Adding To My Power System

[sisterpine]

While it is true that solar/wind power is expensive on the front end- in a matter of years (panels last a very long time) the expense is made up in "non-paid" grid power bills. We have 4- 120 watt panels (could use a couple more) and we get by okay. But here in the far north the winter days are very short on sunlight (in new york too i imagine) and storage is our major problem. We need better batteries and are currently trying to figure out how to come up with that additional money so we can store more of what we make for use at night when most power is used at our place.

[Jim-mi]

kat........Good for you..
I really like your out look.

All to often I get "people?" who say they want a system...but then when they find out what they can, and can not do with it AND the up front cost...they back out in a hurry.
..(What do ya mean I can't use my window AC..?? )
..(..HOW MUCH..!! )

They look up at one of my wind turbines and- "I want one of them".............then when they hear about towers and the ballance of the system costs........Yup, back to paying their inflated utility bill.
By far most of these folks have no concept of being conserative ......its a shame.

[moonwolf]

katlupe, that sounds great.

How big a house do you live for that solar system?

If any way at all that I can make my house soon to become off grid, I am going to do so. I am looking at a starter system having only 2- 110w pv panels for basic needs and grow from there to include a wind generator because winters here do better for wind with short day lengths.
Heating with wood, and propane for the appliance needs.

Do you heat water with an on-demand propane heater? I am looking into that idea as well, but an outside wood heater does the trick too.

[LisaInN.Idaho]

Good for you Kat. We are off the grid on solar power and have all the luxuries of a regular home. AC power, microwave, tv, air conditioner, etc. We had 400.00 amonth electric bills in AZ and its nice not to have any now, or to lose power when the neighbors do. We built it up over 3 years and it is worth the up front expense.

[katlupe]

Presently, we are only powering our home office of 2 laptops, a scanner, a printer and 2 external modems. We do use a couple of lamps in the evenings, but not all the time. Mostly we use the kerosene lamps, but with the price of it ($2.59 a gallon today), we have started only using one lamp and a electric lamp. I have ordered a string of dc lights from Backwoods Solar, but they aren't here yet.

Then we can watch a dvd or vhs movie if we want, but haven't done that in months now. I can use a electric mixer whenever I want. But that's pretty much all for now.

We haven't decided yet about the water heating, I just can't wait to have it piped into the house! For now, we heat it on the wood or propane stove. I guess, we'll be adding more panels and a wind turbine (we always have wind here too) when we can. But the next things that seem to be important to us is getting a bigger inverter so we can run a Staber washing machine.

As for the cost of the panels, the one I just got was from Ebay and it is a 75 watt panel and was $386, which included the shipping. I bought it last Wednesday and it was here yesterday. The other one I bought from Ebay some months back was $239. including the shipping, for 55 watts. I can't remember on our first one, but that is a 50 watt one.

Our batteries are just 4 fork lift truck batteries that we get locally. About $91. for two.

[moonwolf]

Originally Posted by LisaInN.Idaho

Good for you Kat. We are off the grid on solar power and have all the luxuries of a regular home. AC power, microwave, tv, air conditioner, etc. We had 400.00 amonth electric bills in AZ and its nice not to have any now, or to lose power when the neighbors do. We built it up over 3 years and it is worth the up front expense.

wow! air concitioning, too?
Can you describe your solar system? How may watts of PV Panel array? What is your battery bank like? Do you also have a wind generator?

[patarini]

If your close to a major truckstop, check for a inverter there -- I drive, and got all of mine at half price by waiting for sales etc! I need more panels too, hope to start getting one a month or so till I am up to about 600 watts -- have about 190 right now. Good luck!

[LisaInN.Idaho]

Originally Posted by moonwolf

wow! air concitioning, too?
Can you describe your solar system? How may watts of PV Panel array? What is your battery bank like? Do you also have a wind generator?

Heres a thread where my husband describes it (BackwoodsIdaho):
Air conditioner on solar power

[rambler]

Originally Posted by Cabin Fever

I'm not too electricity literate, so forgive me if this is a dumb question. But isn't 180 watts not even enough power to run two 100 watt light bulbs? How much did your three panels cost?

I'm just amazed at how folks can live without more than 180 watts. How does one run the deep well? How does one run the septic lift pumps?

My county, 9 out of 10 septic systems for new owners are mound systems with a lift pump. And often a lift pump is required to feed the tank as well.

Shallow wells or sand points are not allowed either for drimnking water, need to tap into the deep stuff. That puts one at about 250 feet around here.

Without approval of the above 2 items, you ain't allowed to live on the property.

Then, as I farm I need to water 40 head of cattle. All natural waterways should be fenced out to protect them from erosion, so we are left pumping water for the cattle.

So, kinda leaves a person on the outside looking in. Don't know how one can make it work? How are all of you allowed to funtion, legally, without a real power source?

--->Paul

[Tango]

I'm living on 240 watts right now (2 120 w Kyocera panels feeding four 12v batteries). My power use is extremely low and a lot of time the batteries are either fully charged or above 80%. A person can live comfortably on 240 watts but without many luxuries including a/c. Propane appliances can be purchased modestly for heating and cooking and a small refrigerator can be purchased for 12v or propane. Mytravel trailer has a propane stove/oven and fridge, so I'm set for the time it takes to build my cabin.

Solar power can be intimidating to the uninitiated at first. I didn't know the first thing about it but was helped by the salespeople at backwoodssolar. I'm glad I went through them rather than try to do it on my own. My system can go four days without sun with my current power use. They said I could install it myself and I did. I can now work on the 12v wiring on my horse trailer, do maintenance on my 12v pump, troubleshoot the trailer 12 volt wiring, etc. It has been very educational. This system is expandable and it will power my barn and shed when I'm finished with it. I used to feel at the mercy of the electric company and it is quite liberating to know if the power goes, I won't even notice For me, the answer is a hybrid electric house though, not straight solar- the winters here won't supply our power needs. I'm purchasing energy star appliances and using propane for heating, cooking and hot water. There are many ways to incorporate the benefits of solar/wind or water power without relying on any one way.

[katlupe]

I would have thought that winters in Florida would still have enough sun for the system. My Backwoods Solar book shows FL only needing 15% more watts, where as NY needs 100% more. Course, this summer has been unusual for us, lots of sunny days and very little cloudy ones.

[sisterpine]

Paul: you are correct in that running an entire house, septic pumps and well pumps on 180 watts (even with several batteries full of stored power ) is pretty touchy (IMHO). We are a "very" conserving household with 4 - 120 kyocera panels and a small wind generator. I still need to start the gasoline generator for 1. running washer and dryer at same time 2. pumping from deep well. So I am thinking you would need to do the same for that sewage pump lift thing, sounds like that would draw much power. For the well pump we will eventually go with a solar slo jack system (3-4 grand) which will slowly fill our storage tanks each hour the sun is shining. there are many options and out here in montana many ranchers use solar pumps for pumping water for livestock.

[Tango]

Originally Posted by katlupe

I would have thought that winters in Florida would still have enough sun for the system. My Backwoods Solar book shows FL only needing 15% more watts, where as NY needs 100% more. Course, this summer has been unusual for us, lots of sunny days and very little cloudy ones.

FL is excellent for solar but I'm in Tennessee now Don't have experience with the winters here yet but someone told me the sun takes a hiatus for three months

[Fire-Man]

Originally Posted by moonwolf

wow! air concitioning, too?
Can you describe your solar system? How may watts of PV Panel array? What is your battery bank like? Do you also have a wind generator?

I run a AC every warm night-------Its a 5000BTU with energy saver feature(cuts the fan off when not needed). It draws about 550 watts. I ONLY cool the bedroom and keep it set on 79 degree's. If at bed time its 80 degree's or lower--I run a Fan. If 81 or higher--I turn on the AC. I do have gas-- hot water, stove, fridge, and heat, but my plans are to get or build a outside wood heater to heat the cabin and water(when I get the cabin built, staying in a 34ft camper right now.). This is my Set-Up---I have a 3/4hp water pump as well as the AC---------- I have 1500 watts of solar panels, only 4-80 watt panels are on a tracker(home-made). The tracker makes alot of difference. The other 1180 watt panels are fixed, but are built on a trailer so they are easy to move during my construction of my cabin. At this time I have two boat trailers modified--one trailer has 8- T125's batteries mounted on it, the other has 8- T105's, I rotate these in and out because my solar panels are to far away from my camper. I just switch trailers every couple of days with my golf-cart. When the cabin is finished the solar panels will be beside it(no more moving batteries) then I have a kids wagon with 4-T105's in it---it is my ""portable"" power source. I have a 1500 watt inverter I use with the wagon to run my saw and drill--just pull it where ever I need it. I have a 2500 watt inverter running the camper. I have a 3500 watt inverter for my cabin when I finish it. The cabin will be "Off Grid" one story, 3 bedrooms 2 full bath-----only two bedrooms will have a AC. The washing machine will be in a storage building(wash-house)using the 2500 watt inverter and I will also have a back-up generator if needed. I did get REAL lucky and found most of this set-up at a DEAL. I am always looking for another deal to add to this set-up. It does give you a Great feeling to be using this electricity, knowing I want have to pay a light bill at the end of the month. Sure it cost to get Set-up, but I have friends that have spent $25,000 on a bass boat to catch a fish. $35,000 on big nice trucks or Suv's , when a $15,000 vehicle would have worked---Imagine what kind of solar set-up you could buy with that kind of cash!! It's just according to what you want out of life--------I Love This Life!! Randy

[gccrook]

Can someone tell me how long, on average, the batteries last before needing to be replaced with new?

[moonwolf]

Originally Posted by gccrook

Can someone tell me how long, on average, the batteries last before needing to be replaced with new?

It really depends and people will give you numbers of years they last that almost seem incredible.
The Surrette premium batteries that are the best for off grid electical storage are supposed to last a minimum of 20 years, but you will pay more for them. The have very large sized capacity in these which you can match for your needs. If you keep them maintained properly and don't drain them down, they have the long term warranty. If you amortize the cost over the years they last, it's a value investment.
Golf cart batteries are mentioned a lot and cheap. They should last a few years but aren't meant to hold as much reserve capacity of power stored for several days as would the large type batteries. So, there is a trade off for what you might really need as to cost savings.

[patarini]

Tango -- we didnt have much power last winter for sure -- but only had one panel and 2 batteries, this winter should be better!
Rambler -- whats a septic lift pump? My septic is in the ground where it belongs! And why a deep well? I start hitting water from 6 foot down! Of course I use the creek -- and yes I do filter the water to make sure its fit to drink!

[katlupe]

Rambler: My house doesn't have indoor plumbing yet and my water is pumped from a pitcher pump from out front (not a deep well). It has a outhouse, but we use a sawdust toilet for now. It's legal though, it was built in the 1850's and has never had any wiring in it all. When we moved in 6 years ago, we only used 50 watts. We've come a long ways since then!

gccrook: our batteries are for fork lift trucks and cost about $90. for two. Two of them we have been using for over 6 years now. They aren't that expensive to replace if and when we have to. We are only using 4 right now. We have been charging them only once a week, but now we have the new panel.

patarin: One of our inverters came from the Pilot truckstop and when the Coleman inverter bites the dust that's where we'll be going to get another one. For a good price too.

Tango: I guess I thought you lived in FL for some reason. I think it's great the way you learned to do that stuff. It's good to be able to take care of yourself.

[mightybooboo]

Geez I love this stuff!
Pay now or pay later is how I see it.When retired low income,no bill.Higher income now and pay up front,makes sense to me.
BooBoo

[Jim-mi]

RE; kats mind set.
She (they) are going through the learning curve by starting small and finding out how and what a small system can do for them ........Thats great.
It would be good if more people would do that and then let their systems evolve in time..(and$$$)

Way to many want their "total electric home" comforts and have no concept of what a system that size will cost.

Yup I started with two little panels.
Now its 2k of PV and 3+k of wind.
And my well is 220vac...no problem.

Yes septic pumps are not a problem with enough $$$

Think big and start small..........Do it.