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  #21  
Old 12/03/13, 06:12 PM
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The little guy didn't make it. When I went back to check on him again Sunday night, he was already gone Thanks for all of the help though, I really appreciate it!
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  #22  
Old 12/03/13, 06:29 PM
 
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Well durnitallanyway.

I'm so sorry. You worked so hard, and he tried, too, I'm sure... Sometimes, no matter how hard we try, it doesn't turn out the way we want. {hug}
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  #23  
Old 12/04/13, 12:17 PM
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I am so sorry you lost him.
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  #24  
Old 12/04/13, 01:14 PM
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Well Dang. Sorry. Im seeing that its real hard to save them once they get that bad. I feel lucky to have my young buck now.
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  #25  
Old 12/04/13, 08:58 PM
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Could he have had johnes disease? The symptoms sound similar.
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  #26  
Old 12/05/13, 10:13 PM
 
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I'm sorry you lost him.
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  #27  
Old 12/06/13, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenstar View Post
Could he have had johnes disease? The symptoms sound similar.
Goats do not get the diarrhea like cattle do.
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  #28  
Old 12/06/13, 01:04 PM
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I am no expert and i may be misinformed. We lost several that had similar symptoms to hers. In researching the symptoms i ran across numerous mentions of johnes in goats. Diarrhea was always mentioned as one of the symptoms. This thread caught my attention because the symptoms seem to closely match what we observed in ours. I would love to know for sure what it is so we can treat our herd effectively if it is seen again
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  #29  
Old 12/06/13, 02:34 PM
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Did you have Johnes disease diagnosed by a diagnostic center? Most vets do NOT know goats... in discussing with vets, I've had to supply several of them with the information that Johnes is not known to cause diarrhea in goats. Johnes positives do have a depressed immune system so perhaps they are more likely to get diarrhea for otehr reasons - by far johnes positive animals have solid poops.

Not only do I maintain a Johnes free herd, I have worked for a few years at MSU's DCPAH where I can pick the brains of people who are familiar with Johnes. I do lots of my own research on my own time reading up on publications, and have also done undergrad research in the Molecular Pathogenesis lab here at Michigan State U with Johnes disease. I like johnes, lol. I actually applied to Wisconsin-Madison as one of my schools of choice for Vet School mainly because of my interest in Johnes... well, and because I also like Dairy.

I'm at work now (MSU's DCPAH) and just asked the man who does johnes setup and has for years now - he's never even had a johnes positive diarrhea from a goat. Cows, yes... Every johnes positive from goats has been PELLET feces. Most publications I look at mention that diarrhea is not really a symptom of johnes in goats in most cases.

Merck says no diarrhea with goats (look under paratuberculosis) : http://www.merckmanuals.com/vet/mana...20goats&alt=sh

Here is their article on COWS: http://www.merckmanuals.com/vet/gene...erculosis.html

Johnes.org is a GREAT resource for learning about Johnes. Johnes.org says that diarrhea in positive goats is not a common symptom.

If you suspect a johnes problem in your goat herd, the only thing to do is start testing, managing the disease for elimination, and strict culling. If you'd like help with any of that, I would love to help answer your questions and direct you to research, testing facilities, and interpretation of test results - because no one test is definitive and due to the way mycobacteriums work, the elimination is a long drawn out process. Johnes disease is incurable. To start, I'd probably do ELISAs on blood and pooled fecal cultures. Necropsy if one dies.
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  #30  
Old 12/06/13, 04:12 PM
 
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Johnes in cows has a definite type of diarrhea: Projectile. The film I saw showed a cow splash a gusher of feces off a wall.

Impressive and sad.

Johnes is a lousy disease, and it affects different species in various ways. The only Johnes-positive goat I ever saw up close and personal was wasting away, but did not have diarrhea. She looked so bad you'd have expected it, though.
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  #31  
Old 12/06/13, 10:21 PM
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Thanks for the links and all the info. In light of that, what would the most probable culprit be? Cocci?
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  #32  
Old 12/06/13, 10:43 PM
 
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Worms and cocci are the number one killer of all goats. No way to really know without a necropsy, and even then, there could still be questions.
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