Modular Home/Pro and Cons??

"Codes:
Manufactured (i.e. HUD code) homes are built to a federal building standard, the Federal Manufactured Home Construction Safety Standards. (Factory built homes manufactured prior to the HUD code are referred to as "mobile homes") The HUD code regulates the design, construction, structural durability, transportability, fire resistance and energy efficiency of a home. It also prescribes performance standards for the mechanical, plumbing and electrical systems. Manufactured homes are built and shipped on a permanent chassis.

Modular homes are constructed to the same code as site-built homes with requirements set forth by state and local government for the specific locality. Various model building codes serve as the basis for most state code requirements. Examples include the International Residential Code (IRC), Uniform Building Code (UBC) and the National Electrical Code (NEC). Modular homes may be built on a permanent chassis or a returnable carrier system."

This is a piece of propaganda I cut from the website of one of the biggest trailer manufacturers in the country. It helps explain how they attempt to confuse to consumer into buying a trailer and thinking they ended up with a house. The BS line about trailers now being referred to as "HUD code" modulars is a classic example. The Feds had to step in an control the trailer building industry because a lot of players were building dangerous, extremely low quality, trash. Anybody who has ever worked on a thirty year old trailer know what I'm talking about, paper thin wall, cardboard sheathing and wires stretched so tight they can be played like a banjo, little to no insulation etc..... After the industry was forced to clean their act up a bit, they still produced trailers, but they decided to get away from the nasty reputation they created for the word "trailer" and "mobile home". HUD code modular is a smoke screen for the gullable. Using the word "modular" has been a blessing to sales lizards who attempt to confuse the public. The other issue in this propaganda piece is the claim that modulars can have a permanent frame. Sorry, but that dog won't hunt. What this means is that they will sell you a trailer that BARELY meets the minimum requirements for the state it will end up in, while still following HUD's rules. Sorry, it still walks, and quacks like a duck, so it must be a duck.
Like a few of us have said here and in previous threads, buying a state code modular can be a great way to end up with an affordable, high quality home, but, you need to educate yourself before you sign on the line for anything. Be careful and good luck

One other down side to a new manufactured house.
We bought a new one in 2000 and lived in it till 2006
and I was sick the entire 6 years. Last year we moved
into a house that was built in 1910 and it was like night
and day for me. I'm like a whole new person. My DD told
me recently that it was nice to have her mom back.
I don't know how many people have this trouble but it is
enough that the manufactured home people have to warn
you about the offgassing and the potenial it has to make
people sick.

No doubt, if you can afford it, put your money in a well built 'regular' house.

The thing is, a lot of people can't afford to buy a regular house. They need a place to live, and yes, people can live in tiny spaces - but why should you?

There are reasons for buying both. It depends on your situation.

If you want a home and land, why stay in an apartment or rental home and buy someone's else's property when you can have a mobile - double wide or not - and be on your land 10 years sooner than you would have been able to save the money. YOu also get the tax breaks of owning your home.

I have lived in a double wide. We rented one in a 'Senior Stockade' in Mesa, AZ. You could not tell it from a home when you were inside and it was a lot better than trying to live in an apartment building. This double wide was over 20 years old. I do think they seem to last better in the desert. I don't know if that is the manufacturer or the climate.

My son and his wife have a double wide over 2,000 square foot, it has dry wall rather than panelling, jacuzzi tub, 3 bathrooms, 2 fireplaces, den, dining room, 4 bedrooms & 'bonus room'.

It will be paid for in 10 years. He could have kept renting from someone else for that ten years, and no the double wide will not be worth what he paid for it. He has had a home for that time - a home that was his, gotten the tax benefits of a homeowner, and it can be sold for enough to start on a built home if that is what he wants.The payments on my son's is less than any rent he has ever paid. His kids are living in their own home and that means a lot to them.


Will it appreciate as if it was a regular house of that size - no. But they couldn't afford a regular house of that size. I am not sure how the wiring is, but they have had no problems in 3 years and it was a repo when they bought it - so I think there are very good reasons for buying them.

Sometimes, it is a matter of paying for a landlord's property - or your own.

If a trailer rumbles and shakes, it isn't tied down properly - there are things to do to fix that - and we live here in TExas - tornado country.

As for shoddy work, here in Texas, most houses are built by illegals. Some had skills to begin with, some learned, some didn't. Some of the work is unreal.

They are doing the electrical work, the plumbing - all under the umbrella of a licensed company - but they do it with no supervision, etc.

So, I would say, there are good reasons for doing both. It depends on what your needs are and what your finances are.

Sandhills, new homes do that to people. It is from glue, particle board, panelling, etc.

I seem to remember something about either a new building or new carpeting at the OSHA headquarters making people sick.

I like older homes, we have owned older homes for 40 years. We have to put up with 100 year old dust sometimes, but all in all - I like them.

Steve I can take you to dozens of homes in my neigborhood that you would be completely unable to identify as stick built or modular, inside or out. I can take you to thousands of affordable, well built, appreciating homes in the Northeast that were stick built in regional factories. I can take you to suburbs of Washington DC and NYC where folks are living in very large, upscale million dollar homes that were stick built in factories. There is nothing to even suggest that any of these homes, or hundreds of thousands of homes like them, are anything but an excellent investment. My home was $82K in 2000, now it will bring three times that. The fact is, every appraisal done from preconstuction to refinancing has not be affected by where it was built. I have gained over $25K a year in appreciate in this market. The house is located in a newer development with a mix of homes. In the fifteen years since the first one was built here, there has never been an issue with resale. If that's your definition of an "unwise lifestyle investment", well I guess I'm just an idiot. A fairly financially comfortable idiot, but a real moron. Like many here it seems that you don't understand the difference between a mobile home and a quality house that was stick built off site. Too bad, there is a lot of money to be saved, and made by those that figure it out.

i think a lot of people confuse modular with manufactured being a retired plumber i have worked on a lot of mod.and so have a lot of friends that are electricians now a manufactured home is nothing more then a trailer

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We bought a double wide. I really like most of it. We have 1400 square feet, three bedrooms, a study, and two bathrooms.

While the overall construction is very sound and good, and the house is extremely well insulated, costs were cut in other areas. The bathroom sinks are plastic and the cabinets are thinwall stuff. They look ok - but I'd like to replace some of the cabinetry and countertops, though they do a sufficient job anyway.

I love the space, and the storage space in this home. I have a huge walkin closet in the master bedroom and a pantry in the kitchen.

This house stays warm when it's cold outside - we've had temps down to 14 degrees and the coldest it's been inside is 58 without the furnace running. It's very quiet inside, one doesn't hear outside noises unless they are truly loud, another indication the house is well insulated. I have double paned windows with storm windows over that.

The house is not the type with sheetrocked walls, but paneled with the strips covering the joints. Not my favorite look, but it's well done and eventually you stop noticing that sort of thing.

The house does NOT move during heavy winds at all, and you can just barely hear when it's raining. The pipes haven't frozen up because they are well insulated underneath, DH looked.

My electric bill is MUCH lower than my parent's stick built brick home.

All in all, while I would have preferred a site built home, the fact is that THIS home on the acreage was a home we could afford to pay cash for. No debt. It was inspected before we purchased it and there were no structural, electrical, plumbing, or appliance issues. It is eight years old.

One other thing I'm going to change.. the kitchen cabinets look really nice, but they are not painted. The "wood" has been covered by a molded white plastic that is slowly coming unglued. I will be removing that plastic and actually painting the cabinets with an oil base paint that will look just as nice.

There is no difference between the interior doors in this house and in the stick built house that we had built. Well, yes, there is. These doors are nicer.

I fully expect that this house will last us until we both pass away, unless there is some unforeseen incident i.e. tornado or fire etc. We are both in our early 50's.

I honestly love this home. But like anything else you love, you are aware of it's foibles But we were able to purchase this place which had coastal pasture already, plus a few acres that are wooded (a total of 12.65 acres), plus the home that I've talked about, plus the fact that the well and septic are already here, and the place was fenced with GOOD fences, plus a pipe fenced corral and small barn, plus a cedar greenhouse and a shed we converted into a chicken house, for under $90,000. We are out in the country and our neighbors are at least far enough away that we can't see them, though we may hear them from time to time.

It's a good place to be

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I absolutely adore modular and mobile homes... because I get to make repairs on them... I do part time handyman work, and the cumulative repairs on a single home can be thousands over a few years, and for just minor stuff! I've gotten to where I'll tell homeowners that I can replace all the plumbing in their home for a set price...most balk...understandably, till I make three or four calls, and the total is the same as the total overhaul...

You get what you pay for.

If you look around a bit, you're apt to find free mobile homes, to be hauled off. I've had three offered to me in the last five years...I declined, because I couldn't get one across my cattleguard. I'd much rather fix up a wreck and own it outright than buy a new one, still have to fix it continually, and owe my soul to the bankers...

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Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival. W. Edwards Deming

By the above definition I have a trailer (non removable frame) It's a singlewide, 56' long. Originally built about 1976 if I remember correctly. Sometime in the past a pitched roof was added and the outside wrapped in foam and vinyl. Then a 12'x16' addition was added on. If it wasn't so long and skinny it would look just like a house from the outside. Inside is a mix of panelling and drywall.

Quality wise it's hard to describe. Somethings are perfectly fine with zero issues. Other things are showing their age. The 30 year old bathroom is going to be gutted to the studs to repair water damage and just replace everything this summer. The electrical appears to have been completely sometime in the past. The furnace was ditched in favor of baseboards sometime in the last decade or so.

The reason I bought a trailer was simple. It made sense moneywise. The cheapest regular house in the worst neighbourhood on a pastage sized lot was around $150,000 when I was buying. My house with 1/2 acre in a nice location with a great view of the ocean backing onto a massive forest was $125,000. The tax assements tell me the land is worth 4/5ths of that price. In the meantime I have a nice place to live and I'm not throwing money into someone elses pocket.

My only wish is it was a double wide. then I'd have enough space to keep the wife happy when we have kids.

Read the post again. An investment in lifestyle and a financial investment are not the same thing. That's my point.

While I will not specifically dispute your assertions (esp. your guess that you're "an idiot"), let me say that for the past 24 years, I have been an appraiser and real estate consultant, also teaching real estate appraisal courses at post graduate level. I've appraised reviewed, and consulted with lenders and federal agencies in regard to all types of housing including manufactured homes, modulars and stick-built homes.

Unless the cost to build modular homes has increased "over $25K a year" in your market (apples to apples), there is no way that the structure itself appreciates that much. Simply not possible no matter what the local market trends since buyers will always pay for more for a new home than a used home, other factors being equal. As a general rule, all improvements depreciate gradually, as land values appreciate unless you are in a declining neighborhood. This is offset somewhat of course, by the ever-increasing costs of construction. Modulars and manufactured structures depreciate faster than stick-built, and cheap construction depreciates faster than high quality construction. And location is paramount to all of the above.

End of lesson. Carry on.

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tiogacountry: Amen, you have said it all. I don't think people understand the difference between stick-built, modular, mobile and trailer. In my experience, stick-built and modular are similar and then mobile and trailer are similar to each other. But, trailer and modular are two different worlds and really cannot be compared. When we went shopping, we could not do the mobile/trailer on our 168 acre farm. It didn't seem correct. Certainly, stick-built would have been optimal but we didn't have two years to be built so we went with modular. It so happens that the cape cod style modular we picked out was similar to the old farm house that we had to have burned down (beyond repair). The neighbors and two previous owners of our farm are so pleased that we went with this style. By the way, it is not tiny and we could have had larger (total when upstairs is completed: 1950 sf). Photo has been posted in modular vs stick-built thread.

First Steve it is necessary to admit to yourself that you have a serious bias against any type of manufacturered housing. Anybody who is in the business and would describe a modular product as indicative of ones "lifestyle" clearly does not approach the situation with an open mind. If you are a really sharp appraiser,noticed the slightly wider door jambs on the "marriage wall" of my home, and gave careful attention to the fact that the floor system is build a little stronger than normal, you would indeed be able to clearly state that my home was built in a factory. If that denotes some category of "lifestyle" in your mind, I guess you think a little differently than most. As for the remainder of the structure including mechanicals and finishes it rated as a "standard construction" in appraisals, as opposed to "Economy" or "custom". This is due to a fact that many here seem to struggle with. There is no difference between a true "state code" modular or a stick house, same house, same materials. The fact that the first 80% of the construction took place elsewhere is the difference.
Your comments about appreciation are a little questionable. Appreciation is not something that is viewed in terms of the physical structures being a seperate entity from the property. Like ALL properties in the immediate area, this one has enjoyed a 100% appreciation in the last six years. I also gained additional value by general contracting this modular and completing it myself. This along with a few modest additions, resulted in an additional $80K in value. From reading the comments of other folks in your position, in some areas of the country (such as Texas and the southern Plains,) it is evident that some regions still are quite backwards in their thinking about anything that isn't built on site. It's unfortunate for folks of modest means that this type of thinking continues. The good part for many of us in a lot of this country is that everything you claim in your first post is dead wrong. A state code modular is far from a bad investment and will appreciate at the same rate as any other well built properly maintained home in the area. Steve, nothing personal, but you expert opinion on the subject is exactly the same thing I heard from bankers and builders here twenty five years ago, and I believed every thing they said. Not only have they been proven to be dead wrong, but the state code modular business has nearly eliminated the "starter home" to mid-sized stick built market in many areas of this state and in a lot of rural areas in all the Mid-Atlantic and New England states. Where I live, if you want a modest ranch or cape you have a state code modular built. In the final anaylsis it doesn't make sense to spend tens of thousands of dollars more for a site built house of equal or lesser quality.

Queen Bee - if they are considering a mobile/modular home, have them check out www.gilesindustries.com and find a dealer close by to talk with. We found them to be WAY less expensive than any other company dealer we visited, and the homes came standard with many things that everyone else charged extra for (2X6 wall studs, skirting, porcelin sinks/tubs/toilets, etc. all included in the final price - and for less than the other companies we checked.) They are out of TN and service the southeast. We had a very good experience with them.

Penny

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I know nothing about the way modular homes are built. There is only one I know for sure is a modular.

It was pointed out to me when we moved here over 30 years ago. Today, it looks just as nice as it did 30 years ago, and I feel like it has appreciated right along iwth its neighborhood.

When one speaks of 'lifestyle' - I'm not exactly sure what that means.

Again, please go back and READ THE POST. I never said that living in a modular is "indicative of one's lifestyle". I said it is an "investment in lifestyle". Big difference. Quite simply, all housing decisions are not based upon economics and the expectations of appreciation, or even getting your money back. For example: I bought a house back in 1981, and in 1985 we converted the garage into living space. It cost me about $15,000 to do this, and I knew even then as an appraiser, that I would not get my money out of it. But, we needed the living space and would have the enjoyment out of our new "den". It was not a financial decision, it was an "investment in lifestyle". We got a lot of use out of that new room, even though it didn't necessarily make financial sense as it added probably only $5,000 to the value of the home. Same thing with a swimming pool. We paid $27,000 for ours, but it probably adds $10,000-12,000 to the value of the home. An investment in lifestyle.

And no, I'm not prejudiced at all towards modular homes. They offer a lot for the money, and the newer high quality "off-chasis" modulars are not much different than stick-built. It is the MARKET that is generally prejudiced against modular homes. While this has changed somewhat in the last 5 or 6 years in most areas of the county, studies have shown that in nearly every all markets, modulars of ALL kinds tend to go down (depreciate) faster than site-built homes, as long as you are comparing similar quality products. And yes, houses and lots do appreciate separately, whether you know it or not. Ask any appraiser what the "cost approach" is about. All structures, once they are built, start to depreciate. This is not just a theory, it's fact. Backed up by market data, which is what we rely on. This something that you, and most other people who have only passing knowledge on real estate valuation, find difficult to grasp.

Since you are obviously an expert on the valuation of real estate: Do you know the difference between on-chassis and off-chassis modular construction? Do you know how Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, and FHA treat different types of modulars? Are you aware of federal lending and appraisal guidelines that impact the appraisal and lending towards modular homes? Are you aware of what encompasses functional obsolescence? How about economic obsolescence? How would the market treat your home - physical age/life method or economic age/life method? Can you compare modular homes to site-built homes when underwriting a loan to Freddie Mac or FIRREA guidelines? Do houses in your area actually increase in value more than the rate of inflation and the rate of rising building costs or less?

Since you seem to know everything there is to know about modular homes and your local real estate market, maybe you can get people to pay you for your knowledge too. And if you ever apply for a loan on your home, at least you won't need to get an appraisal .... all the lender has to do is ask you, right?

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Society has gotten to the point where everybody has a right, but nobody has a responsibility.

it says in your profile real estate consultant
i wonder
everyone knows pools dont add face value to a home
and talking about off chasis has nothing to do with a modular home

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Don't complain, just do it

We purchased a new modular home in 2000. We paid $79,900 for 1/4+ of an acre, the home, and all associated construction (crawl space, plumbing and electrical connection, etc.) The home was inspected by the township and the mortgage company without problem. We added a shed (10' x 10') and some minimal landscaping and it was appraised in 2005 at $139,900.

There is no visible evidence that it was moved in on wheels, underneath there are 4 large steel beams that run the length of the home supporting the joists. The joists are all filled with insulation and sealed underneath. I have drilled through to install computer network, telephone, and cable TV and it is about 16" from carpet to bottom barrier. Our pipes and ducts run in that area. The home is built on a concrete block crawl space.

We added central air (home came with plenum space for it but was not installed), changed a few light fixtures (added stained glass light and modern fixture in living room), and installed some designer faucets (DW wanted a white and brass kitchen faucet and then wanted both bathrooms to match). Electrically, the only repair has been one outlet to replace. Adding the A/C circuit was easy as Home Depot had the circuit breaker and we were able to fish the wire through conduit in the wall installed during manufacture.

Our home came with the appliances including the TV and a built in surround sound system (speakers in the cathedral ceiling). The only appliances that have broken were the dishwasher (needed a new pump) and the microwave. We replaced the stove just due to DW's design changes -- we went from white appliances to black with stainless fronts.

We have 2 x 6 exterior walls filled with insulation while many of our friends who live in the area have homes built in developments with 2 x 4's. Most of the people with the development homes seem to always have something needing to be fixed.

We are currently replacing the interior doors (installing solid panel doors to replace wood finish hollow core doors scratched by the dogs), installing new storm doors (removing doors with upper and lower glass and installing Pella insulated doors). We have prefinished sheetrock but may paint the home in the near future.

Before we bought this home we lived in a row house built in 1927. Some of the lumber used in it looked like someone broke it over their knee and nailed it in place. Everything was substandard and had to be replaced or updated. DH had upper respiratory infections several times a year which stopped once we moved out. DW was always cold as the walls were uninsulated and had no room to add insulation (plaster on brick).

We are much happier and have a better investment in our modular home than we did in our stick built home. Just as a note we lived in an old mobile home back in 1981-82 and even sold that used mobile home for a profit when we moved out.

Just like you can't put all stick built homes into one category the same goes for modulars and even mobiles. Some of each can be good and some of each can be junk. Each individual has to decide what they can afford and what will be the best choice for their families. I would sooner live in a mobile home than rent if the mobile was on my own land. I have found my modular to be better constructed than friends houses that I do work on.

Ken in Glassboro, NJ

On-chasis, sometimes called on-frame or frame-on, means a modular home that has been built on metal skids or I-beams, and the I-beams remain with the home so that the modular components can be moved easily. Off-chasis or off-frame or frame-off, means that the I-beams are only used to transport the components, then the wooden frame is attached directly to the permanent foundation on site. The former requires a HUD tag, the latter does not. Both are considered to be "modular homes".

Of course lots of people know that pools do not add face value. I was using it as an illustration of an investment in lifestyle, not to teach anything to you out there that obviously know everything about real estate values.

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Society has gotten to the point where everybody has a right, but nobody has a responsibility.

I believe everything you have said.

I wonder what land values have done in between 2000 and 2005 in your neighborhood, and I also wonder about the cost of modular homes then vs. today. Remember, the appraised value is partially based upon the value of the land as if vacant, plus the replacement cost of the improvements less depreciation from all causes (cost approach). Only the sales comparison approach compares your property to similar homes in the area which have recently sold.

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Society has gotten to the point where everybody has a right, but nobody has a responsibility.

Morrows, why does your house have steel beams? Mine does not.

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