Barberpole resistance????

TeenyTinyFarm · #41 07/15/14, 01:51 PM

I bet you have already see this Doug, but in case you haven't maybe it will give you some ideas...http://www.sheepandgoat.com/articles/scours.html

togg75 · #42 07/15/14, 02:15 PM

The johnes link would concern me....

TeenyTinyFarm · #43 07/15/14, 05:23 PM

It would me as well, but I am fairly certain Doug tests all of his animals. One of the things that stood out to me was the possibility that it could be not enough intake of dry matter. I have a doe whose stools turn clumpy when she spends all day foraging. When she feeds on hay, they return to normal. She is the only of my three that is affected this way.

Doug Hodges · #44 07/15/14, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by togg75

The johnes link would concern me....

All tested negative a few weeks ago.

Doug Hodges · #45 07/15/14, 09:07 PM

This afternoon everyone is back on feed and dry rear ends

Clovers_Clan · #46 07/16/14, 10:01 PM

OK. Weird thought. Do the goats drink well or creek water? Could it be a mineral concentration of magnesium? It's also been very hot in the south. Could it be an increase in water intake or an electrolyte imbalance? My does are always thirsty and going to town on the horses mineral block.

togg75 · #47 07/17/14, 01:00 PM

Doug did you get your package?

Doug Hodges · #48 07/17/14, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by togg75

Doug did you get your package?

Yep. Will test next time it happens. Haven't opened the package. It was in today's mail.

southerngurl · #49 07/18/14, 08:33 AM

I've been thinking on this... You've brought together a lot of animals from several different herds. So you're going to have a period of time where they all get immunity to each other's bacteria and parasites. There are many many different strains of coccidia, for example, and each one requires a whole new set of immunity to immunize against it almost as if exposed to coccidia for the first time. Immunity must be formed to each life stage from egg to adult and coccidia has, I forget how many stages, like 20+? You're going to have different parasites, different strains of parasites with different immunity to different wormers. Different bacteria strains etc...I'd expect some bumps in the road.

Cannon_Farms · #50 07/18/14, 08:58 AM

All I can say is that since I followed a good friend of mines who raises NDs (as in 140 some odd goats) advice and started using cydectin injectable as an injection we have had low fecal counts and I have not dewormed since march (after kidding) everyone is spot on the famancha chart and I have not copper bolused in 2 years.
Copper does show in impact on worm egg counts but also helps iron to be absorbed better so I will copper bolus again Ive just been shamefully slacking.

Letting your pasture get so tall is also part of your issue goats like eating at the top and thats where the parasites like to go especially after raining. letting it go to seed also reduces the nutrient content of the pasture and thus your loosing money having to supplement, it would be ideal to rotate your horses and goats from one pasture to another, but horses prefer the shorter grasses so you will probably still have to mow.

Cannon_Farms · #51 07/18/14, 09:11 AM

if you are a part of the fb group ALL ABOUT NUBIAN DAIRY GOATS Noah has a point on using injectable wormers as injections instead of orally.

Doug Hodges · #52 07/18/14, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon_Farms

if you are a part of the fb group ALL ABOUT NUBIAN DAIRY GOATS Noah has a point on using injectable wormers as injections instead of orally.

I am. I'll check it out.

Doug Hodges · #53 07/18/14, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cannon_Farms

Letting your pasture get so tall is also part of your issue goats like eating at the top and thats where the parasites like to go especially after raining. letting it go to seed also reduces the nutrient content of the pasture and thus your loosing money having to supplement, it would be ideal to rotate your horses and goats from one pasture to another, but horses prefer the shorter grasses so you will probably still have to mow.

Seriously??? My thinking was taller is better so they wouldn't eat off the ground.

Just saw a goat by the road. Lol. That was out of the blue.

Cannon_Farms · #54 07/18/14, 11:53 AM

think along these lines worms thrive in a warm moist environment so if you have tall thick grass they are protected from the sun which will kill them, from getting dried out, which will kill them. They evolved to survive and if you go back to the natural order of things they cant survive well if the grasslands are always thick and lush as they are in natural rotation but the same things that will kill them such as sunlight and dry air keeps them from becoming over infested.

Pasture maintenance and worm control are on two opposite ends like everything else in farming

TeenyTinyFarm · #55 07/18/14, 02:01 PM

Wormies only ride the dew up 2 or 3 inches. A taller pasture is better.

southerngurl · #56 07/18/14, 04:11 PM

I think taller is better..but occasionally cutting down short is probably good too. Like taking a cutting of hay.

togg75 · #57 07/18/14, 04:14 PM

Tall pasture is better for goats.

Frosted Mini's · #58 07/18/14, 08:05 PM

Tall grass is better from a parasite standpoint, worse from a nutrition standpoint. Ideal is in between, I think.

**mygoat** · #59 07/18/14, 08:55 PM

Tall is better, but only in the fine line between 'grown' and 'mature'.

Mowing tall pasture is a good idea both to encourage fresh young growth and for baling of the more mature for use during the winter months if possible. It also allows more light to fall on new growth and can create 'bushier' growth.

One thing you can also do, is turn out the goats after the dew is gone for the morning, if you are able. No dew means worms can't move around.

The link is correct about johnes in goats 'causing' diarrhea VERY rarely. I work at a diagnostic lab, I asked the lead setup person and he said they NEVER had a positive goat fecal sample from a diarrhea. Always from pellets. Many people (and vets) think that the symptoms in goats/sheep and cows are the same, that is not the case. They also shed the bacterium into the environment at different rates, and generally due to the lower shedding of sheep/goats, a slightly longer culture time is required.). Other things are the same, such as the transmission routes, management tactics, other symptoms (wasting, hardening of intestinal walls), and the vasciallating shedding of the organism into the environment (they do not shed heavily all the time, but due to other things in their life, sometimes they shed a lot, other times they shed very little). This is why repeated herd screening is necessary.

moonspinner · #60 07/19/14, 05:45 PM

I struggled with a couple cases of "high resistant" BP on the same goats. Although I loved them both, after months and months of treating vet and I decided best choice was to euthanize. Since then no more occurance.