CL question

I think that is why it is so much more common in meat herds around here. A milking herd would not choose to keep a goat with any abscess, but rather send her to a meat sale or at the very least pasteurize their milk before use. Meat buyers don't care because the meat is cooked while milk isn't always pasteurized. Because of the increasing latino population there seem to be lots of chivo dealers at any goat sale now a days. And they just don't care because the meat is cooked before use.

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Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

Actually, they don't care as much because the cysts, even internal ones, are not in the MEAT, the muscle fiber, but instead attached to glands in the intestinal system.

Once the animal is butchered and cleaned, there aren't any abscesses.

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Peace,
Caliann

"First, Show me in the Bible where it says you can save someone's soul by annoying the hell out of them." -- Chuck

Ahh. That's why. And that's why it is so common all over this area, too. Most people raise the Boer herds because there is so much more money in it due to the increasing ethnic population and their preference for goat meat. There just aren't large dairy herds, only families who happen to raise dairy for personal use. And it just doesn't seem like anyone is that concerned about the disease, probably because most are meat farmers.

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Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

I had the exact same experience with the abscess listed above. Not cottage cheesy, no smell... The only reason I would even suspect CL is because the guy that gave me the goat said that she and her mother had been exposed to a CL goat once (he tested and they were negative), then again but the second time he didn't want to do the expense of testing again and instead culled. He said he was going to get out of goats and get a Jersey cow, less headache, he said. So the mom when butchered, never did have any lumps anywhere. Then about six months later I get this abscess just like described above on the daughter. We treated it just like they did, too and burned everything. It's healed nicely. She's pregnant. I'll be pastuerizing the milk, just like I did with the Mom. the issue at our house hasn't been so much the disease factor, but that my husband and daughter don't like the smell of goat milk. They are used to cow's milk, but our land isn't big enough to support a dairy cow. We will see how things go. In a couple weeks or so I'm going to have a kid born and lots and lots of milk, I hope. I know that I probly won't be getting any more goats, though, and maybe not breeding again for fear of spreading the disease. Does anyone know how long you go without lumps showing up before it's safe to say "ok, we can invite other goats here, now". ? I have been researching and looking for that answer for a year now and still haven't got a lot of straight answers about CL because everybody's too busy arguing about it.

If it was CL, lancing and cleaning it probably just spread the infection.

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"""abscesses lanced and flushed with an iodine solution. Any lancing of abscesses should be done so that the purulent material can be collected and environmental contamination prevented. """

http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/in...m/bc/10801.htm
It's under treatment of CL in goats and sheep in the Merck Vet Manual

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Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.

I've always been told to not lance an abscess - have it removed whole if possible and send in for testing. That reduces the spread of the contagion.

Just because lancing is listed as a method of treatment, does not mean it minimizes the transmittance of the disease - in the case of a messy abscess, being sure to sanitize the wound, area around the wound, clean up all 'touched' items, and be sure that no future ooze will come from the opened abscess means that it could very well still spread it.

I have never once seen that you can't own animals for 50 years. However, there is truth to it infecting people, horses, rabbits, cows - maybe other animals. I just opened the Merck VM and I founds something interesting - horses get a the same disease, but slightly different bacteria. Cows get a mix of horse/goat types, goats get a specific kind as well. Fascinating. At least now I don't have to worry about horses bringing it into goat herds, if I ever got a horse. Of course, a sale barn animal could still carry it on hooves. And cows still aren't safe.

I have always heard that it can stay in the soil for up to 10 years. Since it is non-endospore forming that is a difficult trick, IMO. The more I read books like the Merck Vet manual it seems that it lives just a few years. This is variable with exposure amounts (direct sun, dry climate, or 'dilution' by a lot of rainfall obviously will reduce viability/concentration of bacteriums) so keeping a clean pen and areas helps a lot. If I ever had to deal with it, I would probably act as though it lived in the soil for at least a few years.

(Merck Vet manual - says months alive in soil/bedding)

http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/in...ulosis%2cgoats

(Goat Medicine - says up to 30 months in soil). It also scares me with vertical transmission - dam to kid in utero - and also through biting flies.

Goat Medicine - pg 67

As for meat carcasses, last I HEARD was that if 2 abscesses or more are found in the carcass, the carcass is discarded and cannot be used for consumption. I just went looking and found this article saying visceral abscesses (internal) condemn the carcass:

http://goat-link.com/content/view/101/96/

A little more official (Goat medicine google e-book) saying that visceral abscesses can mark down or condemn a carcass:

Goat Medicine

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Dona Barski

"Breed the best, eat the rest"

Caprice Acres

French and American Alpines. CAE, Johnes neg herd. Abscess free. LA, DHIR.