cl injection?

Originally Posted by stanb999

Would you cull an animal automatically if it had a broken leg? Would you buy one that way? What is the difference?

Originally Posted by angelsprite

Vicky,
Wow! Y'all have been going to town on this thread.

( Yep, and I have enjoyed reading about CL on this thread. Thank you for the good links that gave me more info. While we have different logic, different experiences but both have goats, I feel obligated to respond.)

I can imagine, if the circumstances were just right, I might bring home a goat that had an abscess.
( BOY I CAN NOT imagine this for myself... never would I expose my darlin's to a possible CL abscess.. It is not a small problem. If one knowingly brings home an abscessed goat to a farm with clean goats - even separated - is the best definition of irresponsibility and even worse than rabies. A rabid animal is an immediate threat and looks menacing. A CL looks harmless. At least when the rabid animal dies, so does the active disease. The personal contact possibility no longer exists whereas CL possiblilty remains in the bio.)

... I would never ever knowingly bring home, like rabies, anthrax, brucellosis, or tuberculosis. With a little education, it's possible to get really top quality animals for almost no money because others are ignorant or fearful. Their loss is my gain, but I wouldn't advise ANYONE who hasn't had a good veterinary or biomedical science education at the TAMU Vet School, to bring home a sick or injured animal.
( It would be better said, others are KNOWLEDGABLE and fearful. It is not a gain for one to introduce CL on the farm to all of its residents. I suppose that formal education at TAMU is good, but honestly in this case, I think it might be harmful. If they are producing like-minded alumni, Vicki's work has increased and her words thus far are ineffective with the example we see.)

You are trying to insinuate that there is any way to know whether you have a CL or CAE free herd and that simply is not the case.
(Vicki isn't insinuating anything. She is stating outright. Rather to be safe than to be sorry; because sorry could be a lifetime. Newbies, don't touch anything that resembles CL is outright talk. )

That's what you set yourself up for with all these assurances that [fatal] culling creates CL free herds and asserting that your herd has no CL carriers in it.

(Actually most herds claims are that for a time certain no animal has had a clinical CL and all CAE tests have been negative. )

You keep insisting that it's your "job" to make people think like you do and about the "responsibility" to "educate" new people. … And if you want to educate people, go get a current education, a solid degree, a teaching certificate, do the thesis papers and have them accepted to float your hypotheses past peer review. Then maye, when you try to "educate" people, it won't be with information published decades ago, before anyone had a good grasp of molecular biology.
( OK. Vicki has demonstrated more knowledge on this site in one posting than most local vets practice; observationally speaking. Many posters have declared this to be true from across the country. The vet might know dog or cat care; but Vicki way surpasses in goat care. Her education is “ongoing.” She can't educate the goat-herder in English, but man they should take notes in her class on Goatish. Neither my BA in math/natural science or MA in Education educates me to a level superior to the degree earned in Hard Knocks and tested by the financials. Your good grasp on molecular biology will be obsolete in short order with some undiscovered theory. Her good grasp in goat management will not.)

In fact, some people are deeply emotionally bonded to their animals so that their quality of life and possibly even their own general health could be adversely impacted by someone forcing them to "cull it with a gun" as you suggested. In preparation for that, I will ask you to ponder this. Rabies is a disease that kills 100% of all the people and animals that are susceptible to it. If ever any man finds a rabid animal, it is culled immediately. This is the most effective culling program ever instituted. It includes both natural and artificial culling. If culling every animal and every person who ever gets rabies can eradicte the disease then why is the disease still so prevalent? Why isn't it gone? Every human, dog, cat, horse, cow, or goat that gets rabies dies, so why hasn't it been eradicated? Think about that and we'll talk about disease eradication and culling vs breeding for resistence next time.
( Those emotionally bonded to their animals should be the first to listen to Vicki. Protect them. . .I believe that I have read that rabies exist in wild animals like raccoons. When conditions are right during warm weather it becomes clinical. Therefore without identifying and exterminating all subclinical animals rabies continues. I believe that CL also exist in the wild. Fatal culling CL goats isn’t to eradicate it; just prevent other animals and people in an environment from knowingly being in close proximity to a contagious and diseased animal. My position remains to fatal cull a CL positive animal. I’ll let others who are educated in this disease pretend to breed for CL resistant goats. For me and mine, sorry. Six feet under.)

Originally Posted by LaManchaPaul

I have responded within the quote.

Originally Posted by Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians

You may like me do your own vetting, but having an abcess cultured at UC Davis is right over $100, nothing cheap about that (I called them to get a current price).

Vicki