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  #21  
Old 05/06/07, 03:39 PM
moonwolf's Avatar  
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 7,425
Here's a picture of the garden after the second year I started it on a previously quack grass sod clay laden soil. The harvest was bountiful for squash, corn, melons, cukes, brassicas, leafy greens, etc. This is in zone 3, which has about a 100 day vegetable frost free growing season.

Gardening in clay soil ... HELP! - Homesteading Questions

Gardening in clay soil ... HELP! - Homesteading Questions

Gardening in clay soil ... HELP! - Homesteading Questions

Basically, I set out in steps to get the soil amended and encouraged to grow so well.

First, I covered it over in the previous early fall with a thick canvas and plastic layer to kill the growth underneath. In spring, where I didn't have areas covered, and to extend the size of the garden I spread out clear plastic to solarize the growth underneath.
After a few weeks, the plastic was removed and the area tilled.
Then, buckwheat was broadcast for a green manure.
After about 8 to 12 inches of the buckwheat growth, I tilled that into the soil.
Then raised beds were raked up where everything but squash was growing.

The squash areas were made by dumping several buckets of rotted manure/compost into the holes dug where the squash was to be planted. The areas around that were tilled until the squash spread out and kept the shade to keep weeds from growing.

The corn was tilled between the rows and the areas where corn was planted was raised up by the hiller, furrower attachment on the tiller as it was being tilled. This also was used to cultivate until the corn was tall enough to easier weed by hand.

Basically the 'usable' soil of clay/loam which was aided by both tilling after the plastic and green manure plowdown (buckwheat in this case), which was the soil raised in beds that was amended by the green manure. We even grew carrots by the second year as the soil was worked to loosen it more with fall rye planting that was tilled in spring and more buckwheat or oats as till in green manure. Chicken and duck manure from the pens also supplemented the soil along with any and all compost that could be made.

Clay can be problematic when it's a prolonged wet season and is hard on roots packed tighter to get nutrueints once that dries out too. When there are prolonged dry spells, it pays to water the right amount....which on average should be the equivalent of 1" rainfall per week.

Mulch
Green Manure plowdown (or 'till in')
Compost
Raised beds

all the above do most to benefit poor soils, including tough clay.
The Rocks ...we have plenty of them. They are removed from the garden into a convenient pile area which attracts garter snakes, toads and such to help pest insect control. But, don't get the rock piles too big that they might attract woodchucks or skunks.
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Last edited by moonwolf; 05/06/07 at 03:58 PM.
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  #22  
Old 05/06/07, 09:53 PM
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Allentown, NY
Posts: 224
I just rototill and plant in whats here. Sawdust or shavings will cool off the soil, depending where you live that might be a bad idea. Plants will grow out of rocks.
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  #23  
Old 05/06/07, 10:55 PM
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: north central wv
Posts: 2,321
For red clay in NC when I was younger we found an old sawdust pile and really loaded the garden spot with it. It helped make the soil softer and my dad would tell people that the melons were ruined because the vines grew so fast it wore the bottom of them off draggin them around. Also the taters kept him awake at night moving the soil around because they grew so fast. after doing this for a few years plus adding leaves in the fall,the ground got really soft. Good luck with your garden. Sam
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  #24  
Old 05/07/07, 08:37 AM
heather's Avatar  
Join Date: May 2002
Location: western PA
Posts: 3,780
Ah, yes, welcome to the strip mined landscape of western Pennsylvania!

I have 3 words for you (or I guess it's really 4 words)

Lime
Peat Moss
Manure

Rinse, Repeat!

Clay is a constant battle here

We do raised beds

Don't work your soil too early or when it's wet - you will end up with baked clay rocks and beads in your garden

As someone already mentioned root crops are the only real problem - but I usually work one bed extra deep so that they have room to go down.
Everything else seems to grow just fine with the amendments
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  #25  
Old 05/07/07, 08:53 AM
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: sc
Posts: 2,638
We have clay, and grow stunning gardens... with the exception of root crops, which grow in some recycled 'boxes' that came from a closed down textile mill.

I refuse to be bested by the soil. We compost and compost and compost and amend the soil organically and naturally, and have for 25 years.

You do sound like you have a good plan... To that I'd add to take some soil samples to your local land grant extension office (in SC it's Clemson, and there's an office in each county) and for a tiny fee they will test your soil and get you a report that will describe what is needed exactly. It's a valuable service.

I carried my annual samples in last week, and came away with a couple of books on beekeeping and two free meat thermometers and a pamplet on their use. I'll hear from them in a couple of weeks, and my tests fee was $6. I recommend it.
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  #26  
Old 05/07/07, 11:42 AM
willow_girl's Avatar
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Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Dysfunction Junction
Posts: 14,603
Thanks everyone for the advice!!!

Judging from the moss growing amongst the scant grass on the north sides of my buildings, I'd say some lime is in order ...

I hear the extension service in Beaver County is pretty on-the-ball, and may even be able to help me find work ...

Talked to a landscaper who was working on the house next to DBF's, and was geeked to find I can finally have a redbud tree. YAY! Too cold for 'em in the part of Michigan I'm coming from ...

There was an empty flowerbed up by the trailer at my new place; I dumped in 12 bags of topsoil and plunked 60 transplanted perennials cheek-to-jowl in a 10x3 area!

Well, it's a start!

There is tons of deadwood lying around ... DBF may be able to borrow a chipper-shredder from someone he knows from work, so I'll have free mulch, or more "browns" for the compost bins.

There also are tons and tons and TONS of leaves, in various stages of decay ... I'd guess it's been several years since the property's been raked, if ever ...

So I should have quite a bit of organic matter to work with ...

If I get really desperate, I could always steal bagged lawn clippings from the curb in the subdivision where DBF lives, but I'd worry about them being contaminated with chemicals!!!

I guess if I'm patient, I should have some decent raised beds eventually, eh?!

Oh, and I also imported some Michigan earthworms amongst the roots of those 60 perennials ...
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  #27  
Old 05/07/07, 12:25 PM
Terri's Avatar
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Kansas
Posts: 12,974
When we lived in California on heavy clay, we did best with any seed that was large. Corn, cucumbers, etc. ALL yielded well!

Also, we did VERY well with tomato plants.
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  #28  
Old 05/08/07, 05:29 PM
heather's Avatar  
Join Date: May 2002
Location: western PA
Posts: 3,780
Quote:
Originally Posted by willow_girl
I hear the extension service in Beaver County is pretty on-the-ball, and may even be able to help me find work ...
yeah, they're pretty on the ball -

Last year I attended a $10 composting workshop
For the $10 fee, I got all the bottled water I could drink, a cool recycled cloth bag to put my papers in AND a composter!

I think they have a compost program where you can bring compostables to the recycling center at Brady's Run park & then they sell the compost - might be worth checking out -

maybe we'll run into each other!
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  #29  
Old 05/09/07, 10:14 AM
willow_girl's Avatar
Very Dairy
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Dysfunction Junction
Posts: 14,603
Wow, that would be great!

I'm afraid I have a "redneck composter," though -- i.e., four pallets standing on edge, wired together! LOL

Terri, glad to hear that my tomato plants should do well, as they are my favorite vegetable to grow!
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  #30  
Old 05/09/07, 11:38 AM
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,196
The last place we lived here in Kansas had the worst clay soil you could imagine. It was one big lump when you tried to till it. It will take about three years before you have really good soil. About the only thing you can do is amend the soil with everything you can find! If you live near a city you can do what I did. I drove around and collected the leaves that people had raked from their lawns. Around here they put them in those tall paper leaf bags. I threw them in the back of my truck and hauled them home! I threw the leaves on, kitchen scraps, manure, a little sand, and tilled it all under. In the fall I planted winter rye and tilled that under. Some cities have free compost and topsoil at their dump. Check yours. Usually you have to present a utility bill to show you are in that area. If not see if a family member can provide one. I am all for the freebies!! I know many will tell you to test the soil, that is probably a good idea, but for me this worked. Good luck. In a few years it will just crumble in your hands.
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