Do you have to dump milk if your doe is CL/CAE positive?

Here we have meat pens, you tell the auction it is to be sold only as meat and why, the vet stamps the card and there you go, the animal can not go to a farm or be bought by an individual. Its the honor system, but I have no problem with someone doing that. I think auctions are different in different parts of the country, but I bet if someone asked, that most auction houses do something similar.

I CL test but you have to be willing to interpret the results, kinda. If you buy from abscess free herds (which I do), or your herd is abscess free, and all the sudden you get a borderline or a positve for CL, most likely it is a false positive. Since it's only 80% accurate, it can be still useful in preventing the diease spread from INTERNAL abscesses, which is why I still do the blood testing. I've had a few borderlines and even a couple positive CL tests - never once in near 10 years of goat raising have I had a single abscess of any sort in any of my goats. You'd think by now that I'd have at least ONE show an external abscess, as from what I understand the internal ones are less common than the external ones.

Anywho, I'd immediately cull any CL positives, so I guess you could call that milk 'dumping'. I would NOT drink any milk from CL positives.

CAE I personally wouldn't mind drinking raw (it is a retrovirus but very species specific) but I'd only likely mess with it if I didn't have any kids to raise on the bottle. Otherwise I would likely just milk and feed to chickens/ducks. That way I could NOT mess it up. I also can all of my milk on the stovetop, for bottle feeding, so even if I did mess up I'm PRETTY sure I'd stop the disease in it's tracks. To keep from feeding completely dead milk I kefir it, so it's still beneficial to them. I have one keeper doeling still on the bottle, growing like a WEED and she is on kefired milk.

When I did have CAE positives I literally pulled kids straight from the doe, no contact, and didn't milk the does, Except sparingly to keep udders from being TOO painful... and then it was right on the ground outside of the iso pen. I then butchered at my earliest convenience. I loved those does but I did what was best for my herd

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Dona Barski

"Breed the best, eat the rest"

Caprice Acres

French and American Alpines. CAE, Johnes neg herd. Abscess free. LA, DHIR.

Who tests CL? I don't see where Bioprn offers such, just CAE, unless I'm overlooking it.

I have tested for CL with blood test. My vet sent the blood to Texas Veterinary Medical Diagnostic Laboratory. I bought one Nubian doe years ago, and noticed a small amount of swelling in one of her Lymph glands. I took her to my vet and they tried to draw fliud out with a needle. Nothing came out. I asked them to test her for CL and the results came back Pos with a 1:4 titer. Comments were Low titer, probably non-specific or due to exposure. Thank goodness she was still in isolation. I tested 12 other goats all with neg. results and have never had another problem.

WADDL and PAVL both test for CL.

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Dona Barski

"Breed the best, eat the rest"

Caprice Acres

French and American Alpines. CAE, Johnes neg herd. Abscess free. LA, DHIR.

KShobbit,

In Kansas, i have only found a miniscule handful that care about passing off diseased animals. First thing you do is if you find a goat you want, go see it, take a syringe and blood tube with you for every animal your looking to buy. write up a contract for purchase indicating that upon a clean test result you will purchase the animal.

Then draw blood have it tested and work from there.

I know of only about 4 or 5 goat folks that have clean herds. I Got an CL infected goatie due to some one who is very well known in the goatworld selling us a cl animal to us. They knew it and didn't care. It doesn't affect my fiber goaties so i keep them, as they are mostly pets now. So when they do die, i will dispose of them in a burn pit, then i will clean my property up. But i also do not allow my goaties to leave here either.

As far as drinking milk, i drink the milk, only if there is no abcess present. I toss it if there is. I lance them when they come up to prevent more spreading. I believe its safe unless one happens to be in the udder of which i haven't seen.

If i get any doelings from them, i am going to pull them at birth and bottle feed them off of my cow. I have another acre of land around my house that is separate from the pasture so they can live there until i get the pasture burned and cleaned up. FOr the most part i think burning the pasture, along with liming it, will clean the disease off of it, and leaving it fallow for about 6 months to a year will ensure it is clean as sunlight does kill the disease. The only other things that need to be done to clean up is to use formalin on all the posts, and barns, and fence wire. That will kill any possible contamination. As for the soil in the barns, i'll dig it out and compost it then put on my garden.

How do i know this works? We did it on another farm and in 1 year it was clean and new disease free goaties are running around on it.

Not a chance, you go to a auction you get what you buy. They don't disclose squat

The vet at auctions is a good point. Many people do not realize that all animals at an auction are checked by a vet before sale. If the animal has any CL lumps or swollen knees from CAE, it has to be sold as "meat only", so it usually goes to a chivo dealer. The meat is cooked before eating, so it is safe to be used as meat.
You don't have to kill and "burn" these animals. You can easily butcher them or sell them to butcher because they are safe for meat. And licensed vets must check all animals at auctions prior to sale. In fact, I have bought animals marked out at auctions for very little. A pig with rhinitis bought for two dollars is a GREAT buy. You cook it before you eat it, so there is no risk.

SH09- You were burned because you didn't know any better. It's just one of those lessons every breeder has to learn one way or the other if they want to maintain a clean herd. Only very new buyers or breeders who aren't concerned with CAE and CL will even consider buying goats from an auction. The sale barn is where culls end up. There is no other choice for most people. A responsible breeder culls heavily. The sale barn is a necessary evil. We send almost all our bucklings there without papers and no one has ever asked any health questions. They don't bring anything compared to how much I would sell them for privately - from a clean herd, excellent bloodlines, and registration papers......but, there isn't a huge market for bucks and wethers so the sale barn is the best choice for me. It is what it is. I don't think it's the seller's responsibility to monitor who buys the goats at auction. That's what private sales are for- and that's why a goat will cost you more if you buy it off the farm than it will at the sale barn. At auction, a goat's health status is really the buyer's responsibility. If you want a goat for pennies on the dollar of it's true value, you take your chances, imo.

A false statement and one likely to cause problems for lots of people.
This depends largely on the auction house and even what is being sold at auction.
On goat days at our local livestock sales barn there is no vet, he comes on Tuesdays for the dairy sale.
At the local Amish sale there is no vet ever. Any vet check is taken care of by the seller before the sale.

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Deja Moo; The feeling I've heard this bull before.

It is not a false statement. In this state every sale animal is checked by a vet before it is sold at the auction. The vets come directly to the auction barn and check each animal, plus there is paperwork and tags on each animal.

Don't say it's false because you are wrong. Perhaps it is not that way in every nation? But I know it is done here in this state at every auction because I have gone to hundreds of them at many sale barns and they are all the done the same way.

I agree. That said, I have never had to use an auction for sales.

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It would help if everyone put their location in their User CP (Control Panel) so that it shows on each post. Helps keep one from getting their panties in a wad.

The universal statement that a vet is at all sales is not correct at all auction sales across the whole country.

It may be valid for your location and/or state.

Sick animals are sold at auction in southern Missouri. I have never seen a vet at two of the smaller auction sales that I've attended. I know the sale at West Plains does have a vet, because it's MY vet, and I can't get help two days each week.

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Alice
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"No great thing is created suddenly." ~Epictitus

Yes, please, when you make a statement like "a vet is present at every auction" do put your location. I know vets are not present at auctions here.

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I believe in God's willingness to heal.

Cyngbaeld's Keep Heritage Farm, breeding a variety of historical birds and LaMancha goats. (It is pronounced King Bold.)

Barelahh, you are correct that the Kansas auctioneers do not discuss any health problems unless they are obvious. Those goats sell for little money. I did not take those goats to an auction to get rid of them at someone else's expense. I can not shoot or cut throats and bury or burn(how do you burn an adult goat?) I was upset because I bought the two CAE does at a BREEDING STOCK auction that was highly advertised and sponsored by the Kansas Meat Goat Breeders Assoc. In Kansas, if you buy from any of the local livestock auctions, it is buyer beware. I sell most of my goats to private breeders and point out any and all flaws before they buy them. The wethers and extra bucks go to the auction as well as does with bad udders, poor confirmation etc etc. Or I put them in my freezer. I love goats and try to be a responsible breeder but think sometimes goat people are a little anal retentive.(including myself)

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Living the good life in Kansas.

An adult goat can be burned by piling brush, limbs, old fence posts, etc., on it. A funeral pyre.

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Alice
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"No great thing is created suddenly." ~Epictitus

Maybe it is your location... In southern WI at the Equity Sales barn there is always at least two vets present for cattle, sheep/goat or pigs.
Lois

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Nigerian Dwarf goats and Spanish Mastiff livestock guards
www.fallcreekfarm.net
http://spanishmastiffs.blogspot.com/

It is the law in WI that you cannot sell any animal with a known disease without disclosure. That includes private sale or auction.
I suppose it would be traced back through the lab results if someone wanted to prosecute or file a complaint.
Lois

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Nigerian Dwarf goats and Spanish Mastiff livestock guards
www.fallcreekfarm.net
http://spanishmastiffs.blogspot.com/

I live on the edge of a small town (pop. 300). Most folks here think that I am slightly peculiar for loving and raising goats. If you have ever lived in a small Kansas town you know that you can not do anything without someone noticing and commenting on it. I just see and hear the comments if and when I build a funeral pyre for a goat and burn the body! Think of all the strange looks, calls to the fire department, and the EPA, possible commitment to our State Mental Hospital.
I had no idea that Kansas was the only state that does not have a vet at the livestock auctions or allows you to sell your culls at an auction. I was only talking about two CAE positive goats that looked healthy. And two goats with abscesses that did not have them when sold(incised, drained and antibiotics) I feel like some kind of criminal or lunatic. You must live in a very secluded rural area to blithely burn your culls, perhaps dance around the pyre, flinging flowers and drinking wine?????

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Living the good life in Kansas.

What a good idea! You left out Naked and By the Full Moon.

Seriously, a LOT of us on the board live VERY rural.

Burning carcasses is the preferred method of disposal.

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Alice
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"No great thing is created suddenly." ~Epictitus