Hot Topics in the Goat Forum

[CaliannG]

Originally Posted by francismilker

I will say, however, that I'm not tech or forum savvy enough to know what GMO means! If this is referring to threads like the "great dehorning" debate or other passionate issues I say let them alone. The "regulars" that call this subforum home don't own it or pay taxes on it. If someone like myself drops in to browse thread titles and weighs in with their opinion I should be pm'd by the mods and asked to simmer down.

francismilker, GMO means "Genetically Modified Organism". Lately there has been a lot of debate on other sub-forums about GMO corn and alfalfa, and their safety as food for livestock and humans We're not talking about things like the "Great Horn Debate" or the "Disease Culling Debate", or even the "Great Testing Debate" (although it has been a long time since we have had the latter two, as standards have changed), that are easy to see are exceptionally goat related, but borderline hot topics, where it could be argued that they technically might belong in other threads.

And no one is saying that people should not drop in and discuss goats or goat issues, or ask abut goats or even have opinions about goats. It is, after all, the Goat Forum. The dissatisfaction is with people who do NOT want to discuss goats, goat issues, ask about goats, or who don't even have goats and never would want goats coming into this forum because one of their "pet" topics is being discussed and they want to beat people over the head with their opinions in an aggressive manner.

It would be kind of like if every time someone wanted to discuss raising rabbits in colonies in the rabbit forum, people who don't have rabbits and don't even want rabbits came barging in to tell everyone that cage free was the ONLY humane way to raise ANYTHING, and that anyone who thought differently and managed their rabbitry any other way were greedy, stupid, cruel idiots who should be turned into Animal Control. But they said it in such a way that they were just *barely* within the rules. Now imagine that EVERY time the rabbit folks tried to discuss this topic and get some information from other rabbit folks, 3 or 4 of these people would storm in and do that, turning the thread into a debate of whether or not cage raising is humane. After a while, wouldn't you get pretty annoyed with them? You'd never be able to discuss the differences in kitting doe management between the two practices, or coccidia control, or the difference in feeding and cleaning practices, or even raw numbers like production differences, because these few jerks, who don't even know a thing about rabbits come in every time to turn the thread into a discussion about which method was more humane.

It would get old in pretty short order, wouldn't it?

[anita_fc]

My thoughts, FWIW -- I don't mind seeing discussions that are labeled GMO in the subject line. I resent it very much when another topic gets hijacked by GMO as one of the comments.

I would suggest that if someone wants to present GMO info in response to another thread, it should be separated into its own thread.

[cmharris6002]

Because the issue of GMO's is tied directly to our goat's feed and milk I feel it is important to be able to freely discuss the subject when it is pertinent to the conversation. On an open forum we will surly have mixed options which are all due respect. Hostility is against the rules and hijacking spoils the fun and educational value of the discussion. We need to try to stay focused and not make this topic off limits.

I'm not on very often and it seems like I always manage to miss all the drama

[Shygal]

If you want to see a hot topic, go in the Gardening forum and ask about growing potatoes in tires, or ask about till vs no till

[Alice In TX/MO]

Passion about Potatoes? Tension about Tilling? I'm just shocked and appalled.

[CageFreeFamily]

Originally Posted by anita_fc

My thoughts, FWIW -- I don't mind seeing discussions that are labeled GMO in the subject line. I resent it very much when another topic gets hijacked by GMO as one of the comments.

I would suggest that if someone wants to present GMO info in response to another thread, it should be separated into its own thread.

This is a pretty tricky and specifically discriminatory rule here. Sometimes topics drift. A person makes a perfectly on topic response that builds on or drifts the conversation into a new light. This is not hijacking, it's how conversation and communication works among humans. How often can a group of people sit in a room and talk while never adding something new to the topic at hand?

GMO discussion offends some. Horn discussion offends others. Testing, culling, etc. We all have different opinions based on widely different experiences, backgrounds, education, etc. Asking a person to never bring something up unless it's in it's own labeled thread is a little extreme.

People need to be able to exist among others who have different opinions without needing to censor them. Expecting responsible and respectful behavior is great, but telling people that they can never bring something up in their comment is pretty extreme.

[francismilker]

Originally Posted by CaliannG

francismilker, GMO means "Genetically Modified Organism". Lately there has been a lot of debate on other sub-forums about GMO corn and alfalfa, and their safety as food for livestock and humans We're not talking about things like the "Great Horn Debate" or the "Disease Culling Debate", or even the "Great Testing Debate" (although it has been a long time since we have had the latter two, as standards have changed), that are easy to see are exceptionally goat related, but borderline hot topics, where it could be argued that they technically might belong in other threads.

And no one is saying that people should not drop in and discuss goats or goat issues, or ask abut goats or even have opinions about goats. It is, after all, the Goat Forum. The dissatisfaction is with people who do NOT want to discuss goats, goat issues, ask about goats, or who don't even have goats and never would want goats coming into this forum because one of their "pet" topics is being discussed and they want to beat people over the head with their opinions in an aggressive manner.

It would be kind of like if every time someone wanted to discuss raising rabbits in colonies in the rabbit forum, people who don't have rabbits and don't even want rabbits came barging in to tell everyone that cage free was the ONLY humane way to raise ANYTHING, and that anyone who thought differently and managed their rabbitry any other way were greedy, stupid, cruel idiots who should be turned into Animal Control. But they said it in such a way that they were just *barely* within the rules. Now imagine that EVERY time the rabbit folks tried to discuss this topic and get some information from other rabbit folks, 3 or 4 of these people would storm in and do that, turning the thread into a debate of whether or not cage raising is humane. After a while, wouldn't you get pretty annoyed with them? You'd never be able to discuss the differences in kitting doe management between the two practices, or coccidia control, or the difference in feeding and cleaning practices, or even raw numbers like production differences, because these few jerks, who don't even know a thing about rabbits come in every time to turn the thread into a discussion about which method was more humane.

It would get old in pretty short order, wouldn't it?

Thanks for the clarification caliannG. I appreciate it. I'm not here often enough to know what had been deleted so I had a clue.

[Frosted Mini's]

If people are so offended, then DON'T READ IT! LOL. If you don't like what I am writing, skip to the next comment (and no, I haven't had any part in any GMO discussion...). Just saying, if you are reading something, and you don't like it, you really don't HAVE to keep reading. Shocking, isn't it?

[MaddieLynn]

I think we should be allowed to discuss it with a few rules in place. For example, no swearing and no personal attacks. Or something like that. And then if a member violates these terms, the *member* should be punished, not the entire forum by removing the ability to talk about hot topics. But that's just my opinion.

[anita_fc]

Originally Posted by Frosted Mini's

If people are so offended, then DON'T READ IT! LOL. If you don't like what I am writing, skip to the next comment (and no, I haven't had any part in any GMO discussion...). Just saying, if you are reading something, and you don't like it, you really don't HAVE to keep reading. Shocking, isn't it?

Nancy, that's exactly what I do. However, from time to time, a topic will make a hard-turn and go completely away from what the OP was asking about. People get so caught up in all the info on the side trip that they may not find their way back to the OP's question.

That's all I was referring to regarding thread hijacking. I'm not talking about making a hard fast rule. I'm simply suggesting that everyone be cordial. If I'm going to bring up a side issue triggered by someone's question, I'll post a new thread indicating so; i.e. New topic; was Other Topic. That lets people know that it's a side discussion triggered by the original topic, but it doesn't derail the OP's thread.

[CaliannG]

Since we have a couple of GMO topics going on, both of them at multiple pages, I thought I would bump this. How are ya'll feeling about it now?

[farmerDale]

Feeling GREAT!!!

[Minelson]

I feel bad for the Mods having to patrol them so closely. I think the discussions fit in better up in the Homesteading Questions better because it is such a broad subject that covers many species and people....not just goats. Now that they lifted the moratorium up there it will take some of the heat away from the goat forum. I feel bad that Sherry might leave the goat forum over it. That would be a big loss to us

[CaliannG]

Hey, farmerDale! There are several other threads ranging in topics from how to send blood in for disease testing and which tests to get, to breeding questions. Why don't you post on them and dazzle us with your knowledge of goats?

Min, I PM'ed Sherry and sent her lots of love. I think all of us should do the same. WE don't ridicule her, after all.

[farmerDale]

Originally Posted by CaliannG

Hey, farmerDale! There are several other threads ranging in topics from how to send blood in for disease testing and which tests to get, to breeding questions. Why don't you post on them and dazzle us with your knowledge of goats?

Min, I PM'ed Sherry and sent her lots of love. I think all of us should do the same. WE don't ridicule her, after all.

I am in the research phase of goats, and I admit you would know a whole lot more about them than I do. See, I can accept that. Just as I feel I have good info to share on certain things.

Thank you for helping make my point: we all have various areas of expertise.
We have sheep, and have visited a goat dairy to learn some of the cheese making skills etc. to see if it is something we may be interested in. It seems we are heading down the path to getting a goat or two. We feed sheep already, and are tied down, may as well throw a goat in the mix, and get some milk and meat out of the deal. Right?

[Minelson]

Originally Posted by farmerDale

I am in the research phase of goats, and I admit you would know a whole lot more about them than I do. See, I can accept that. Just as I feel I have good info to share on certain things.

Thank you for helping make my point: we all have various areas of expertise.
We have sheep, and have visited a goat dairy to learn some of the cheese making skills etc. to see if it is something we may be interested in. It seems we are heading down the path to getting a goat or two. We feed sheep already, and are tied down, may as well throw a goat in the mix, and get some milk and meat out of the deal. Right?

Don't just get one goat...you need 2 so they can keep each other happy. One goat would be very lonely. ....then the addiction begins!

[Pony]

Originally Posted by Minelson

Don't just get one goat...you need 2 so they can keep each other happy. One goat would be very lonely. ....then the addiction begins!

BWahahahahaha!

[CaliannG]

Definitely two goats, for companionship. And remember to keep them separate from your sheep, especially during breeding season. Rams WILL breed goats, but it will result in an abortion in about 2-3 months. Even if you have a buck or two, don't run them together and expect rams to breed sheep and bucks to breed goats...the rams always win dominance contests and just breed everything.

Read up on the diseases...they DO cross over. OPP in sheep is CAE in goats, CL will effect both, as will Johne's Disease, etc.

[farmerDale]

Thanks, now we are cooking! I do have alot of space, and good fences, and several seperate paddocks to split them all up. How much space for a pair of goats to not overgraze/browse? I may make a new little pasture this summer in a pice of natural forest area in the yard....

[Crazy Farmgirl]

I would l like to see people backing up claims and sharing links to research that has influenced their decisions. I prefer to base my decisions on science not someone elses opinion.