Mark's NAIS Odyssey

I am SO sorry..for the few of you who know me..you also know that my brain cells don't always play nicely with one another..

I meant to type: premise registration will be mandatory..(not "inspection").

Since the stated objective of the APHIS is what it is, and one of the written goals of the NAIS concerning their role is to develop rules and regs and policies..once someone registers, they now have given over to the "public good" access to their livestock/poultry.

NOWHERE on the NAIS site does it state that property owners will be subject to inspections..absolutely nowhere..directly or indirectly. This was my error, and I apologize. That idea arose from conversations I have had recently with people here in Missouri. My malfunctioning brain combined the two..(this is why I don't post much anymore)..Please forgive me..There is sufficient cause IMHO to be concerned about NAIS based upon reality..One can infer from their statements many things..and I certainly do..but stated fact? No.

Exactly my point. There is nothing about registering of the animals on small farms that will keep America safe. Follow the money trail and see where it goes.
It's driven by large corporations using fear to scare folks into giving up more freedoms .... it's about money. There will be fines too large for the small guy to pay. As was mentioned earlier ... land will most likely be forfeit to pay the debt. It's about the chemical companies selling the drugs that will keep our meat supply safe.
If we're not careful, ALL of our politicans will be given to enslaving the people for the mega-corporations .... what's good for business is good for everyone.

To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson

__________________
I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it."
Thomas Jefferson

Thanks for being honest .... but it will state that soon enough. How else will they know if people are registering ALL of their animals.

I once knew a judge who told me about the time the "seat belt" law was passed, that it was only going to be used for a reason to stop suspicious cars ... it would NEVER be used as a means to pad the coffers of city or state government. She told me a time would NEVER come when someone would be ticketed just for not wearing a seat belt ..... She's an extremely liberal Democrat with many years of civic service, but she bought the "it'll keep us safe" crap. Ever heard of anyone getting a ticket for not wearing a seat belt?

They'll inspect your property and set standards that a normal small time landowner can't meet. Your tax dollars will be used to force you out of the lifestyle you enjoy .... but you'll be safe from all those un-registered chickens.

__________________
I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it."
Thomas Jefferson

With my chickens, keeping everything on-site is no problem. With goats however, I need to kid each year to have milk, and I want to sell the kids. Hence, I'll need to follow the regulation du jour.

__________________
Mark in West Central Ohio

http://animalid.aphis.usda.gov/nais/...ent_072605.pdf
above site talks about the radio transmitter tags. I can't find the site where it said that eventually satellites would be equiped to read the tags.

http://animalid.aphis.usda.gov/nais/...sheet.shtml#20
Note, in the answer about individual use they do NOT give a definitive NO.


The guidelines are really hanging up the computer and the printer.

Q. If a Person Raises Animals for His or Her Own Use and the Animals Never Leave the Owner's Property, Do They Need to be Identified?
A. Under the current plan, animals that never leave a premises do not need to be identified.

That's about as difinitive as it is going to get for right now.

RFID makes sense - easy to scan and use. Fits in well with small hand scanners and computer uploads. Satellite tracking? I'd really like to see some real info on that. Tracking hundreds of thousands of animals by satellite? That does not make logistical sense and could most likely not be done. The technology and money is not there.

__________________
Ultra Lord is not afraid of chickens!

I think the following quote from Wendell Berry in "the Unsettling of America" written 30 years ago sums my feelings about the NIAS pretty well


"And nowhere now is there a market for minor produce: a bucket of cream, a hen, a few dozen eggs. One cannot sell milk from a few cows anymore; the law-required equipment is too expensive. Those markets were done away with in the name of sanitation--but, of course, to the enrichment of the large producers. We have always had to have 'a good reason' for doing away with small operators, and in modern times the good reason has often been sanitation, for which there is apparently no small or cheap technology. Future historians will no doubt remark upon the inevitable association, with us, between sanitation and filthy lucre. And it is one of the miracles of science and hygiene that the germs that used to be in our food have been replaced by poisons."

I do know the premises would be satellite trackable. The site I can't get to work did have that, after all that is how the GPS gets it's signals. As for the individual animal tracking, can't find any NAIS info, can't find the actual legislation, can't find the congressional debate postings. I will do more research on that point, but I do think the technology is available. Yes it would be very expensive. What does congress care, we're paying for it.

Most of the state sites I visited will require individual animals to be tagged. I'll try tomorrow to get those links posted. Funny thing is, according to USDA info there have already been announcements and hearings. When I read it in Poultry Press it was the first I've heard of it. Yet the first deadline for "public input" had already passed even then. How safe and logical will it be for the general public if they don't want us to know about it????

Ed, that's an excellent quote ... too bad it's true.
Thanks for posting it.

__________________
I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than to those attending too small a degree of it."
Thomas Jefferson

Without a doubt.

__________________
Ultra Lord is not afraid of chickens!

I am also living in WISC. The Premises ID IS already in effect as of Jan 1st of 2006.. Many dairy Farmers including my landlord have ALREADY got their ID number for their Farm..It IS Underway This is not something that is going to be stopped OR Should be stopped, It is going to happen, and IS Already taking place..It is NO BIG Deal~! I even have that from my Landlord who operates a dairy farm himself.. No Biggy at all..You guys are just reading WAY to much into this and there is no need to do this...You sound like people that believe there is a conspiracy around every piece of legislator writings, That is no good for the rest of the country that is no good for this Great USA that we have and live in..

All I have to say is, I would like to see a tag that will actually stay in a goats ear! And what about Lamanchas, they have no ears.

__________________
I can't believe I deleted it!

I think this satellite trackable premesis scare is another example of misinterpretation and paranoia creating fear that isn't really there. What is actually happening is that the NAIS records the GPS coordinates of your farm. Having GPS coordinates does not mean you are being tracked by satellites. It means someone can punch your coordinates into a GPS navigation system and get directions to your farm. The GPS satellites don't track your farm, they provide information on the current location of a person or vehicle with a GPS device. Think of it as a giant hi-tech map. A lot of surveying is done now with GPS. Instead of noting degrees and distance, they record what the GPS coordinates of each corner. It's a whole lot easier to find the boundaries that way - you and a gps device can find the exact location of each pin. GPS coordinates are the high tech version of your street address. Do you think they cannot "zoom in on you" if they only have your address and not GPS coordinates? Try playing with Google Earth, or countless other programs. And that is just the stuff available on the internet.

Sorry, but they will not be sweeping thru the skys with advanced satellite imaging spying on your rabbit hutch. The reality is much more mundane - underpaid civil servant in a car driving out to your farm.

__________________
Ultra Lord is not afraid of chickens!

I very much agree....There is no such plan even at the end of the program to put a tracking device in the ear tag..or Implant just a electronic device to be read By A Implant Reader...This again is how such over blown, Hear say and innuendos get started. Again Conspiracy theory and EVERYTHING that involves our Goverment..aarrrggg.. Pretty soon people will be waiting for "The Mother ship" to land and " Planet X is smash into the earth..Let this stuff go by the way of SCI FI writers, and not by the common man who has a brain and knowledge on his side.
And Yes this is For ALL animals from Llamas, horses, donkeys, chickens and others. Everything at some point will have SOME device not all will have the SAME device but SOME device that can be read by the Reader... WILL NOT be ears tags on horses, but they are still coming up with a plane to mark them some how..

If this is only for "food " animals, why does it say horses and asses? Emus? That makes no sense.

Again people are continuing to see conspiracy in this when it is simple and clean cut.. No hidden agendas, nobody is going to be coming on anybodies land Just to See What they are up to.. OMG people Read and do not put into this more then it is.. And again there is NO WORDING at all on animals for FOOD and never was any~!

National Animal Identification System: Overview
The National Animal Identification System (NAIS) is a national program intended to identify animals and track them as they come into contact with, or commingle with, animals other than herdmates from their premises of origin.

The system is being developed for all animals that will benefit from rapid tracebacks in the event of a disease concern. Currently, working groups comprised of industry and government representatives are developing plans for cattle, swine, sheep, goats, horses, poultry, bison, deer, elk, llamas, and alpacas.

Already, many of these species can be identified through some sort of identification system, but these systems are not consistent across the country. Tracing an animalճ movements can therefore be a timeУconsuming endeavor during a disease investigation, especially if the animal has moved across State lines.

As premises are registered, another component of the NAIS animal identification bill be integrated into the system. Unique animal identification numbers (AINs) will be issued to individually identified premises. In the case of animals that move in groups through the production chain such as swine and poultry the group will be identified through a group/lot identification number (Group/Lot IDs).

USDA is developing the standards for collecting and reporting information, but industry will determine which type of identification method works best for each species. These methods could include radio frequency identification tags, retinal scans, DNA, or others. As long as the necessary data are sent to USDAճ information repositories in a standardized form, it will be accepted.

Again marking a GROUP of chickens and such and in NO WAY Individual animals tagged and sure as heck is NO GPS receiver in these animals Sounds like some have heard WAY to many stores about things like that That belongs on SCI FI television and not here~!
Lets get at the Truth and not Hear Say OK??

Ummm, are you trying to say that they are not planning on chipping or identifying individual animals? Or that they are only palnning on id'ing food animals or that they are going to id all animals?
I cannot figure out what exactly you are trying to say here....

That was right from the pages of the NAIS It says Group OR Lot ID for flocks of chickens etc. reread it if you have to.. But Groups and or Lot tells me Not individual animals... But not as horses etc. those will be marked as individual animals...See what others have read into this? And made this into?And not getting to the real truth out about how things are going to be handled... They are and will ID ALL Animals but Flocks of chickens, geese and such as that, only as a Group OR Lot! Others have made this into an all most laughable tagging system, which really is not that hard or rough to do..

AK maybe you had better get your facts straight.

OK,, Fact Per the Federal Vet I talked to. Think he would have the facts and up to date info.

By 2008... final stage.

Yes, tags are required on all animals unless you have batches of 500 or more animals. Then you are allowed a Batch number.
Most Homesteading people don't have that many animals.

You will not be allowed to move any animal that includes horses past 60 miles without express permission from NSIA. Some states will be only 50 miles.
That means more paper work and cost,,even if you want to go to a horse show.

Price.. what he thinks the charge will be per chip, $26.00.. that includes chickens. Yes, by 2008 GPS chips will be required. Intel is in the process of making these chips.

National Herd. That means you no longer own your animals. They belong to the National herd ie.. the Government.

Both of us do not think this will work like the Government says it will. There is no way to control all disease.
What this will do is make big money for companies like Intel and the Government with the fines.

What this will do... drive people away from growing their own food. Food they know gets good care, feed and humanly butchered.
What this will do is try to force people to eat more factory farmed and to me diseased food.
What this will do...is make sure any one with livestock has no rights to their animals.
What this will do... take our rights away

So yes,, I have a major problem with this.

You will not be allowed to move any animal that includes horses past 60 miles without express permission from NSIA. Some states will be only 50 miles.
That means more paper work and cost,,even if you want to go to a horse show.

On those 32 pages of the Entire Doc.. You go and find me the Page and Exact wording of what you just stated...Please? I read and looked at all of those pages and no where can I see where such a wording is said.