide in and out like drawers. You only leave about 1/8 inch of space between the top of the tub and the bottom of the wire covered shelf.

yep~ pretty much/ Tighter for mice~ you can have a bit of wiggle room with rats though. I built mine out of wood~ first built the trays to go over the tops of the tubs I chose.Then put in a bar for the tub to slide on~ would have been better if I had left about 3inches in front so the tub could drop at the end of the slide out~ with them all the way to the end the way I have them they don't drop out from under the water spigots and I have to reposition the spigots every time I pull the tubs to clean.
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/imag...RackStruc4.jpg
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/imag...RackStruc2.jpg

Then fasten the trays that hold the tubs onto ~ and another 2x4 diagonally on the back for stability
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/imag...RatRack(1).jpg
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/imag...RackStruc1.jpg

Put wheels on it~ wheels are very helpful to clean under, around, and to catch escapees (a shop vac is great at catching escapee's too) put a board across the top of every other one to hold the water resevior (agselect.com will sell you the parts you need~ variflow are very sturdy spigots)
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/imag...RackStruc8.jpg

You can make larger ones like mine out of cement mixing tubs
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/imag...ats4-24-06.jpg

Or smaller ones like this one I had built originally for mice out of cat litter pans
http://www.thereddragonsden.com/imag...use%20rack.jpg

I've kept a small group of rats and mice; as with anything there can be money in it or you can lose money. Depends on the market and how you work it.

Is there a strain of rats that are well-known for having a high number of babies like the Swiss Webster is for mice?