Petroleum Pipeline
 

I am looking at some nice acreage (40) and was out walking it today and saw that at one end is a WARNING, PETROLEUM PIPELINE sign. Should this concern me at all? What would be the drawbacks to having that? My first concern was what if it leaks or something horrid. Also I wonder if I could get certified organic with a pipeline going through the property. Thanks for any input!

First the utility company has a right of way to access the pipe line. At least in my area they check the line pretty regular for problems. There's always the chance of a leak. I would contact a local agency that deals with organic regulations and ask them about the pipeline.

Bobg

If it were me, I would want to know what it was carrying (likely sweet gas) and be sure it's not carrying any H2S. There are usually some restrictions about how near you can build to a pipeline but usually nothing crazy if it's sweet product. I can't see why you couldn't get an organic certificate - likes are usually buried quite deep and tested regularly to prevent leaks. I can't imagine too many places right now that don't have pipe buried under it these days.

Thanks for the responses!

The biggest problem will be with they have the right of access (they will have at least one of the locks on the gates)... as stated before, pipelines are buried at least 3 feet from the top of the top to actual ground level. I've seen fields of cotton and other annual crops grown on pipeline right a way. (the field being plowed, planted and harvested every year)

Pipelines are visually inspected (usually by a low flying airplane) at least bimonthly (sometimes more often). They are also pressure tested (with water) every 5 years (if I remember correctly). Actually, the pipeline company is more concerned with leaks than you are, and do everything they can to prevent them.

Other than finding out what is being shipped, I'd also ask what the maximum operating pressure, and what the normal operating pressures are.

Usually there is a 25 feet (on both sides of the actual pipeline) that they don't allow anyone to build on.

There should not be any reason why you couldn't be organic. I know of one organic cotton farm that had a pipeline bisecting the farm. (If I remember correctly it was a 2 section farm.)

Pat

Pat, thank you for the great information. I feel encouraged now! This is beautiful land on which to build a good life. Thanks everyone. :)

I don't usually post, I lurk more than anything, but I do work for a
natural gas pipeline, so I thought that I may be able to add my two cents
worth in.

The previous poster had some good information, but there are a few other
things to look for too.

The sign should have the name of the pipeline company on it along with
a telephone number to contact them.
I would call and get the phone number and name of the Right of Way
agent for the company. That person can tell you exactly what is in the
ground and what type of restrictions they have.

There should also be information included in a title search for the property.

Going to the source is the best bet. Don't ever guess.

Thank you, Clg... I'll take your advice.

Here is some stuff I heard about a local pipeline: They do have access to the 40 year old line. They can and do repair and test the lines, but will pay for crop damage when it occurs.
This is one pipeline, and just what I have heard from my aunt, who owns 10 acres with a line running thru it.
clove

I would check into the company's safety record. Up here they had some kids killed when they set off fireworks nearby and it had been leaking. Had the kids not been where they were they estimated in a few days the gas would have been enough to take out a nearby town.

Personally I wouldn't touch land with a pipeline on it. The Olympic pipeline that runs through our county blew up a few years back, twice. Once blowing a five acre hole in the ground in S.W. Washington The second explosion set fire to a creek and the fire ran downstream killing 3 kids in Bellingham.

I was never associated with a natural gas line, but even a 40 year old line isn't that old. All the lines I ever worked with were catholic protected (there will be more loss of walls from electrolysis than any other reason, the catholic protection prevents that). They regularly "pig" the lines too. Some day while you are out in that field you might hear one go by. "Pig" is a cleaning device they put in the pipeline that is pushed along by the flow. In between water testing they also put a calipter pig in the line that x-rays the line as it is pushed through. Then the e-rays are read when the pig is removed.

AS I said earlier, the pipeline company is much more intersted in NO Leaks than you are. Pipelines are a very safe thing to have passing through someone's land.

Pat

I have a 12" crude oil line that cuts off a small corner of my land at the back. When I bought it, it was owned by Exxon Mobil; it's the original Magnolia Oil Co. crude pipeline that runs from the East Texas oil fields around Kilgore over to Corsicana. Last year, they deactivated the line and sold it to Sunoco but there was crude running in it until then. They have never been on my property, except when I was burying electical conduit once and I when I had a small dozer building roads about 5 years ago. They're supposed to keep it mowed, but they don't.

This pipeline has been in place since 1932, without a problem. I can fence it off and lock it up, as long as I put in a gate and give them a key or let them double lock it. No problems whatsoever in the 5 1/2 years we've owned the land.

I have a pipeline running across my property.

It was used to carry fuels from the ocean down at Searsport, up to Loring Air Force base. It was used to carry jet fuel, and heating oil, and various petroleum products. The base shut down, and left the pipeline. Now a couple of the pumping stations have become huge clean-up sites, as they did leak into the ground water. One of those sites is a couple miles South of us [and down stream].

A local indian tribe has been negotiating with the Fed to open up and re-use the pipeline to carry Natural gas.

Otherwise it is maintained 'clean' and filled with nitrogen. In theory I am not supposed to dig within three feet of it with power equipment. So running our power line underground, phonelines and sewage lines. We can use a back hoe except for within 3 feet of where we guess it to be.

I guess it is a hinderance. But I do not really mind. I did want to know a lot about it when I was buying the land.

:)

as stated above, the main problems will be involved with the pipeline operator having access to it. this can be addressed by a locked gate that they have a key to, or double locking. leakage is very rare, and it costs the operator big bucks. they go to great lengths to see to it that it doesn't happen.

there can be other, wierd problems. a friend of mine who works for a pipeline company told me that where one of their pipes crossed a large cotton operation, it warmed up the soil a degree or two and over the line there was a stripe of cotton that germinated earlier and grew faster. this meant that it couldn't be harvested with a cotton picker that was set for the height of the plants in the rest of the field. they negotiated it so that each year, the pipeline company paid the farmer the price of one bale of cotton. each year a different price depending on what cotton was selling for.

pax
t.f.

living on or around underground cross country pipe lines
 

A few years ago a realator called me and told me of a bargin in a house in a good area so we went out immediately. Nice house good area price really cheap. While ther noticed orange candy cane pipes sticking out of the ground at the road edge of the property. Asked about it and realator said no problem gas pipes burried there and ran through the garden spot where the previous owner had had a garden for years. Still thought I would check found a couple of men in a service turck with the company logo on it the next dayand asked them. They said they coulod not guess how much property along the line they had been offered over the years. They said they would never let their family live even close to one. The ones there were 30 inches in diameter 35 years old and carried high pressure natural gas to the North East, four of them . These two men worked full time on just a few miles patching and stopping leaks they were experts and said some day they would blow and I did not want to be anywhere close. Run don't walk away. I would rather have a nucluar plant in my yard. Just my opinion.

Pat is well-versed in pipelines. He is exactly right about them not wanting leaks. The reason they don't want leaks is the clean up after one. Having said that, pipelines are probably the safest method available to transfer hundreds of millions of gallons of petro products, including crude, ethylene, hydrocarbon gases etc across the country. I have an ethylene, butadiene, natural gas, and hydrogen pipeline at the back of my property. No problems whatsoever!!!! They keep us posted on inspections and testing. They make good neighbors. The only thing is that they could possibly be digging up the area that the pipeline is on so don't put something on top you can't lose. But they don't normally dig up the whole line, just inspect at different points along the way. I'd snatch the property up in a heartbeat.

I wouldn't mind one all that much, but there are some caveats: I would not want my house close to one, would not want one carrying h2s, and would want to know exactly what kind of line, the depth, etc. DH worked in the oil field. Long distance transport lines are usually deep. Local transport lines may not be. Farmer plowing the field the well dh was checking hit a regional transport line with his plow. Tossed the old boy quite a ways, and burned up the tractor. No deaths.

I think the poster mentioned a PETROLEUM pipeline, not high pressure natural gas. Huge difference. Most petroleum lines are low pressure crude.

nodak3, it must have been a really old line or some serious deep plowing. Up here and I'm quite sure it's similar in the US, lines have to be a minium depth to prevent just such situations, usually about 4 - 6 feet deep.

i have worked in compressor stations on nat gas lines and the discharge pressure from the compressors is 900 psi. i don't know what pressure liquid petroleum pipelines use, but i'm sure it's much, much lower. there's a nat gas pipeline that runs from texas to south florida (the trans-gulf pipeline). it runs through this area about ten miles south of here. i have never heard of an incident involving this pipeline in the last 40 years. i do know of one incident involving a compressor station. big bucks in damage, no serious injuries.

pax
t.f.

Wow, lots of good information from you all. Thank you. I am leaning toward thinking it is safe to have on the property. I might not put any crops near it, and I might not let the kids run around that area (no fireworks!) and I might keep the animals off of that area, but all in all, it doesn't seem so scary. Oh yeah, I might not be too keen to build right next to it either, but that works out well...it's at the opposite end of the acreage from where I would build anyway. I will still ask the questions you all gave me to ask, just to be informed, but I feel much better about it all. Thanks!

A lot of good stuff has been said so far here. But I was thinking about something that I have not seen yet. Would the owner of the land get anything for them putting the pipe line threw their land ? And if it was already there and you bought the land would you get something as well ?
I would think they should give at least a small yearly fee of some sort.

No.

Even if you have a high-tension power line running across your land, giving cancer and nervous problems to your cattle. Still nothing.

Personal opinion - when I looked for land, I wanted it at least 2 miles away from the closest pipeline, railroad, or interstate. That way, if there were a hazmat emergency, I'd be outside the most likely evacuation distance (depending on wind direction).

As a rule, you would not be compensated for a pipeline if you purchased land that one is buried under. The reason is that a pipeline is non intrusive and does not affect your ability to utilize your land. Surface installations and wells are different in the sense that there is always something tangible above ground that you have to work around or look at. You would be compensated for pipeline damages if they had to come onto your land and inspect the line or replace any joints that might be necessary.

I can think of many reasons a underground pipe line could be intrusive to a land owner. Pool, Pond, Building with basement, And the list can go on and on. Personally I would not buy land with a pipe line on it if I could help it. And I would fight them tooth and nail if they tried putting one on land I owned.

WI--nope, it was a gathering regional line, and there were no depth requirements in that area. That it wasn't on the ground instead of in it fooled the farmer.

I would have NO Problem with it what so ever~!

Don't forget, this is at the far end of a forty acre parcel. I will be building on the opposite side of the land so the things you mentioned wouldn't come into play. There is already a pond that is well away from the pipeline, so I have to concur that I don't think it is a problem.

I can't think of any time that anyone has ever wanted to put a pool or basement on top of a pipeline but that's not saying it couldn't happen. Usually, a few feet either way is reasonable when building such things. I do find the mentality regarding oil & gas a bit odd. All of us use it, we're all for it's existence but just not in our back yard.