What amount alfalfa pellets=what amount of hay?

Keeperofmanya · #21 10/21/07, 09:43 AM

So Vickie or any one else. Could you help a newbie here and explain to me how I would go about switching my goats from the feed they are getting to just pellets. Right now they are getting 1/4 cup horse feed with molasses,1/4 cup barley,and a sprinkle of black oil sun flower seeds.Then I sprinkle on some kelp. They have this twice a day plus the hay mangers are always full and they waste over half of that. My goats consist of a two year old Mini Nubian buck, an 8 month old and 7 month old Nubian doelings,and 2 Sannan bucks which belong to a friend ages 8 months and 4 months and I am getting a milking doe Sannan/Nubian cross from my friend in a week which she tells me has gone way down in her milk production. The cost for alfalfa pellets here are 15 dollars a 25 kg.( almost 50 lbs I guess) and my hay cost me 3 dollars a bale and I use 4 bales of hay a week. My mare & foal feed is 17 dollars for 25 kg. Cracked Barley is 16 dollars for 40 kg. They get cattle mineral free choice also. It would be nice to be able to feed a lot simpler meal at feed time.

Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians · #22 10/21/07, 10:30 AM

Other than the sweet feed part, your diet is fine for growing kids, growing and pregnant kids (my kids are bred at 8 months to kid at 13 months) and what you are feeding is fine for milkers as they are 100 days pregnant and slowly uping that amount to about 1pound am and 1 pound pm as they start milking. Then upping or lowering the amount on the milkstand or twice aday if they nurse, tokeep them in reasonable shape. Really good alfalfa hay and the grain is minimal. Breed leader type amounts of milk the grain amounts can be much much higher. Is your $3 hay alfalfa? Most does on alfalfa hay will balk at alfalfa pellets, so I just started putting them out, and just like alfalfa hay, my pellets are fed in thebarn. Large bunker feeders line the milkroom wall, the girls put their head through thewall and eat their 3 pounds of alfalfa pellets out of these feeders I fill from my side. The milkstand here is for grain.

The first change I would make would be to turn the sweet horse feed into dry horse feed. Or if possible just good clean whole oats.

If you are feeding alfalfa hay, just put out enough pellets for the goats to eat in about 15 minutes, increase this amount every several days until they are up to about 3 pounds each. If this is grass hay than move even slower than this since your goats are not used to the protein in this new diet. I couldn't move to them eating alfalfa pellets until the last of the alfalfa hay was gone.

Honestly...if you are feeding decent alfalfa for $3 a bale, Iwouldn't move to that expensive of alfalfa pellets!

Your diet is totally inadequate in protein if this is grass hay for growing kids, and especially your bucks. Bucks not fed calcium rich alfalfa while on grain will get urinary calculi, either buy ammonium chloride and feed each buck 1 teaspoon per day mixed in that grain, or take away that grain.

Spend as much time over your loose minerals as you do thinking about grain. Especially since in this diet the only minerals they are getting is in the sweet feed.

With really good alfalfa hay you don't need to feed grain to growing kids, same with alfalfa pellets. I do grain my kids here because I want them bred and in milk by 13 months. Vicki

Keeperofmanya · #23 10/21/07, 10:50 AM

Thanks Vickie for the information. The hay I am feeding is not alfalfa hay. It is a good green second cut flat hay with a nice fresh smell. No heads or weeds or anything else in it. Hard to find a good hay they like. All about around here is timothy for horses and cattle. They refuse to even touch that. That is why I was wondering about the pelllets even though they are on the expensive side. I worry that they don't get enough roughage. We do bring them brush and stuff like that when we can get it. Thanks again for the information.

Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians · #24 10/21/07, 11:16 AM

They get plenty of roughage from hay, they can get all their roughage from alfalfa pellets. Stem length has nothing to do with roughage, nor does plants they only eat the leaves and fine stems off of and thier hay. Vicki

Wags · #25 10/24/07, 07:11 PM

Anyone have an idea how much an adult Nigerian doe should be getting in pellets? I know it would be less than a Nubian, but I can't seem to find any info on how much less.

Ann Mary · #26 10/25/07, 09:31 AM

I have been reading this thread with interest but not too much has been said about alfalfa for the boys....so, I have 3 pygmy cross wethers, 2 babies and 1 older guy....and I'm wondering how much alfalfa hay I can give them safely without worrying about those calcium problems in the bladder? Thanks!

hoofinitnorth · #27 10/25/07, 01:47 PM

Wags - at their prior owner's farm, my does were getting free choice alfie pellets that were between 8% and 12% protein (toward the lower end I think). I don't know how much they were actually eating but they never wanted for more-always some left in the pan at all times.

When I brought them over I found it took a total of about 2 pounds a day to keep pellets in front of the two all day.

Now I have alfie hay that is 20%+ protein and they are leaving the pellets alone (as expected), preferring the hay. They're eating about 3 pounds of alfie a day now, combined, with about 3 pounds of timothy and brome hay still being mixed in for the transition.

Wags · #28 10/26/07, 09:32 AM

Thanks! So about a pound per adult - that was what I was figuring. I have 1 adult and 3 little ones, so I would probably be safe figuring 2 lbs a day, since the protien is supposed to be not less than 15% in the pellets Doc was talking about, and my ladies have a pretty good sized pasture to browse in.

Ann Mary · #29 10/26/07, 10:16 AM

Anyone out there...please answer about the whethers...thanks!

hoofinitnorth · #30 10/26/07, 11:59 AM

Sorry, no experience with wethers yet, but here's a bump for you and I'll add to that - what about the bucks?

Wags - just to be clear, my 2 does are lactating NDs.

fishhead · #31 10/26/07, 12:04 PM

From what I've read the calcium/phosphorus ratio can be more than 2:1 by several times but not less. It's the phosphorus that makes the stones not the calcium.

Vicki McGaugh TX Nubians · #32 10/26/07, 04:31 PM

Exactly what fish said. Everything contains phosphrous, grain, grass hay, minerals. But nothing contains much calcium, so most bucks diets are high in phos...which is what leads to problems. My bucks eat alfalfa pellets everyday, same 3 pounds each, everyday. Grass hay in their stall is a given, and they eat in the woods, alot. They rarely touch their minerals so they are copper bolused. After rut they will go on the meat goat pellet they were grown out on as bucklings that contains ammonium chloride, until they are back to their fat and sassy selves.

Sorry I don't do wethers. Vicki

hoofinitnorth · #33 10/26/07, 10:23 PM

Interesting. In horses, the vets (back in the 1980s) always said the stones came from the EXCESS CA in the alfie hay and advocated for NOT feeding straight alfie to a HORSE. Yes, it CAN be fed to horses (and I did it for YEARS before I was able to get good grass hay for the horses) but goats are different, goats are dairy animals, and alfie is a dairy feed for many reasons.

TheBiscuitQueen · #34 10/27/07, 06:01 AM

Quote:

I'm in my second year at College getting my Agriculture Diploma, unless Goats are very different from other types of livestock, or people are making lots of money on Goats, I couldn't justify feeding 3 pounds, or free choice alfalfa pellets!!

Hey ONThorsegirl-same here! What are you planning on doing with your degree?

lonelyfarmgirl · #35 10/27/07, 07:42 PM

Are alfalfa pellets and alfalfa cubes the same thing, except in different form?

A 50# bag of pellets costs 13$, but a 50$ of cubes only costs $9.50.
I just dont think my goats could eat the cubes, too big.. so why the price difference?

hoofinitnorth · #36 10/27/07, 08:51 PM

It depends on the manufacturer but in general, cubes are long fibers and pellets are processed with binders - very, very short fibers (if any). The cost difference could be supply/demand, or it could be the cost of the added raw materials, maybe even the cost of the equipment needed to process them. Not sure.