We have a slight improvement - sick buck

OK, two thoughts here: (1) if it does have to do with something he ate, you can get tubes of charcole at Tractor Supply. Depending on his weight you could put 60 to 100 cc in him 3 times a day. It will absorb toxins.
(2) Does he have ANY type of injury anywhere besides the eye? I've seen two things that sometimes have at least some of these symptoms. the first is tetinus, and the second is rabies. Rabies is a long shot, but something to be very careful of. That would, of course, require a bite or exposure of salive from an infected animal into a wound or mucas membranes.

Well I'm giving it everything I have and any suggestions that come through, and I feel most importantly changing and improving treatment based on his symptoms. He really really scared me this morning. I thought he stopped breathing this morning, I broke down, but he coughed through it....

Treated him last night, 99.5 Temp, turned the barn heat up to 65, don't want to over do it, not sure what is a good temp for a goat who has a winter coat on...

Temp 99.0 this morning. Rasping/grugling with every breath. We treated him with Nuflor (again since last night) but we are at 6cc's now, 1.5cc more than recommended. I have 1/2 a bottle left. FBcomplex, Antitoxin. LA200 in the eye, listerine wash. Got about 18cc warm water enema. 2 People B1 orally. 1 Antioxidant pill as I figure it couldn't hurt.

I raided mom's strawberry patch & he ate about 20 leaves. I can tell he's hungry but he's chewing rather slowly. No signs of his eating his hay - flake untouched but the bedding is fresh hay so I can't be sure....Some of the strawberry leave stems he spits out, tired jaw maybe, don't know. Tried to give him the yogurt, only took 2 mouthfuls. It almost seems like he ate it only because mom wanted him too then stopped. Then I decided to give him strawberry leave yogurt. He ate about 6 of them then stopped. I offered him the crushed alf pellets (my brand-new hand-held beamix motor died while crushing them). He took about 3 mouthfuls then spit most out. He turned into the corner. Had a coughing fit. Rasping stopped. A minute later his breathing slowed to 1/3 what it was (it is fast). He tried desperately to get out the gate, turned to another corner, then returned trying desperately to get out again. then turned in the other corner. All this time his stomach breathing was barely visible. I was holding my breath....then he had a couphing fit and he started breathing heavy again. He's going on a decongestant and expectorant/antihistime now. The rasping has intensified since last night.

While I was there he peed maybe 4 T, then 10 minutes later about the same as would be normal, good sign. I have noticed he doesn't seem to put his head down-not for leaves or the gatorade that is low. Turned a basket upside down & placed the grain dish at a better height for him. His (warm) water is at that height already.

I couldn't find online that either one of our tractror supplies carried FBcomplex...going to skip that 1 hour long trip, just feed him 2 b-1 people tablets every couple hours throughout the day, injections FBcomplex until the bottle runs out, about 6 cc at a clip. Going to see if I can get my hands on Thiamine....much more useable B1 in there I'm sure.

It's not tetnus. He was vaccinated but no rocking horse stance at all. He's still standing.

Rabies has crossed my mind. He is not salivating anymore though. The bucks have no lgd's to protect them, just the horse & mini. Exposure is a possibility should a rabid animal meander into their pasture. He will go to UCONN Storres if he dies for a necropsy. We have a 55gallon barrel cut lengthwise we will fill with ice if and when we need to keep him cold. Morbid thought, but it is something we must make sure it wasn't if he passes.

His eye is the same. We have that opauque like collection towards the bottom, with that flat spot still. His eye was closed a bit more this morning but he opened it some. No response to my hand. Other eye is normal. Treating it but he has much bigger issues developing.

When it warms up I am going to take him for a short walk in the sunshine. If he doesn't seem sensitive to the light that is. I think it may help move some of the gunk in his lungs a bit, warm him up too.

Found some long grass behind the pool. Scrounging for greenery here, yet don't want to overdoe it either. I also remembered my beet patch. Once all the greenery is gone I will sacrifice those leaves.

I don't know how long he can sustain at a 99deg temp? Just for ha ha's I'm going to get another thermometer...need to make sure this one is still accurate, it is a re-used one from the household it wasn't new.

It's pretty bad but it could be worse. He could be down & not eating anything. I just wish we could see some more improvement. Since the 1 reading of 101 he has been in the 99 degree range. Now we have the heavy raspy breath so the respiratory has worsened.

HF

Not all of my goats are my friend. I went down to spend some time with him.

Found him with alfalpha pellet particals falling down his chin. I wiped his mouth. I measured out his decongestant and syringed it in his mouth. He sucked it down eagerly, he likes the cherry. Then I followed that with 6cc water which he drank.

I had ready some crushed B1 vitamins & zinc tablet, moistened. I thought we would go for a walk on the asphalt-the darkness radiates the heat. Outside temp is 60+. Nice day for a walk.

We stepped outside, him leading wonderfully. He tried to take me to the gate & pasture & his buck buddies. I led him away towards a clump of grass. I picked some & gave it to him. He took it, chewed a couple times, leaving the rest hanging out of his mouth. I tried to pull it out but he clamped down on the grass. Okay, he could have it. We walked around the small barn to see his buck buddies lounging in the sun on the other side of the fence. We stopped about 10 ft away, we just wanted him to see them not co-mingle. He layed down. I noticed his rear leg twitching. 1st time I've seen that. He started really having a hard time getting his breath when he layed down, I could hear his congestion. It was too much for him. He stood up. The sound lessened.

He headed for a "corner" depression of miscellaneous farm stuff. Kinda like he wanted to hide. I let him, then decided it was too weird....also in the shade defeating the purpose for our walk.

We headed back to the asphalt & the barn door - I wanted to grab something & get that grass out of his mouth, didn't want him to inhale any of it. He lead beautifully, responding as always very easily to the lead. No swaying, tripping, head held almost all the way up. No more shaking of the back legs. I kept thinking that is such a good sign. If he was really ill, he'd be swaying or fighting me, showing weakness. I stepped inside the door, holding him & his lead just outside the door. Total time: 15 minutes, tops.

I got the baggie I was going to use to pull the grass. I stepped back outside and he layed down against the overhead door. He put his head down. Convulsed once or twice. I called his name. He lifted his head, and put it back down.

And my boy died right there.

Rest in peace my friend, I love you too.
6 years was far too short to have known you.

HF

:*(


so sorry.... you gave him above and beyond.... **hugs**

Oh, I'm so sorry. You tried so hard with him. Any chance of sending in a blood sample or something to get an idea of what was wrong to make sure you don't have to go through this again?

Thank you

We just returned from dropping him off for a necropsy. They have a holiday phone number we had to call to make the meeting arrangments.

Though he was vaccinated, I fear the cause of death will be pneumonia. It just fits too perfectly to not be, except the low temp. The eye, well that's a mystery, I pointed it out so maybe they will comment on it.

I will have rabies results late Monday, the rest of the report in 14 days.

This so socks.

HF

Oh no HF, so sorry he didnt make it. My condolences.

__________________
Bob and Nancy Dickey
Laughing Stock Boer Goats
"Seriously Great Bloodlines"
and the meat goes on....
Near Seattle

I'm so very sorry that you lost him. Consider yourself hugged.

__________________

I'm so very sorry (((hugs)))

__________________
Teach only Love...for that is what You are

It was so agonizing to follow this thread. You put in a remarkable effort which is doubly hard when you lose them. He's no longer suffering and with time you'll remember him with smiles.

I'm so very sorry.

BIG hugs

__________________
Fox Hollow Farm
Boer Goats
Heritage Poultry
Oregon
http://foxhollowfarm.biz/index.htm

The Earth Laughs In Flowers.

I am so very sorry you lost him, sending hugs Your way.

Thank you, I know you all understand.

I am grateful I retained his 4 year old daughter and 8 month old son, and will choose a kid or two from his kids I am expecting. I just wish I had retained more over the years.

HF

I wanted to update this thread with the results of the necropsy. I didn't want to start a new thread, I feel it's important to have the information in one place, here.

I'm hoping others will take into consideration something I totally overlooked. I want others to know the symptoms, so they can recognize them early enough to hopefully save a goat's life. Seeing the results I know now I could never have saved my buck, I doubt a good vet could have either.

I spoke with the doctor as I needed some help interpreting some (okay, a LOT) of the words.

The necropsy indeed indicated the eye was a laceration - 6mm in size. It was not visible until the eye was clearing up-and the other symptoms started.

My buck had (at least) 2 carnivore bites to his head & neck. 3-5cc holes, 6" apart. The doctor indicated it was a wolf, coyote, or large dog based on the size of the holes when I tried to narrow it down to the type of carnivore. They pulled 200ml of yellow/green fluid from the cavity in the neck area. He was infected. The entrance holes were not visible by looking at him, they found them when they turned his skin inside out. Rabies was negative.

There was yellow/green fluid throughout the head area where the bites punctured. This explains the eye.

There were many notations of torn, stretched muscling. This would indicate pulling by the killer and of course the buck trying to get it off of him.

His temperature being at 99 degrees indicates trauma. He was traumatized, but we did not recognize it. He was not acting any different than he normally acted. I've mentioned many times how mellow a goat he was. I could kick myself....I even questioned the 99 degree temp several times.....I should have realized he was in shock, but how could I have he acted like always? There was NO blood, nothing other than the eye.

A lung sample is out for an aerobic testing. However he had fluid build up between the lung lining, and another area associated in the neck area. The Dr. indicated pleurosy, but did not specifically state pneumonia (which he was vaccinated for) He also had some swelling in his testicle from a cut of some sort. They indicated that these, and other minor notations, could possibly be symptoms of secondary problems brought on by the initial attack, she could'nt say for sure but surmmized that was the case, and overall it was too much for him.

We are guessing that whatever it was took him on and he was too big. He's the biggest goat I own(ed) - 153 lbs and had a nice rack of horns, and a huge skull. He was strong - all muscle. Maybe he fought him off by himself, maybe another goat helped him, maybe the mini horse attacked (she takes on our dogs who don't belong down there), the full size horse or??? We simply don't know. I hope my buck was able to deal it some damaging blows, maybe I'll walk the perimeter looking for a body or blood (just let me muse here, it makes me feel better).

Right now I'm just feeling a guilt trip-our buck pen (that had it's own LGD at one time) toppled a year ago. We never got around to fixing it, the bucks went in the large pasture. We had 4 (but now 3) LGD's to protect the animals. What kills me is the large pasture cannot have LGD's - too much action going in and out therefore no protection for the bucks. There are (or were) 7 of them.

My does have the best protection - chainlink, electric, and the lgd's.

They are working on a solution to this killer, I can assure you the problem will be taken care of as soon as the opportunity presents itself. In the meantime the fence WILL get fixed. I might even get another pup after this. DH wouldn't dare say no after this.

I hope this is making sense, and I hope this helps someone, somewhere, recognize some of these symptoms to diagnose a problem with unusual symptoms. I was at my wits end trying to figure this out.

Though I am sorry we won't be buried here on the farm, I am glad we decided to send him out because we never would have suspected this. How could we? At least now there is closure and moving forward we can take steps to make sure this doesn't happen again (by that killer).

I don't think I'll be sleeping much until this comes full circle.

HF

Wow. I'm sure you were not expecting those results! I am so mad at the killer so I can just imagine how you must feel. Don't beat yourself up about the buck pen. You can't fix everything all the time...you can just do the best you can. I can see why that would be put on the back burner since you had somewhere else to put him. I'm so sorry he was attacked..sounds terrifying! The eye makes sense now...and puncture wounds are so hard to find until they abcess. I am so sorry for your loss and hope you figure out who the killer is asap. (((hugs)))

__________________
Teach only Love...for that is what You are

don't beat yourself up. You dealt with the symptoms that you could see. We all learn from each other and I, for one, appreciate your update.
Sorry you went through this.... **hugs**

You did everything you could! Sounds like we would all have missed the injuries since you couldn't even see them. I sure hope you catch the killer, we'll all be rejoicing with you on that day!
Sending hugs your way & praying you catch the culprit really soon!!

Happy Farmer thank you for having a necrosy done, I have learned alot.
Im wondering if this could be made into a stickey? Good info!
At the expense of your beloved.

__________________
Bob and Nancy Dickey
Laughing Stock Boer Goats
"Seriously Great Bloodlines"
and the meat goes on....
Near Seattle