living over your barn?

I saw stuff on the net about old country houses in Hungry. They were built with the barns to keep animals warm and let them be cared for in winter without going outside in the snow. Do a search and see what you find. My daughter has always wanted to live in a loft above her horses. There is a house built above stables on highway 241 south of Alachua, Florida. It is very pretty.

The neighbor accross the road did that. Stalls on the bottom, home in the loft. It was so hard for them to heat that they've moved in with MIL for the winter. They also have issues with smells & noise. More insulation in the floors may fix some of that though. Just something to consider.

HTH,
Mike

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"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke

Keeping it together with prayer and the "Handyman's secret weapon" - duct tape!

Smell and heat issues are important to consider -
we put a high priority on that and a good part of our budget addressed it, so
our indoor air quality is better than 95% of homes in the US -
we are clean AND green.

How you manage your animals has also has an impact. If you're going to share a roof with animals, you want to make sure you never allow the space to become crowded. Part of our plan was to choose from the hardiest breeds that spend most of the time outdoors, even in winter.

The floorplan was arranged to put as many transitional spaces between us the critters as possible. Laundry room opens to milk room, to breezeway to feed room to rabbitry and then way on the end are open stalls. The chickens are way far off to the side, through a loafing shed, woodshed, and then the chicken coop.
The whole plan is to eventually wrap around the gardens, forming a protected courtyard.




We are living on the ground floor most of the time, but set up the hayloft to be
seasonal space, and we won't even attempt to heat it in winter.
(The soaring ceilings in the loft are wonderful when you want the feeling of expansiveness, but we find that the warm, cozy spaces are where we prefer to be most times anyway.)

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Hut on the Hill Farm
http://www.hutonthehill.org

properly designed heating and smells would not be an issue .
vapor barriers and insulation can take care of that. I would suggest seperate entrances.

Well we would build a fairly good-sized barn (at LEAST 4 stalls with a center aisle and somewhere in there would be tack storage). The idea of combining the two spaces is to save on foundations, wells, roof, etc. You get two buildings with extra height (extra view) in much less combined cost. The lower barn level, of course, would be built fairly tall (probably min. 10' and MAYBE shooting for 12') to allow for good air circulation and safe horse living (avoiding injury from rearing).

I don't think it would be difficult to find a buyer if it were offered to sell, just based on the fact that it's a house on top of a barn. If I saw that sort of issue when marketed, I would basically market it as if the barn were a garage or shop, as is done commonly here on "drive-under ranches" or "raised ranches". We ALWAYS have an exit strategy when we buy/build something just in case the market tips or we get into trouble along the line and have to sell so that is valid advice, Bruce.

About the noise of flushing the toilet, that really hasn't ever been a big deal in the houses in which I've lived (and built). Wonder why? Of course the horses would just have to get used to those sorts of sounds. But this raises another point - my plumbing would presumably have to go through the lower level to get into the ground to hook up to the septic & well water line... To get there it would have to be heated all the way... I guess I could run a heated chase in one wall or another but it would take some planning as I would NOT want to heat the whole barn... Hmmm, maybe that's where the tack room goes... I always seem to need hot & cold water near the barn anyway these days.

We've lived in two houses that had a drive-in garage under the house. Both houses were very similar - basically the garage, 1 bathroom, a storage room, and two bedrooms were on the same level, the stairs headed up with the main entry at split level (barf), and the rest of the living area (kitchen, great room, 1.5 baths, and master bedroom) were on the 2nd level. We never had any trouble with smells coming into the house - sounds like a ventilation & firewall issue...?

Lisa - GREAT tips as always - thank you, especially for the insurer contacts! We're obviously in the "dream" stage right now... But we do have a lovely 10-acre lot that is sitting empty at the top of the hill... We're always thinking - I'd like to have a WAY smaller mortgage...

Denvergirlie-this would likely be the only house on-site but the site is large enough that if someone wanted to build a second house they could (10 acres). Around this neighborhood, small houses/cabins are the norm. Big houses tend to lose a lot of value per sf... Again, this goes back to Bruce's comment and that I would ALWAYS keep expenditures below resale value or wouldn't do it. Of course that can change in just a few months as the market moves, but the bigger the margin you can keep between the two, the better. Building it ourselves would help this A LOT.

Where we are now is already non-conformist - (comparatively) lots of cleared land and an off-grid house. The market is slowly coming around on this, though... It took us a while to sell our last place because it had almost 50 acres, even though it was already subdivided into 5 separate lots! The place eventually did sell but we had to be very patient and sell to separate buyers. The agents were all wrong - they wanted to lower our price to get it to sell fast and when we did people kept asking - what's wrong with it? We finally RAISED the price back up and sold it but lost a lot in commissions.

Cabin Fever - I'm allergic to a lot of that stuff but am undergoing immunotherapy and my allergies are well-controlled (I think) with the Rxs I have now while I wait for the shots to kick in.

Hay storage is a valid concern. I have ALWAYS loved the old style farmhouse - HUGE barn on lower level, living quarters on top at one end, hay loft all the rest of the top. I boarded in one once in Juneau and loved it. When it sold in foreclosure the buyer converted the barn to equipment/vehicle storage, moved into the living quarters, and who knows what he did with the rest of the loft. It was so neat to be able to have all that storage with winches and lifts to get the hay up there easily from the back of your vehicle, go upstairs, set out hay, drop it down through the chute at feeding times, etc. I loved that place and was sad I didn't get to spend much time there.

We would probably store our hay in separate container vans outside, nearby the house/barn or adjacent thereto. They're ugly so it would have to be sided or at least painted... Maybe I could hide it somewhere near the turn-outs and build a lean-to off one side so that the horses in turn-out always have free-choice shelter... Would also probably link the turn-out to the barn area so I have the option of stalling a horse "inside" but still letting them outdoors... Probably would accomplish this with lots of gates as we did at our last place... Easy to open a gate and let the horses move between the areas vs. having to hand walk them back and forth too often (as we do daily now).

minnikin1 - our horses already live most of their time outdoors (yep, even in Alaska) and we have never boarded at a heated barn (although I boarded at a place once that had a heated arena that they never heated! lol). Not particularly healthy... But maybe I would have one stall that I COULD heat for emergencies...

PyroDon - absolutely would have separate entrances - would probably need this for resale value at least.

Manure storage is really the only thing I would have to really keep up on - keep it far away and downwind of the house. Of course we already do that here.

THANK YOU ALL! Any other suggestions/comments welcome.

Hi, I like your name, hoofinitnorth,
My daughter lives in Anchorage AK. She tried to get me to move there over the years, no success.
Anyway, yes, I did live over a Dairy barn, a real working dairy, and I worked hard there milking cows, cleaning, etc. The Apartment over the barn was well built and insulated really good. No kind of odors or smells came up to the apt. So that is something that definitely has to be considered. That was long ago, so insurance has changed and skyrocketed in price I am sure. But I thought it was a cool idea. Saves space and handy to work. I hope it works out for you.
--Patsy

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Life is a perpetual putting together of broken bits and pieces..and counting our blessings

I have sure thought about a large prefab metal building with living quarters in it . No painting or roof to replace , very durable and with a mezanine or second floor and you would have lots of room . I have toyed with this idea . You could make a living out of it too as a shop of some sort .

I dont know about a barn with livestock because of the smell , I guess it all depends what you have in it . Could possibly work .

I think it would be the cheapest way to go for a homestead house . I am single and it would serve me perfect , now to get a wife or girlfriend to live there might be a task . Now that I think about it , my ex'es got my houses anyway ..... maybe they would be less inclined to take a barn from me .

As far as resale , there is always someone who has the same needs as yourself and would be interested ... it would just take time to find that buyer though .

Stables with apartments rent quickly here in GA., and I could have sold my place twice in the last year - no shortage of horse people looking to save a few dollars by combining the house and the barn. I don't have a problem with smells either, I clean stalls twice daily if the horse is inside and I have a double wall between the house side and the horse side that is insulated. In the summer I have an exhaust fan that pulls air from the house through the barn to the outside so no smells there (be sure to orient said fan in the correct direction to avoid pulling any smells inside the house).

Lots of people cannot afford both a house and a separate stable/barn/shop. I just combined the best of both and am still working on it. My insurance is not as high as some people's because the structure is block and all flammables including hay are stored outside the barn. Hay is in a hay shed, gas/oil are in the outbuilding up the hill away from the house. I have a woodstove and cookstove with no ins. problems. I do have smoke detectors in both house and barn, and fire extinguishers (small type) in both.

Never have had a problem, although the banks can't wrap their wee minds around such a structure for building (the house must be worth more than the land or they will not finance here) and my land is worth more than the house because I don't NEED a 4 bedroom house with 2.5 baths. I only need two bedrooms, so that is what I have. But the bank wanted me to build a 300,000 house because the house must be worth at least as much as the land and I refused to do that. So I built using my money and am still working on the house doing finish work. When the weather gets warmer I will finish the stucco on the outside and start laying the rock around the bottom 1/3 of the building. One of the these days I will be finished. But I have not had any shortage of people asking about buying the place as they see it as a very liveable arrangement and have noted that the horse stalls could be redone to make that end a 2 car garage or a shop.

Build what SUITS you and worry about selling later - unless you are building to resell and then see what is selling in your area. In many places, people wouldn't want land anyway, they prefer the 1/2 acre lot with tons of neighbors - lol.

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Be yourself - no one can tell you that you're doing it wrong!

There are realtors that specialize in these types of properties and they aren't suffering from sagging sales. There are two in GA. that I know of, and always have barn/apartments and stables/homes for sale. Depending on the area, the prices are right in line with regular homes and are usually sold fairly quickly (at least they disappear from the magazine within a couple of months unless they need a LOT of work or are overpriced).

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Be yourself - no one can tell you that you're doing it wrong!

Well if you ever have a fire then you lose EVERYTHING.

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-Paul

"If women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy." -Red Green

That true, you would lose it all perhaps in a fire - I lost everything in a tornado and had a separate house and stable..so guess one can lose everything even if you do have separate buildings.

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Be yourself - no one can tell you that you're doing it wrong!

The rural custom of connected house and barn is certainly alive and well all over Europe, especially with sheep farmers in Spain and Italy. Many of these old stone and timber structures appeared to have been in constant use for many generations with heat from sheltered livestock in winter being captured for warming the living quarters...Glen

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The more a man travels, acquires wisdom and learns about life, the more likely he is to marry a Country Girl.

My house barn is all on one floor. I suppose one could install a lift for a wheelchair and also would need to make door modifications and other modifications just as in a normal 2 story house. My doorways are all 4 feet wide but I think standard doorways are smaller, so those would likely need adjusting. Also one could do ramps but that would likely be harder unless one had a motorized wheelchair.

__________________
Be yourself - no one can tell you that you're doing it wrong!

Have you looked at the site Barn Plans? They have someone who built a barn house that included a garage/workshop area, you may get some ideas from them.

Someone else built a barn shaped garage/workshop and had problems trying to get a phone line installed... the phone company told them they don't install phones in barns. LOL. So they called them up again and requested a phone line in their workshop and it was done!

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“You may choose to look the other way but you can never say again that you did not know.”

cozyhollow-gal - hello and thanks! For many, Alaska is a nice place to visit but not so nice to live year 'round.

desertrat - 1 - not sure about metal buildings. I've seen many done poorly and only a few done right and they cost a FORTUNE. It isn't something I could do on my own either so that is more $$ for a contractor to erect it. Fire safety is an issue with them, especially for a barn, ventilation & cold are not so great if you don't have separate systems for that, the sharp edges are something that concern me with the high winds we get here and the 2 destructo-bots that currently grace my presence, the metal also tends to look really bad after a year of snowfall unless you upgrade to very thick metal siding that can withstand the weight & pressure of snow and then sliding off the roof to create berms and problems along the sides of the buildings (that's most common up here), also concerned about solar gain in summer... But you have given me a few ideas...

sidepasser - we ALWAYS build for resale, even if we don't plan to sell or move - it is just smart not to over-/under-build in case you HAVE to get out. The trouble up here is not a supply of buyers, it is a supply of qualified buyers that can afford places like these and pay what they're worth. Heck, pouncer can tell you how awfully cheap the market is in recognizing the value of shops/large garages!!

Ford8N - that is the same wherever you live, really. That's where good planning, design, maintenance, and insurance come in hand. {knock wood}

rose2005 - ooh good thought! I already have health issues that limit my mobility. However, we currently live in a 2-story house and love it (even though it sometimes takes me a long time to get up them, the stairs are GOOD for me). I imagine we could put in an external lift if we had to... Those really aren't hard to do and they are "acceptable" on a barn.

sidepasser - we overbuilt all our doorways in our current house too - all hallways and doorWAYS are at least 4' wide but the other entries that actually have doors on them into some rooms are smaller (limitations of building from an existing shell). Even at 3' wide we were told they were "custom" or "oversized" doors.

WildernesFamily - yep, been to that site but thanks for the reminder! The phone is no more a problem for a barn vs. a house. It is always difficult to get the local phone company to do their job in a timely, affordable fashion!

Here's a crazy thought ....

Suppose you have an enormous barn. No walls - just a roof and a lot of poles holding it up - but really, really huge. Enough space to to store years worth of hay for many animals. Let's say we talking about something 50 feet tall and 150 feet square.

Then, suppose that you had a wood floor on one side for stacking hay. Strong! And then you had a wood floor about ten feet above that for stacking more hay.

Now suppose that you are far enough within the barn that you aren't going to get wet.

It might be fun to build walls with straw bales as if they were legos! You could even make some windows like legos! You could start small, within the barn, and have a comfortable little living space. One day, you could decide to add a bedroom - it would take just a few hours to re-arrange the legos, wouldn't it?

If you route your electricl stuff and plumbing stuff with the structural poles of the barn, you could create stuff that is good with that and, thus, semi-protable. Oh sure, you could make a permanent kitchen and bathroom - but if you wanted to, you could make that sort of thing semi-portable. Either could be on a low platform on wheels. You bolt it to the structure in a few key places and connect to the water, electric and "sewer" at the post. A few months or years later you can "remodel" in a few hours! Start off with a small kitchen. End up with a huge kitchen. Then back to something small?

Just an idea.

In the middle east and certainly in the "Little Town of Bethlehem," living above one's manger is the custom -- the norm. The animals in the manger keep the house upstairs warm during the chilly nights.

Zoning laws and Building Codes are not designed to protect us from poor housing. They are designed to protect home builders, banks and developers.

I've always thought that would be great to have your house/garage/ and barn all in one building. If you get 3 feet of snow, or freezing rain that turns into ice, or just a really cold day, no more going "out" into the elements to feed and water the animals.

Of course, the downside is if something tragic happens (like a fire) you lose EVERTHING. Living upstairs in a loft could have it's problems though as pointed out if you become disabled in some way - temporary or perminent. (Of course if you had unlimited funds an elevator would take care of that!)

I don't really know if you would have to worry about resale value because even if people don't want animals, they would tons of storage. (Heck, they could turn the downstairs barn into a storage locker and make money.)

Noise and smell certainly wouldn't bother me any - well unless you were living over 200 pigs or something!

But I live on land that has been in the family for years, so the house, barn, and other animal buildings are all seperate - but it's still nice to dream about 1 building containing everything. I would think building costs would be lower since everything is under one roof and in one building though.

But hey, I've heard of people "remodeling" an old barn and turning it into a house so it anything is doable!

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Michael W. Smith in North-West Pennsylvania

"Everything happens for a reason."

Paul Wheaton - I like the way you think! Wouldn't be very warm up here though and the initial structure would break teh bank!

cowboyracer43 - no codes or covenants on the land we own now - only basic life safety codes and just banks & mortgages & resale to consider

Michael W. Smith - Not too worried about braving the elements - just something that has to be done daily as the animals would rarely be confined to the stalls.

One can add a safe manual lift with a flat platform with rails & gate and a system of pulleys. Only in wind would it really be a problem but securing it to run on rails up and down would make it safer. Would probably want something like this for the barn in the future anyway - in my DREAM barn/house, I would plan to have a large overhead door installed over the main entrance/drive-through aisle... *sigh*

Our last place sold as I described to a horsey couple. When they resold it after tragedy in the family, a dog breeder/trainer bought it, converted all the fence to chain link (what a shame!) and then put dogs in the barns. The place had one large barn with room for 6 stalls and a drive-in hay by, a smaller 2-stall barn with hay/storage area, and 2 large 24' x 12' lean-tos that could be easily converted to 2-stall barns. There were also lots of fenced areas and tons more undeveloped, forested land. Wonder if that place will ever be affordable to repurchase as a horse place again? *sigh*