That's great news. Thank you. He must feel a lot better after releasing that pressure.

also - temp was 101.4

Yipeee! I'm glad he is better...whew! Valsey, you have done an awesome job. :)

It sounds like Rocco is going to make it!! Keep up the GREAT work & keep giving him the AC, and don't inject it. He's still not out of the woods yet though. As bad as it sounds like he was it will take weeks for the stones & crystals to work out of his system. He will need the AC evderyday for the rest of his life even after he is better too just to make sure you & he never go through this again.

No- he's definitely not out of the woods. He's peed and pooped, but no more cud chewing. Right now I think this is the biggest problem. And so as wrong as it is, I'm not going to do the AC for a couple of days...right now he just needs to live.

I'm also going to try to get the 4-way acid pak.

I don't know what a 4-way acid pak is? But I really think the AC is a must, if one of those stones gets lodged & completely blocks him up he'll die because his bladder bursts inside him. That will be an awfully painful way to go.
He won't eat any type of hay? Is he drinking on his own? What about mixing him up some Electrolite water.....you mix 1 liter water, 2 TBSP sugar or honey. 1/4 tsp salt & 1/4 tsp. baking soda together. Make it with warm water & see if he'll drink any of that.

Were you giving him antibiotics? I was just thinking that I thought I remembered that antibiotics messed up the rumen? I can't really remember. Maybe try feeding him some yougurt in a big needleless syringe?

http://www.goatsuppliesandservices.com/product/AcidPak

Just nibbling at stuff - bark seems to be important to him.

Tried warm water and nutri drench. Gave probios and a bit of cud from another goat. Will give more fluids.

He's lifeless. Just standing there...maybe I'm over reacting...? Just how long can a ruminate go without ruminating?

Keeping you and Rocco in prayer. Please let us know as soon as anything changes.

If he munches on fresh browse, make a serious trip out to get some. Carry a big plastic trashcan sized bag. Mine love sweetgum stems/leaves, honeysuckle, greenbrier, kudzu, common privet (not the shiny leafed kind). Fresh browse is one thing that our goats will usually at least nibble on when they're not feeling well---and alfalfa hay.

Hi Nancy

I have been bringing him browse and take him out on a leash to get his own. And he has it available to him - he's just not terribly interested at all. I thought alfalfa would be a bad idea because of the UC, no?

Actually alfalfa is good because it has a higher than normal amount of calcium. That balances out the phosphorus.

Mine LOVE black rasberry leaves green or dried.

If his rumen slows down that can lead to acid buildup so it might be a good time to give him the baking soda.

I forgot, is he getting B vitamins? Just make sure and give him B vitamins regularly with his rumen off to prevent Polio, until he is back to eating normally.

No, alfalfa won't hurt him. It's not the calcium, it's the calcium to phosphorous balance that's supposed to be bad---too much phosphorous (think grain) and not enough calcium (alfalfa).

Anyway, if you're pretty sure he's not blocked again, then I think the most important thing right now is to get him interested in eating again.

When my 3mo old wether was very sick, the only thing he would eat besides browse was that chopped alfalfa you get in a plastic bag, mixed with smashed bananas. I don't know why, but he loved it. Does smell good.

I've been following this thread all along, but not enough knowledge about UC to contribute. Sure hoping he snaps out of it.

POLIO?! He can get polio?

Can you tell me what kind of B, how to give, and how much?

Thanks

If the rumen isn't working, yes, he can get polio. I don't know the dosage however, I'm sure someone here does.

http://dairygoatinfo.com/index.php/topic,83.0.html

You can get b complex which contains thiamin at your feed store. It has 100 mg per cc, at least mine does.

Goat polio isn't the same as human polio that caused by a virus. Goat polio is caused by thiamine deficiency. That's why thiamine injections cure it. In goats bacteria in the gut produce thiamine so if the gut stops functioning the bacteria stop producing it or maybe another bacteria uses it. I can't remember the last part but either way it's a lack of thiamine. The nice thing is that any extra thiamine is excreted in the urine so it's hard to overdose.

Thank you all

This is injectable?
How much should I give?

Will a paste for horses do?

Southerngurls link gives the treatment dose. I would assume the prevention dose would be less.

I've read that given orally doesn't work because the thiamine is broken down in the gut or at least that's how I remember it.

How is he doing?

Thanks - I missed the link the first time

Last night gave him 500 ml fluids and about 30cc yogurt. This morning his appetite has increased and he's drinking too. He's had hay, grass, leaves and a few nibbles on baking soda and minerals. He's pooped (not much) and peed a good bit, but still not chewing his cud. I got a marble-sized glop of cud from another goat mixed it with water and syringed it into him and shoved the remainder of the clump into his mouth - I think it all went down, but I'm not sure that it happened quickly enough.

I'm mad at myself for giving pen G yesterday now that I realize the antibiotics could well be stopping his rumen

Will go get B today.

Thank you

Just called the feed store - no vitamin B...great.

Can I get this at a pharmacy? Also, is this given SQ or IM.

Thanks again, and again...

All shots can be given SQ. There's no benefit to subjecting them to the extra pain of IM.

Your local vet should have injectible thiamine.

I'm thrilled to tell you all that Rocco is chewing his cud!!!

Should I continue with the plan of B complex?

My challenge is to get the AC into him now and hope that doesn't upset this fragile balance. I've tried peanut butter and drenching - thinking bread next. Any ideas of how to get this in his system is welcome.

Hi Valsey,
I have been away for several days, but was thinking of you and Rocco. I am so thankful that he is better this morning. My mentor and I use Dr. Angie in Tifton: 229-382-6055 for serious issues. She has goats and is very knowledgeable. I also have used Dr. Lynn in Reidsville: 912-557-4993 or 912-557-4401 (not sure which is his house and which is home). If you’re close enough to either, you might introduce yourself. They are both very good, but don’t judge the Dr. by the front office staff!

If you can find perennial peanut hay, he might chomp down on it. It has been the first choice for my goats when they have been under the weather. Mr. Morris has it for $6/bale in Uvalda. PM me for his phone number if interested.

BEST to you two. You are an impressive goatherder!
Paul

How about mixing the AC in some kool-aid and drenching? Or make a mash of crushed up Frosted Mini Wheats with some honey to make the AC stick to it. I would still get the Vit B. I so happy is doing good this morning. You are a SuperStar!

I'm not so sure that AC upsets their stomach because if it did we wouldn't be able to give it to them daily.

Chewing his cud is great news!

Well maybe I'm drenching wrong. He chokes and gags and acts like I'm killing him.

I'm not sure what upset his stomach so badly - probably not theAC, although it is known to make you (humans) nauseas. I guess the surgery gas was the main culprit.

Thanks for the kudos, all. I didn't do anything that you all wouldn't have done too.

hmmmm...yes - something I can make a batter-type dosage ball. Very good

Mine gag and toss their head around like they are dying no matter what so as long as you squirt it slowly so that he has time to swallow I wouldn't worry about that.

How is Rocco doing tonight?

About the same...no great strides. I wasn't able to watch very closely and I didn't see him poop, although he did pee. I'm hoping today gets a little better...I'll keep you all posted.

I'm keeping you both in my thoughts :)

I just read all of these posts. Sounds like you have gotten alot of good advice.I don't know where you are located in GA but we have a serious shortage of goat savy vets here. We have a couple here(vets) that have read alot about goats and are trying to learn but they charge alot for advice you can get from reading or on this board. The best advice I have found comes from people who have had goats for awhile.Granted you may get some differing opinions;) but all in all I have learned more from reading on here than anywhere else.Good luck with your wether if you want the number to my goat vet I am in NE GA let me know.

Ditto what fishead said about sguirting it slowly so he'll swallow as your sguirting. I used a big needleless syringe when I drenched my buck. The 35 cc. kind for cattle. He didn't like it at first but the last week or so He went along with it pretty easy. He is now been well for 6 months, yipeee! and I put a little molasses on some alfafa pellets & mix the AC in with it & then I sprinkle just enough grain so he think's he's really getting something. It took me awhile to figure out what worked for my buck after he was well so I wouldn't have to drench him for the rest od his life & could still get the AC down him.
Your Rocco is still pretty critical I think & would take no chances if he were mine I would squirt it in his mouth every day for at least 3 weeks then I'd have to see how he is doing. I'm so glad he's chewing his cud, I think of you both daily. Keep us posted how he does, & I know we are all glad that any bit of our imformation any of us can give will help you & Rocco. I've also said before that this forum is GREAT! So many nice very helpful, caring people here.

Just wanted to let you know that I'm thinking about you and Rocco...any improvement?

Sorry it's taken so long to post....very busy.

Rocco is doing great. He's still quite thin and isn't chewing his cud as much as he normally does, but he's so much better!

I got a 60cc syringe with a catheter tip. I'll get the AC in him with just the tip end in his mouth to avoid all the gagging and choking and wrestling. I have found that he takes it best when mixed with molassess and applesauce.

This has been very difficult, but I think Rocco is going to make it - thanks to help from folks on this forum.

I think I've learned from this experience that goats DO NOT do well with surgery AT ALL.

Thanks to everyone again

I agree - the forums I have found offer FAR more good advice than any vet I've worked with so far.

Thanks for the offer, but I'm South of Atlanta

You should be able to find something to hide his AC on each day. I gave my wethers BOSS coated with corn oil and AC each morning for their treat. Another poster said she used alfalfa pellet coated with molasses and AC. I just bought some ground corn and oats to see if I could hide the AC in it since they run to eat the duck food whenever they get the chance.

Agreed - for the maintenance dose, I'm sure he'll eat it in some grain. But for the treatment dose....that's a lot of AC

Sooooooo Glad Rocco is on the mend. I also agree with you on the surgery part. I would never do the surgery to re-route the urinary tract, etc. like some talk about because I don't think most make it anyways after that. You have done a wonderful job pulling your Rocco through this!!