Since y'all are so helpful ...

PrettyPaisley · #41 08/26/12, 09:09 PM

I have already showered but I will GLADLY rub that towel all over myself. I just need to get the darn goats out of the way first.

Tell your DH thank you. <3

CaliannG · #42 08/26/12, 09:10 PM

I shall do so. Go milk a cow, hon.

CaliannG · #43 08/26/12, 09:13 PM

Oh, she will still be leaking birth goo...and I know it sounds gross, but you can get some from her back end and just smear it on your arms and let her lick them off.

ozark_jewels · #44 08/26/12, 09:14 PM

Sorry to hear that.

Surely need to check out the place selling $25 bull calves now! Maybe she will even take one if you get it really soon.

I would milk her out at least some tonight(all quarters evenly). The milking(calf sucking if it were alive), releases natural oxytocin which helps the calf expell the afterbirth. Especially important after a difficult labour.

I usually leave the dead calf with the mother overnight in cases like these so she can get used to the idea that its dead. Even if she doesn't seem to want it now, its better than taking it away and her spending all night wandering and mooing trying to find her "missing": calf.

Just give her plenty of water and hay/pasture. She will be fine. Watch to see if she expells afterbirth. If its still hanging by morning should use Oxytocin to help her clean out. The longer you wait, the harder it is. Calcium injections help the oxytocin to work its best.

Dead calves are extremely hard to pull. Glad you guys did it! Be glad his head wasn't twisted around to rest along his side. When a dead calf presents that way, that rubbery neck is darn near impossible to get turned around! At least with a goat you can wrap your hand around a dead kids neck, with a calf there is nothing to grab because its too big. A slippery ear that you can't see it hard to keep ahold of. Yes, I've done this more than a few times over the years.

wolffeathers · #45 08/26/12, 09:26 PM

Oh, I'm sorry for the calf. I am glad that you were able to get help and keep Mrs. Moo safe.

Country Wench · #46 08/26/12, 09:42 PM

Very sorry for you and Ms Moo.... glad she seems to be okay though - hag in there !

ETA: Ummm... that's "hang" in there....... *sigh*

noeskimo · #47 08/26/12, 10:18 PM

This stuff is hard. If it were easy, city people would do it

andabigmac · #48 08/26/12, 10:42 PM

Sweetie, you will never be ready. I'm so sorry you are feeling regret over the way things happened. You saved Ms. Moo. That is outstanding. Calling the vet earlier doesn't mean the calf would have made it.

I have pulled calves, piglets, puppies and foals. I have had happy and sad outcomes. I have never had to "go in" on one of my goats, though. I do not feel prepared for this despite the others I've been through. I will be on here having a panic attack with the vet on the phone while I type. I know I'll feel better the first time I actually go in. You'll have more confidence the next time too. Don't beat yourself up. You did good.

ani's ark · #49 08/26/12, 10:47 PM

I'm so sorry you lost him. Hope Ms Moo is okay. I saw your posts on the cattle forum and came back to check on the updates, found you on here. Not what you were hoping for. Hugs.

LoneStrChic23 · #50 08/26/12, 11:57 PM

Aw hon, I'm sorry

Don't beat yourself up, bad things happen & the "what ifs" can eat you alive....

1st calf I ever had to pull was a dead calf.... It had died God knows when, & rotted..... I was 15 & fishing out pieces bawling my eyes out......

At least your girl made it through & you can be there to comfort & spoil her.

Definately milk her out, and freeze that precious colostrum.... Hopefully you can find another calf for her soon, if not, then you can be her buddy...

Next time will be better.

Backfourty,MI. · #51 08/27/12, 02:17 AM

I am so sorry Shannon that the calf didn't make it but you saved Mrs. Moo by having the vet come out to help. We all learn best by our life's experiences & some things you just can't be prepared for until you go through it. Don't beat yourself up, it sounds like you did everything you could & should have.
Big Hugs!

Ranger · #52 08/27/12, 04:40 AM

I'm sorry. How is Ms. Moo?

PrettyPaisley · #53 08/27/12, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ranger

I'm sorry. How is Ms. Moo?

I let her out of the barn late last night because I figured she was thirsty (moved the water out of the barn because of water issues) and she was very thirsty. Just went to let the goats out and she was lying in vigil right outside the barn door.

By now she is usually in the pasture eating. It just breaks my heart to see her sad.

gwithrow · #54 08/27/12, 06:07 AM

start calling the dairies around and see who might have a bull calf for sale..I am not sure where you are but I have a friend who raises dairy bulls and seems to find them fairly easily...thanks for sharing your experience it may help someone else.

Cliff · #55 08/27/12, 06:46 AM

Shannon I'm sorry to hear that

Just saw this thread...

PrettyPaisley · #56 08/27/12, 09:23 AM

Found a bull calf born this morning about 10 miles up the street. The guy says I can come get him about 6pm tonight.

Ms Moo will not let me milk her. She will stand and let me touch her but I think her udders are so sore the pain makes her kick. What do I do? She is as hard as a rock and I have got to get that milk.

andabigmac · #57 08/27/12, 09:40 AM

Be persistent even if you just milk onto the ground. Once a bit of the pressure is relieved she'll hopefully calm down enough to let you milk into a bucket. If she keeps the kicking up you can call a vet to give her a shot to calm her down.

I may get chewed out for this but I used to be a race horse midwife. When we had a mare that wouldn't let her baby suckle we gave her a Guinness Ale. We only had to call in a vet to sedate a horse once (crazy horse). The beer worked like a charm. I used it last fall on a sow that wanted nothing to do with her babies. She became mom of the year. If you have some on hand or live close to a store I'd say give it a try. If not, just try milking. Do you have a squeeze chute?

ozark_jewels · #58 08/27/12, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PrettyPaisley

Found a bull calf born this morning about 10 miles up the street. The guy says I can come get him about 6pm tonight.

Ms Moo will not let me milk her. She will stand and let me touch her but I think her udders are so sore the pain makes her kick. What do I do? She is as hard as a rock and I have got to get that milk.

Good on the calf!

On milking.....be persistant. If she is really swinging at you, you can take a rope( I like to use a soft rope) and tie it snugly around her body in front of her udder. Run it over her backbone and down her flanks basically. Tie it so there is a slip-knot where you can easily reach it high on her side. So you are basically cinching the cow behind her ribs, in front of her udder. Not so tight that she stumbles, just tight enough it should keep her from really swinging at you. This has been used for generations and works well on a cow not locked down tight in a dairy barn. We have a flat parlour where we are on the same level as the cows, so we use this method in our dairy herd with just fresh heifers or witchy fresh cows.
We use this and it does NOT hurt them. It does keep them from taking my head off.

Also, as I teach all the kids as they learn to milk a cow.....the closer you are to the cow when she swings, the less it will hurt on impact. If you are snuggling right up against her flank, when she swings it will hit you as she starts her swing. Less impact. If you are standing as far out as you can, stretching your arms out to milk her, when she swings she will get a great swing and hit you at the extention of her leg. The impact will by MUCH more extreme. Trust me on this. It may go against your instincts to get closer to that big hoof, but trust me, its safer.
And really, most cows are comforted by the snuggling against the flank.

Sherry in Iowa · #59 08/27/12, 07:57 PM

Pretty Paisley..ya know I love reading your posts. I'm sorry about your calf too, but we've just about all been there.

I say this, being the old f-rt that I am. Get tough. Don't worry so much about Ms. Moo being uncomfortable. Take ahold and go for it. You do have a stanchion, right? You can tie her leg if she's going to knock your lights out..but milk her just the same. If ya don't..she could get mastitis and you'll really be in a pickle.

Also, I did read about this dilema on the cattle board first. There's something I'd like to say..and being as this is the Internet..and you don't know me..I want you to know that I'm not being snarkie or cold hearted. I'm trying to help ya if I can in any way possible.

I would NOT go lay by my cow when she is ready to have a calf. Not gonna happen here. Goats are one thing..cows are another ball of nature. We've had cows stop their labor because we walked out to check them..been around a lot of breeds of cows for a lot of years..don't know a single one that wanted me there laying beside them. There have been those that were plenty glad to see me when they were in trouble..but not when they are starting out.

You called the vet..you get major points. Never be afraid to jump in and help them if you can do it safely. You know why the calf could not come out..you will remember that if something like this happens again.

When we built this wee house..we put windows on every side of the house..many windows. I have a pair of binoculars and I can not tell you how many hours I've spent "staring from afar". Some have had me nervous enough to go check. Some have had me go help. But at least I give them the privacy that they naturally want/need to get the process rolling on their (and the calf's) time line. I learned that from a woman that I respected greatly. She had a huge house, second floor, many windows. She too could see every corner of every pasture. She was an awesome cattle woman.

I know Ms. Moo will successfully give you a calf next time. I pray she will raise the new calf for ya.

Don't stress it..everyone has to start new..everyone~

Alice In TX/MO · #60 08/27/12, 08:34 PM

Wondering how things are going.