can lamanchas and dwarf nigerians live together?

Oat Bucket Farm · #21 11/25/10, 05:24 PM

Happy Thanksgiving back at ya Pony!!

I think just to make sure that the troll stays gone, we should not feed it.

waygr00vy · #22 11/25/10, 07:37 PM

I have Nubians and ND's together. They get along fine but I do have issues when feeding. My ND's need a lot less grain than the nubians so without seperating them, my ND's tend to get a bit plump while my nubians tend to be a little thinner than I like. I recently seperated them to put more weight on. Its not a problem when they are in milk b/c you grain them on the milkstand.

Kshobbit · #23 11/26/10, 09:58 AM

I feel really sorry for Spiritrider. I have been raising dairygoats since 1976 so not a newbie to the homesteading life. I raise full size goats, used to be Nubians and Boers, but now have LaManchas, all full sized. I remember when Nigerian Dwarf goats appeared on the scene. They are really amazing goats and I have thought about getting some too. The plus side to the ND's size is more homesteaders on small plots of land can have a goat or two or three. They are easier for the ladies to handle. I quit raising Boers when my favorite buck demolished a cattle panel! He was just playing too. Dwarf goats have a place on the homestead. I thought this forum was here so us old (er) homesteaders could help the newbies.

thaiblue12 · #24 11/26/10, 05:39 PM

I am not even going to bother to defend myself. I could careless what Spiritrider thinks. Those of you who "know" me, know how I raise my goats.

Hopefully he/she is gone for good

I hope everyone had a Happy Thanksgiving. I am off to tend my goat mill goats, darn things won't stay in their tiny cages lol.

Shygal · #25 11/27/10, 08:35 AM

Well, I'm a newbie and not ashamed to admit it. This forum has been very helpful to me learning about my two wethers, even though seems to be full of goat enablers

CaliannG · #26 11/27/10, 11:16 PM

Goat enablers? Here? Say it isn't so! (looks sideways at Thai)

My herd currently has four goats (Oooh! I am well on my way to being a goat mill!) consisting of 1 Nubian doe, 2 Mini does, and 1 ND buck.

I can get, somewhat, where spiritrider is coming from. My Minis were sold to me as *Nigerians*...and at the time, I didn't know enough about either NDs or Pygmies to know the difference. They were *obviously* smaller than the standards I was accustomed to seeing.

The seller seemed to be a qualified goat person who happily showed me paperwork on their tests and shots, gave references, etc., etc., but as it turned out, she was just as ignorant about those goats as I was at the time.....

(Not that it matters. I am keeping my Mini girls forever and every, amen.)

So, I can see how someone who might have gotten gyped in the same way, expecting one thing and getting another, might be just a widdle bit testy about the situation and taking out that frustration on others that she feels are doing the same thing as the person who gyped her.

A note to spiritrider: I know you are reading this under some nick or another, because you are human, and we humans just can't stand not knowing what other people are saying about us.

IF you were attempting to insult others here by inferring everyone here is ignorant and inexperienced, you missed your mark if only because if YOU were experienced and knowledgeable, you would never have gotten taken by someone selling minis as standard sized goats...you would have been able to see the difference right off.

If you were attempting to insult people here by comparing them to backyard dog breeders and puppy mills, you missed the mark again by a long shot. You are assuming that because NDs and Minis are smaller, they are pets rather than livestock.....and those of us here that are (at least now) experienced, know differently...as do the millions of those little goats in Africa, where, guess what, the ND originated.

Calling anyone here a goat (puppy) mill is just as ludicrous as calling a Piedmontese breeder a cattle (puppy) mill. People that are breeding and selling to the pet industry don't swap recipes for BBQ.

Anyone want a recipe for roasted Fido? No? How about Tamales a' la Fluffy? No?

Isn't anyone here adventuresome enough for dog and cat recipes? I mean, I see recipes for goat sausage here, and all sorts of stuff....wait, you mean that dogs and cats *aren't livestock*??

At any rate, spiritrider, when you come back to the HT forums, and especially this forum, under another nick and a different account (because you have been so ill-mannered, impolite and ill-bred that you have alienated everyone and have to start over), please have enough primate skills to exhibit learning behavior, and don't stick your foot in it so much next time.

I can understand why and how you might feel justified in your anger towards those who go for the smaller breeds.... but that doesn't excuse acting like a jerk.

Oat Bucket Farm · #27 11/28/10, 11:20 AM

Caliann

You said it all and you said perfectly.

Cannon_Farms · #28 11/28/10, 11:33 AM

if some one gets ripped its their own fault for not learning more before taking the plunge, a great deal of us learn the hard way. And whos to say that person fed and medicated properly and the goats are not small because of worms or coccidia or being fed improperly

Kshobbit · #29 11/28/10, 12:56 PM

Perhaps if spiritrider had come to the forum prior to buying the goats he/she would have been given some good advice by all of us "goatmill" folks. The first two goats I bought were stunted, but so sweet. Their first year had been spent on a chain, expected to eat the weeds out of the front yard, then bred too small. Their babies were actually my first mini's but that phrase had not been invented yet. I didn't know squat about goats at that time but have learned lots since then. I am so glad I did not let that experience sour me on goats.

CaliannG · #30 11/28/10, 03:20 PM

~grinz~ We have ALL gotten taken in one way or another when we were new to goats, or even new to a specific breed or practice!

I was a second-in-line to get taken by a pretty, blue-eyed boy....a lady bought him to add those blue eyes to her herd, and then sold him to me....

NEITHER of us realized that he was a wether, and not a buck, because neither of us had seen the aftermath of a burdizzo castration before....he just looked like he had small balls.....

We all get learning curves. Sometimes it is our ability to trust that gets hit...the buyer that swears they will pay the the remainder of the purchase price on payday, the seller that swears that lump is a vaccination site.... We have an entire world like that, not just goats.

And going to a place where some knowledgeable folks are happy to give advise (and get it sometimes, too!) is an invaluable resource.

I don't think spiritrider has goats right now.

Can any of you that either *currently* have goats or are expecting to GET goats in the near future imagine just stalking off of a GOAT forum because you are miffed at what people are breeding? No matter HOW snarky some of my goat forums can get, or how slow a couple of them are, and even some are academically far above MY head, I cannot imagine just stalking off of ANY of them.

I do, after all, still NEED the information they can provide, if not now, then some time in the future. Getting miffy and "I'm taking my ball and going home!" would be cutting off my nose to spite my neighbor. What if some crisis happens and I lose my mind and can't remember the dosage for Penn G or LA200? What if all three of my does decide to give birth in the SAME hour, all of them with quads and all having some trouble or another?

Then I'd be stuck crying for help to people I have been all snobbish and nasty to, AND wondering if anyone is going to answer my crisis because I have been all snobbish and nasty.

thaiblue12 · #31 11/28/10, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaliannG

Goat enablers? Here? Say it isn't so! (looks sideways at Thai)

Hey why are you looking at me sideways?

lol Of course I am an enabler, I admit it right under my avatar lol.

I will continue to do what I do and breed what I want to breed. Don't like it? Don't buy it.
This time Nibbles the giant Nubian better be pregnant with my short blue eyed Nigie. He and I have practically stood on our heads trying to get him to "reach". Want to crank out more of those minis, get them to the pet stores in time for the holidays, we goat mill people time it out for that reason, lol.

Signed,
Thaiblue backyard mill breeder of cock-a-cheewnie-poodle-doos aka mini goats

just in time for the Holidays, so get your designer puppy goats now for only $799 plus tax

lol

CaliannG · #32 11/28/10, 05:46 PM

If cross-breeding makes us all backyard goat mill breeders, what about Nubians?

I mean, they are not all THAT old a breed, and they came about by out-crossing English goats with those of Middle Eastern and African origins. Does that mean that Nubians are the ultimate Goat Equivalent of a Cock-a-Doodle-Chuggle-Poo?

Unlike dogs (and to a lesser extent, cats) and horses, "showing" goats and having "purebred" goats is a VERY new thing. Our OLDEST goat registry is the ADGA, established in 1904. The IDGR came about in 1924, with the AGS following in 1937. So, basically, the farthest anyone can trace their goats back is 106 years. The King Charles Spaniel that I had as a child could trace his pedigree back at least twice that far as a distinct breed. The Friesian that I used to drive when I was a carriage driver could trace her pedigree back SEVERAL centuries.

The first herd book registry published in this country was in 1914.
The British Goat Registry wasn't started until 1879.

Seriously, someone complaining about the "pure lines" of goats being "corrupted" by irresponsible breeders cannot have much of a clue about livestock. Ranchers corrupt "pure lines" of livestock all the time. Cattle ranchers around here will toss a Brahma or a Longhorn bull into their pasture if they start getting unacceptable disease losses. If calves start looking puny, they will toss an Angus or Beefmaster bull in there. Etc., etc.

Currently, they are "beefing up" the herds with Piedmontese...which doubles their meat production and miniaturizes them at the same time.

In cattle, smaller breeds have been developed with the small producer in mind: Miniature Herefords, Miniature Jerseys. Dexter Cattle became popular for their small size. Yet no one is accusing Miniature Hereford breeders of being "cattle mills" or breeding for the pet industry.

Pony · #33 11/28/10, 06:50 PM

Heck, I thought I had enough experience NOT to get taken when I bought my Snubian. She has a scarred udder, blown teats, and a nasty disposition.

I DID realize she had bad hooves, but I figured I could fix those.

ANYhow, let's get on with the fun of goaties, and if Spiritrider wants to come back and play nice, of course s/he will be more than welcome.

Pony · #34 11/28/10, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaliannG

If cross-breeding makes us all backyard goat mill breeders, what about Nubians?

I mean, they are not all THAT old a breed, and they came about by out-crossing English goats with those of Middle Eastern and African origins. Does that mean that Nubians are the ultimate Goat Equivalent of a Cock-a-Doodle-Chuggle-Poo?

Hey, there, now waitaminit!

I got me BLUE papers on my gal! That's IMPORTANT! The bluer the papers, the louder the Nubian. LOL!

CaliannG · #35 11/28/10, 08:17 PM

Is THAT the secret? So if I make sure that the papers are printed on, say green or pink paper, the Nubian will be quiet?

See, if I had ONLY known that, I wouldn't be heralded every time I stepped out of the door!

(DH says if the goats did NOT scream bloody murder every time they saw him, he'd think they didn't love him anymore.)

GoldenWood Farm · #36 11/29/10, 01:03 AM

You guys crack me up

. I was going to say if you want mutts look at the LaManchas. They are the true mutt LOL. They came from Oregon where I was born and raised and are the truest of mutts (which is why I love them!) and they even have them funny looking ears.

.

To the OP in regards to your questions I have found in my herd that nigerians and LaManchas get along great, so great that if you even TRIED to tell my Nigerian buck and my LaMancha buck they couldn't be together they might turn mutinous. Those two are little tweedle dee and tweedle dumb

. But so far I have never had problems with the smaller goats being with the larger ones. I have mini LaManchas running with them also and everyone is happy.

Those little ones have some BIG attitudes going for them and I figured with them being so short they could just go under whoever chases them. Funny little side story about that actually. My at the time yearling LaNubian doe Rhaps was always being terrorized by Rosie our Mini LaMancha. Rhaps never did figure out that if she just stopped running Rosie would go right on underneath her legs and never know it

. Funniest thing ever to see!

Justine