Re-possession

The reference to dry land was referring to the maritime law that is used against you in every court in the nation. The nation is drowning in debt and your property is used as a surety on the payment of that debt. In this respect there is absolutely no 'dry land' anywhere within the U.S. and most probably anywhere in the world. It is a reference to common law principles that got thrown out by Roosevelt in 1933.

If you ever watched the movie Waterworld (Kevin Cosner) in which the whole world is under water the allegory is to law and the only dry land anywhere is located at Sark Island in the Guernsey island chain south of Britain. [The movie shows something like Hawaii but they didn't want to reveal too much of the truth].

Palini- I heard about that, I didn't catch on. So there's that and the fact that I really rent the land from the borough since I pay rent in the form of taxes. Sheesh.. no dry land, taxes and repo people......Anyway thats another discussion.

Well, it gives you a little different perspective while you are deciding what items to risk your skin for and when a better idea is simply to walk away.

Personally, I treat all uninvited guests as trespassers. That is to say the only duty I owe them is not to intentionally injure them. However, in this status should they break a leg on a crack in the sidewalk I owe them nothing.

the repo visit isnt something you are suprised to see.... you know its going to happen. as for it being private property and bad guys waltzing on your land to steal... they are nnot stealing they are repossessing. they are not trespassing, they are repossessing.

Repossessing is an interesting word. If you possessed something at some point in time and at a later time you re-possessed it for want of payment.

Ownership and possession can be separated. However, possession is considered to be nine tenths of the law. Ownership is a little more difficult to pin down. We have all these legal fictions called corporations operating as they had the rights of men and women because that is what the courts decided. If you take a look at the talmud (circa 400 - 500 A.D.) you would find that ownership is an act and that act could not be taken by a legal fiction. If you ran across a donkey on the desert and you actually led it that was an act of ownership. If you ran across a camel and drove it, that was an act of ownership. If you found a horse and sat on it and it moved, that was an act of ownership. A corporation can do none of these acts and therefore can own nothing. It is kind of an interesting perspective because every corporation on the face of the earth would immediately vanish if these old principles could be enforced.

it is true that most people know that the repo man is coming. When you dont pay a car payment in over 3 months then you know. In those 3 months the bank works very hard to get their money. So yes you know they are coming. It is true that the LAW does not see it as stealing. But if you go on someone's property and you are an unwelcomed visitor and you are told to leave you ARE trespassing and can be arrested on the spot or days after a complaint. You have to see them to prove they trespassed.
I have done the job. I will tell you this...
If someone came on my property that was not wanted they would be met with a shotgun. I clearly have a no trespassing sign posted and I live in town.
Some repo men will tell you that it is not trespassing and that the repo order gives them the right to trespass. They are lieing. All you have to do is say leave my property now and without the car. If you have to, sit in the car until they leave. They cant take the car with them if you are in it. Thats kidnapping. After they leave lock the car in a garage that they cant get into. If they break in and take the car. They are in a boatload of trouble.

If the repo man leaves without the car then he won't get paid at least in most cases. So if he comes home empty handed enough times he will need to get a job driving a big truck or something like that.

Sounds to me like the big issue is the trespass, along with the repo guys not properly presenting the information you asked for.

I think you could go to the local Trooper station and file a report on the trespassers. Have your son contact the actual lien holder on his title, and find out who they contract with for repo's. Then call them.

I am sure there is special licensing they must carry, so a quickie search at the state website might be helpful too.

Personally I would have run them off at gun point. Even up here in the Valley, unidentified intruders are suspect. And they were just that: Unidentified intruders.

If you can PM the name on the tow truck, I can probably help you out a bit

Rember most cops dont give a hoot about you or your rights they just want peace and quiet

that was funny. We made a lot of money repoing. It was $100 for the ones we had to steal and $50 for the ones that people said come pick it up. We stole almost all of our accts. We would leave each night with 20 to 30 accts. If we didnt get it the first time, we kept coming back and watched for the chance to get it. We visited family members houses without them knowing and I could skip trace people (pretty much find them via computer program) if they move and change their address, get a loan, get a phone I would find them. We quit because the company we worked for cheated the govt on taxes and so they were in trouble and our paychecks started bouncing. We averaged anywhere from $800 to $1500 a week. Nice money but a very, very dangerous job.

Very true...and a box good ol' Round Rock Donuts. Make love not war!!

Just once I'l like to see someone actually do it. there is a long list of people in th world you cannot threaten with a gun, and a repo man is one of them. They are not criminals or intent on harming you or your property. point a gun at them, and you are the aggressor, trespassing issue or no. Besides if you now its a repos man, and you point a gun at them, this sorta kinda makes you an aggressive moron.
you missed 3 payments, your rights are in conflict with the banks right to collect its collateral property. IF you think you are a good wholesome upstanding moral person, and IF m=payment #3 passes you by unpaid and IF the banks been asking and asking and asking... and you know payment #4 will go by unpaid too....
Just park the truck out on the street and let it go already. all this resistance when you are as wrong as wrong can get really makes you look pretty bad.
If the bank breeched a contract on you you would be livid and out for blood. Be happy all they do is drive away with THEIR truck.

this is a very basic who owes who what and some basic contract details. you pay you keep you dont pay we repo.

this isnt hard to understand o a reason to go after someone doing their job [unlike the owner who wasnt doing their job by paying the bank winkwink] and collecting the banks property.

cry all you like about rights and trespassing and repo men with bad attitudes. in the end they didnt start the big ugly ball rolling.

go park your car on the street and let it go, becuse they will get it, one way or another.

You are darn right, they should have provided ID, AND proof of the repossession order. This is the kind of thing that can go so horribly wrong if the repo guys are not professional and do their job correctly. For all you know they could be con-artist criminals stealing property. Con-artists who are banking on the meek and mild population to just go along with the deal because they "say" they are repo men.

I've found that the repo industry in many areas is much like the bail bondsmen industry - semi-regulated, and populated with a number of less than upstanding "people". Any attempt from some of the more progressive members of the industry to try and organize efforts towards more professionalism is met with apathy, complacency, and sometimes downright hostility.

Usually, for these type of people, karma is a .... and it will catch up with them eventually. In the OP's case, this situation could have gone down much differently. Lets review, you have:

1. Strangers coming onto your property uninvited, and unexpected (trespassing last time I checked).

2. Strangers proceed to take an item off of your property.

3. Strangers refuse to provide Identification.

4. Strangers refuse to provide the proper documentation for what they are attempting to do.

5. Strangers refuse to answer property owners questions.

6. Strangers behavior is indifferent and contemptuous towards property owner.

7. Strangers refuse ceist and desist order, and refuse to leave property.

Anything wrong with that picture??? What would have happened if her son had not eventually shown up at the scene like he did?

IMO, these guys could have very well been face down in the dirt at the property owners gunpoint, awaiting arrival of law enforcement to deal with issues #1-7. Once leo arrive the property owner can decide whether to press trespassing charges, or not.

Then let the leo deal with the guys to see if they have proper ID and paperwork.

There is simply no rational reason a property owner should have to put up with #1-7.

Now, that's not to say that the truck shouldn't have been repossessed, but there is a right way and a wrong way to go about that process, and the clowns in this incident went about it the wrong way, to say the least.

A neighbor of mine bought a new truck in 1993. He never made a payment on it. Last I knew, the truck was still in his driveway. He brags to his friends that the repo people could never find where he lives (not all of my neighbors are nice people, and we are in a fairly remote location)

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I heard about a repo man being sued because the owner had chained his dog..a pit bull on to the back tire. The repo guy simply hooked the car and drove it down the highway with the dog dragging. Dog died and owner sued the repo man..repo man lost and had to pay up. Not sure how much he had to pay but it was enough to make him be bankrupt. Also heard about a car that had two pit bulls INSIDE..repo guy simply hooked up the car and drove down the highway..the dogs cooked to death in the car due to high temps. Repo man was sued again and lost also due to it being considered criminal animal cruelty. I wonder what moron would leave his dog chained or in a car about to be repo'd! I've seen repo people on tv as well...dangerous job.

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Ted H

You may all go to Hell, and I will go to Texas.
-Davy Crockett

In Missouri if the land owner tells you to leave you are required to do so. Landowner rights supercede personal property rights. Every state is different.

donsgal

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Life is what happens while you are making other plans. (John Lennon)

I'm thinking the land "owner" didn't miss any payments on any truck and didn't know that the truck was due to be repossessed. Seems that they have a place to ask for papers before they release the truck - for all they know someone could actually be stealing it. That won't help either the bank or the truck purchaser. Now, if the repo guys had shown the paperwork, then the land owner ought to get out of the way and let them take it. However, without showing the paperwork, it seems to me they are trespassing without any reason to do so and ought to be treated as trespassers. It's not about the repossession, its about the lack of response to a legitimate question. (Although we all know that the land owner was likely pretty wound up - I'm sure I would be!)

JMHO

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~ Carol

I had an attempted repo one night on my car. I only owed about $500 left on the payments. Debt was sold to some scummy company and I was in dispute with them over some minor detail...dont remember exactly. I dont think I was 3 months behind, but one night I hear a truck backing down my driveway. Never expecting a repoman I went outside to check it out. Turns out it was a high school aquatince who I hadnt seen in 7 years. THAT DIRT BAG TRIED EVERY LIE IN THE BOOK TO CONVINCE ME I HAD TO LET HIM TAKE THE CAR! After about 10 akward minuites of small talk mixed with "you are taking the car over my dead body" he finally said something nasty and left without the car.
I went and paid the car off the next day because this company wasnt worth dealing with. They had even called my next door neighbor a few days earlier.
Normaly I woudn't have sympathy, but considering what I went through over being in dispute over a few $$ and because of that being behind $250 with only $500 owed total and dealing with the trash of the earth that showed up at my door...Im sorry you had to deal with that element.

I expect if you told them to leave...legaly they would have to go. But repo men and most police to me are about the same level of gutter trash...so I would expect in the real world your rights would be meaningless. Unless it went before a judge.

Your son should have just driven away since he was planing to take care of the situation. (there is a subtle diference here between extorsion and a company honestly trying to retreve its property) When he gets older and more jaded...he wont be so easily pushed around...even if he was kinda in the wrong.

Funny thing too. I have known a 3 repo men in my days. All were of the same mold. Loud, wana be tough guys who were theves at heart and enjoyed the rush they got from doing this kind of work. All of them would steal the owners contents in the vehicle and laugh about it. I actually knew a fouth. He did it for two weeks and said it wasnt for him..fighting with people and making life harder for folks just wasnt something he was willing to do. I think most decent folk wouldnt do this kind of work.

So, I guess that proves what your are left with is trash for the most part. At least they mostly deal with trash...so I guess it works out most of the time.

One of my favorite acquaintances was a small Italian woman. Nicest lady (in every sense of the word) you would ever want to meet.

Because she needed to support her two small sons, she did repo work for a while. She didn't like it much, but it was honest work and she was good at it, and it kept her boys housed and fed and clothed.

She was not trash, it was the best job she could get at the time under her circumstances.

Today, she's a loan officer with a respected mortgage company. Her boys are hard-working, respectable men.

She is NOT trash.

Pony!