Threatening letter from anonymous neighbor!!

I wonder if this wasn't the chicken crap way of lumping everything into one letter when the problem may have been more about the noise produced by the human children. Some people don't want to be accused of being kid haters so they lump anything that makes noise into a complaint hoping the laws or courts will come to their aid.

I do have a question and it's not meant to start a war or anything. Do your children have ATV's that they're running up and down the roads or through the pastures on your own land? I'm not saying they don't have the right, I'm just trying to figure out what kind of noise the neighbors might be complaining about.

Qwispea... thanks, I needed that reminder.

Arkie1... I had a good laugh at that one. Jim and I dislike ATV's, and often complain (to each other only) about the noise from our neighbors. The most our children (there are 7 of them ages 9 and under), can be accused of lately is running around yelling, "For Narnia, and for Aslan!!!" Well, they also have been playing the three musketeers lately; I heard something recently about hiding from Cardinal Richelieu, but I didn't hear a lot of noise with that one.

Thanks to everyone who gave me an idea about what their zoning laws are. We moved to the country from the city, and when I was told we were zoned agricultural, I just assumed (I know, I shouldn't have assumed anything) we would be allowed to have the animals. So, another learning experience. We'll see how painful it turns out.

Interesting to know coyboyracer, I'm hoping it won't get to that point, but time will tell.

I was going out to mow earlier, and ended up talking to my next door neighbor instead. We were trying to figure out who could have sent the letter (there are really only 3 possibilities, unless it is someone over the hill). But she made me feel so much better. She told me how she really enjoys my animals (and she is NOT a homesteader at all).

I will let you know what happens after I speak with zoning tomorrow!
PJ

invite more kids over for a camp out in the yard about another 10 or 12 should do the trick

Neighbors... you either get along, or you don't.

As far as 'poisioning' goes... If these are the type of people to send an anonymous letter.. then they are probably non- confrontational. They will just stay in their home and complain to each other and to any other neighbor that will listen. If they really get ticked off, then they'll call the cops and that will get them nowhere.

Complaing about animal noise might get you a knock on the door from local county 'humoring' their complaint. But children... ha, that is a good one.

Everytime I think about adults complaing about 'children' ...well I just try to take the time to remind them that they too were once crying, snot nosed, didn't know any better people .. and that someone else had to put up with their antics. Then, I remember I have better things to do with my time.

Want to figure out who it is ?

Have a cookout one weekend and invite all the surrounding neighbors. Look for the one that doesn't show.

Then really go out of your way to be especially nice... that will really have them up for a few late nights !!

PJ, what is your neighbourhood like? Is it mostly farm-type homesteads or fancy McMansions? I mean, does it look like a farm community? Or does it kinda look like a "mini-subdivision"? Three acres is not much to keep animals on (not that people can't manage). If your neighbours are fairly close, I can see where that might be a problem.

When we looked at buying land (a mere 15 acres) we checked into it first---turns out that although this piece was in the country, there was a *new* township law in effect: 50 acres to have ANY farm animals OR prior approval (you had to tell them exactly how many and what animals you had). Anyone that owned animals before 1995 was exempt through the grandfathering law BUT they had to get approval for new stock. The next township over just said "2 acres per large animal".

So you never know. You really have to check for yourself AND get it in writing from the township.....sometimes even the staff there is mistaken if going by memory. NEVER go by what the realtors tell you. Firstly, they might pretend not to know just to sell the property. Secondly, some of them are downright ignorant of the laws. We checked ourselves, and informed our agent from there. They really don't know and the laws change so fast.

However, if your land was zoned agricultural WHEN you bought, you might have a case; however, whatever THOSE laws for livestock are will apply to you, it won't mean you can just have what you want, there will still be rules. If you bought AFTER it changed to residential, then the neighbours might be able to force a case.

Good luck!

DD

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"The early bird may get the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese in the trap."

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An information and request letter that this person sent is not a threat unless they actually do use a threatening statement.

But to let you know that there is a problem is there right.

You may think that you moved from the city to the country, because you are outside of the city limits, but you are still in the controlled area of the masses who live in the city.

As the town grows bigger you will be surrounded by more and more people, and they will rezone your area, and then you are back in the city.

The more people the more complaints.

If you have a party as someone suggested, and no neighbors come, you will know it is a joint effort to quieten your property down, and to silence your children.

Next they will try the Adults only, and no children clause in the new zoning, and also raise ( double or tripple ) your property taxes.

By the way ......... "WELCOME BACK TO THE AMERICAN CITY " ....


bumpus
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I'm thinking whoever said the complaint is about the children, and the animals were thrown in for good measure, probably nailed it. I have chickens and Icelandic sheep, which are close enough to goats as to make no difference. Right now they have almost no pasture, are still nursing, and are HUNGRY. So they bawl every time I go out the door (or they hear my voice). The chickens... are chickens. They crow once in a while.

Even so... I'd be hard pressed to say they are "noisy." The sheep errupt 2-3 times a day for less than 5 min. Otherwise it is a lost lamb calling for its mother, which is LOUD (heavens!) but can be measured in seconds. We're not talking "noisy" here. And unless you're weird or seriously unique... I bet your animals are not "noisy."

But I would try and make sure the waste material is being tidily composted (or hidden as mulch in the flower beds!) just in case their next line of crabby attack is to field some sort of inspector. I think anyone who sends annoymous letters is a sneak, likely to turn you in for all kinds of imagined offenses, but not someone who would set foot on your property for fear of being caught. And they won't file or complain to authorities if they have to give their name and risk being exposed.

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Icelandic Sheep and German Angora Rabbits

They are children for pete's sake, let 'em play. (I don't mean that to sound snarky toward you.... it's the neighbor) It sounds to me like they are having a great time with their imaginations, hope they keep it up.. the noiser the better.

Complaining about animal noise is one thing, but the children playing..... that's just too off the wall.

My thoughts exactly! Honestly, the last thing that I would have done is contact the zoning people and draw attention to the fact that you have animals where you may not be allowed to because, as MorrisonCorner says, it is very unlikely that the letter writter will ever actually file a complaint. If they thought they had a valid reason to complain to the authorities they most likely would not resort to sneaky letters. Your most recent property taxes should state what you are zoned as. If not, I would suggest going to the county land records office and look the property up on the tax rolls (will state whether zoned ag or res.), look up the zoning laws (may be available on the internet, but if not you can get a copy from either the county or town) and then you will know what you are dealing with. This is all publicly available and you do not have to disclose why you are requesting the information.

This Post caught my eye, and I was Shocked to see it was yours Pj. : ( I hope you find out you are zoned ag. Since I've oringinated 3 of the goats towards the noise! : ) It's scary when the neighbors don't like you. One of my boys was choked with a "numchuck" out in front of our house when he was 5, by the neighbors teenager, I was so happy to get back out in the country where my yard is my yard! I hate the atv's also, one of Our neighbors has irritating children. I can't go work on the back 40 fenceline without them roaring up and being Loudly freindly, I feel like saying "go away kid I'm trying to work here," but I don't. I also worry about their gun range I afraid they may shoot towards us, I 'ld like to go over and ask to see their back stop and area where they shoot so I can be relieved, or more cautious. Our back stop is Our HILL and in front of that a large pile of railroad ties. However I'm too chicken. I know they get hauled in regularly for drunk driving. I don't do well with inebriated people.

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BryrPatch Quality Handmade Goat milk Soap, Lotions; ADGA Dairy Goats, DHIR, LA, Shows, Current whole herd CAE neg tests. We R Kidding now! www.BryrPatch.com

If you only have a few neighbors, be the bigger person and actually contact each one, preferable in person, and ask them if they are the ones who sent the letter. Start with the ones with children or grandchildren, then when you get to the childless ones (i.e. someone with children is less likely to complain about kid noise right?) you can say you have already talked to everyone else. They might not be honest with you but they will know you are not the coward In the least you might be, "No I didn't sent it but..." Then take it from there and find out exactly what it is they do not like. Asks them to show you a copy of the restrictions they feel you might be breaking.

You know, if there are any restrictions, I'm almost certain the letter would have had them verbatim.

The advise not to stir up more trouble just to prove your point is good.

Hugs
marlene

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It is the one with persistence and determination that brings great ideas into being.

If its zoned residential,then what the zoning law says goes.
BTW,residential COUNTY here allows six hens,no rooster,2 dogs per lot,not sure what my city says

Why is this so hard for people to understand???????

Are you above the laws????????

BooBoo

Mightybooo the realtor told them it was zoned agriculture and that is what they thought it was, perhaps they would not have moved there if they had known other wise. I know I would not have moved there

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marching to the beat of a different drummer

Gotcha J,Im referring to folks who ALWAYS have a problem with zoning.

Fer cryin' out loud,thats just the way it is.

Im certainly going to be sure of my zoning especially if my plan is animals.Though truth be told,I learned something,better check it in person.The folks here sure thought they were ok,thats a shame,acting in good faith and getting burned.

BooBoo

(I am one of those who always have a problem with it) you know it was not to be found between 1776 and 1915 in our country then modern day zoning began when it started in 1916 in NY I believe if memory serves me right,It has rapidly spread like the plauge it is and made a joke of land "ownership" in my opinion. Since then it has all been down hill soon farmers everywhere will be zoned/regulated out of buissness and we will all be dependent upon eating imported food and highly processed genetically modified Monsanto engineered extruded expensive frankenfood garbage that soylent green would almost be preferable to. I believe that are forefathers would roll over in their graves if they saw our once great country now on it's speedy desent into oblivion rotting from the inside out in a mass orgy of consumerisim and zoning, more laws than Nazi germany and stalinist russia combined, and more people in jail than any other country communist or otherwise am I ranting "ok" I will shut up now. Where will homesteaders go when everyplace in the USA is zoned? the moon? antartica? various "3rd"world places that still have some sanity? Now some good news from where most of you would least expect it http://www.crestofthewave.com/blog/i...id=118&catid=3

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marching to the beat of a different drummer

Got back from the court house, and we are zoned agricultural A1, as we were informed prior to buying. There are no restrictions on livestock or anything else. Big sigh...

I'm going to chalk this up to another learning experience and add it to my "things not to assume" list.

Now, I just get to deal with my neighbor. We are very friendly, know them all by name, and speak to each of them when we see them. (Part of why the letter was such a shock!) So, we will just continue with that course of action, trying to be even more friendly.

PJ

Seems to me some of the most outspoken against zoning ..are actually for it when it meets their own personal criteria. Some of those who were so active in the Planned Community threads awhile back ..were very outspoken against having McMansions and/or SubDivisions in a 'planned' community of Homesteaders. In effect ..they wanted to 'zone' those things out! Not saying I blame them ..just that zoning occurs almost everywhere.

Zoning can be a huge benefit if it is done properly. When it goes bad though ..as it most often does ..its a travesty. But it doesn't have to be bad ..its just that it is most often inappropriately planned. Among other things ..its the out-of-control ignorance of inept planners ..and the greed of corporate big-wigs that makes zoning the mess it is.

Most people with property even have their own styles of zoning within their own property. They haul animal waste to one end of their property ..they put their orchard in another area of their property ..they plant their veggies in a planned garden ..even within the home there is micro-zoning.

So ..zoning in itself isn't bad ..but bad zoning is.

So happy to learn that you do have the type zoning you hoped for. A big sigh of relief ..WheW! Thanks for keeping us updated. Hope everything works out for the best for you and your 'neighborhood'.

That is great news that your good to go with how your living. The sad part is one of them so called friends are really not a friend at all. If they was a friend they would have walked right up and talked about things over a glass of iced tea or something, Instead of sending a chicken crap letter like they did.

Anyway I hope that things work out great in the end for you.

Hi all,

This is my first post on this site. I've been a "lurker" on HT for quite some time now, and really enjoy it. I wanted to throw my two cents worth in here. I worked as our local Zoning Administrator, and I dealt with issues like this many times. Jimandpj, I'm glad your property is Zoned A1, so you can keep your animals. I recommend that EVERYONE get a copy of your current Zoning Ordinance and Master Plan (if they have one) from your township or county or city, etc. In my travels, I have seen a lot of township officials are part time, and don't always know the right answers. If they tell you something, get a copy of the ordinance that backs it up, otherwise it's your word against theirs.

This is also good advise for new property buyers. The Master Plan will show you where the township plans on putting developments (residential, commercial and industrial). For those of you against zoning, please keep in mind that it's zoning that can hopefully prevent a landfill, rock quarry, or maybe a subdivision from going in next to your property. I agree with Qwispea - zoning itself isn't bad, but bad zoning is. With that said, I recommend that everyone get involved in their local politics. I know, I know, nobody likes politicians, but it's critical that you keep an eye on them. Go to the monthly Board meetings, and Planning Commission meetings. You will get a feel for how your township is developing, and you can make sure that they make wise zoning decisions. It may raise your blood pressure, but I feel it's important. Most people have no clue who their local Board members are, or how they stand on development of the township. It's important for you to find out.

deere-cat